Best. Commute. Evar.

Just as TSA views any jokes that I may make about bombs, terrorism, or freedom as reasonable cause to detain or otherwise harass and interrogate me, so to will joking by TSA representatives here be construed as threats to the free movement of persons in the United States and as proposed scope creep.

Echoing that thought, more than just disdain, the culture of heavy rail commuters (at least on the Brunswick line) just wouldn't work within the rigid randomness of the TSA.

I see epithets, and borderline threats, thrown at Joe Biden and Secret Service for holding up the trains. I see Amtrak employees get ignored when their requests or directions would put an individual at risk for missing a train. I see plenty of people that would not stand for having water, let alone beer/wine/spirits, be taken away for being over a few ounces. I see plenty of people who on a daily basis make jokes about bombs and terrorism. I see plenty of people who virulently hate TSA.

And I'm one of them.

And while far fewer people are headed south on AMTRAK, Metrorail's King Street Station is next to the Alexandria, Va. train station.

Conjuring up best Bruce Willis voice... <cough> <cough> "Welcome to the party, pal!"

I don't think that anybody should stand for the nonsense that is TSA. The more people fight against it, the better off we all are. Slow down their checkpoints and bog them down. Refuse the WBI and force them to do pat-downs. Make smart remarks about them and their jobs while they're doing the pat-down. File complaints about the whole process. If you think the pat-down went too far, get an LEO and file a sexual assault charge. When TSOs start having to face the risk of getting arrested for just doing their job, maybe some folks will think twice about becoming TSOs.

DHS? Department of Homeland Security? Explain please.

In our �post 9-11� world making jokes of that type at an airport makes it not a joke but just plain stupid. If you make that kind of �joke� at an airport then you deserve �detain or otherwise harass and interrogate� to the very best of the abilities of the local authorities. �Stupidity in Public� is not currently a crime, but maybe it should be.

As for how you choose to take my jokes, well its your choice. Read the tag line, maybe you will find a clue in it.

Nope...not gonna go there, too easy.

So why does someone freely exercising their first amendment rights at a public facility deserve to be detained and beaten?

Many of TSA's representatives on this forum would seem to be happier living in a nation like China or the old Soviet Union where authority isn't questioned, and those that dare do are dealt with summarily. Is that the national vision that you and others signed up to support?

I hear all too often that so many TSOs are there to defend "God and Country" and that they're doing their "patriotic duty". TSA likes to put the good 'ol red, white, & blue behind them every chance they get. Their indoctrination seemingly gets people to believe that they're the last line between some terrorists who are "out to get us all" and a helpless, flailing public that's afraid of its own shadow. They tell their employees that screening procedures-- the one thing the agency should demonstrate competence at-- are "SSI" and not to be revealed to the public.

I'm calling bull on this. There are far too many examples of TSOs being abusive to customers, and TSOs trampling passenger rights for me to believe that the organization is patriotic and supports a free America. There are far too many screw-ups and moronic policies for me to believe that the organization is capable of keeping our country safe. And there are far too many examples of uncaring employees-- or those that just sleep on the job-- for me to believe that the organization's culture fosters a desire to serve others.

I'd like to believe otherwise; I really would. I'd like to believe that TSA cares about passenger rights, but there's no passenger bill of rights or language to show that comfort is even taken into consideration. I'd like to believe that TSA cares about security, but there's no evidence that it supports policies and procedures to make the sterile area truly secure. I'd like to believe that TSA fosters an environment of excellence, but there are far too many examples to prove otherwise.

I don't think a single person in this forum is completely against security under any circumstances. I don't think a single person in this forum is opposed to using X-rays and quick administrative searches to screen people. I don't think a single person in this forum wants to see another airliner go down. But I do think that people in this forum are tired-- they're tired of seeing their money wasted on useless people, useless technology, and moronic policies. They're tired of being harassed by people who have relatively few interpersonal relation skills. They're tired of seeing mistake after mistake, and being told that "things differ between airports" and "that's SSI"-- when TSA was established to create and maintain a standard set of policies between all airports. They're tired of the bumbling and foolishness, and can see right through it. They know the emperor has no clothes, and take issue with those who outright lie and call them "wonderful silk pajamas".

And, perhaps most of all, they're tired of the personal attacks and insults that get hurled at them every time someone claiming to be in the TSA gets backed into a corner when posting on this forum. It's ironic that only the other week some TSA'ers were calling for more civility, yet they don't act very civil themselves. Pot, meet kettle.

Is this really the TSA you envisioned when you joined? Are these really the policies that you signed up to enforce? (No hiding behind the tired, old "I'm just following orders" line. It didn't work for Hitler's followers and it won't work for Gail's followers either.) Can you really say that you're proud of what you do and who your employer is? How many people have negative reactions or couch their disgust in a joke when you tell them? Doesn't it get tiring and embarassing to have to come on these forums and defend your organization day after day after day? Obviously I'm not expecting an answer to the above questions; they're just intended as food for thought.

Ron, as a security expert I'm sure that you know what agency the TSA falls under...right? And that is the same agency that ICE falls under.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...l#post13752584

(SIGH)

Here is the post that you made (emphasis mine):

What is it about DHS that you think is unavoidable or is called voluntary? Your statement makes no sense, I am asking you to clarify.

Your answer above has nothing to do with clarification of the statement you made and in fact only serves to throw more mud into the water. Were you perhaps talking about WBI's or AIT's? Either of those acronyms would make the question a bit clearer, but you used DHS which does not. Now I could be missing something else here, and if I am I am asking you to clarify your question. Its not that difficult a request to follow, it should not require a clarification of the request to clarify. IOW, read what you wrote, it makes no sense.

OK, I'll draw you a picture.

Screenings at airports by TSA an agency that falls under the Department of Homeland Security
Screenings at bus stations by TSA an agency that falls under the Department of Homeland Security
Screenings at metro stations by TSA an agency that falls under the Department of Homeland Security
Screenings at cruise ports by TSA an agency that falls under the Department of Homeland Security
100 mile Constitution free zone enforced by Immigrations and Customs Enforcement an agency that falls under the Department of Homeland Security

The TSA has said all along that the federal government searching my belongs without warrant or probable cause is not a violation of my rights since I have a choice. I can fly or I can not fly. If I fly then I am voluntarily presenting myself for screening. But with the TSA reaching into everything laid out above I wonder how that can be the case.

So, the TSA has taken away all of my public transport options to travel to DC and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances without mandatory searches and ICE has done the same for me driving myself I ask you, how is it voluntary?

Think football. Would it be wise to provide the other team with your playbook months before the game? Would it be wise to provide them with your playbook just before the game? What would that do to your chances of winning?

�far to many�. How many? Numbers please. We know that the TSA deals with 2,000,000+ passengers every day, which is more than the population of Alaska or Wyoming and 11 other states in these 50 United States of America (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._by_population), so you might want to give a bit of scale to exactly how many of those 2,000,000+ per day you think are being abused by us. Be specific, and try not to fall into the pit where the trolls reside.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crocodile_tears

I don�t think the vast majority of the posters here understand what security it or how it is achieved. I don�t think you understand the policies you dislike so much because you have not taken the time to think about them or your stand. I believe that the vast majority of posters here are ignorant (not meant as a slight but in the actual meaning of the word) of many of the things they find irritating about the TSA because they do not understand the reasons behind it. I think the TSA has it problems, problems that can be fixed and that someone out there is trying to do just that. I think the TSA needs a leader, but I don�t think our current administration is capable of finding such a person using the same template that they have for the last two attempts.

And perhaps most of all, you miss the point that when 45,000 people are required to deal with 2,000,000+ people every day, from all walks of life, with all levels of education, with every possible belief / problem / fear / whatever under the sun, that they cannot all be treated the same. You miss the point, that everyone who boards a commercial aircraft must under-go screening. That the end requirements for that screening must be the same, even if different routes are required to get there. You miss the point that anyone, ANYONE, can be a terrorist. You miss the point, that we don�t treat you like terrorists, we treat you like someone who needs to be screened, for the safety of all the other passengers.

You also miss the point that we are also Americans, all the more so because we have chosen to serve the public, for the sake of the public.

Yes, it is, and not only am I proud of being a member I know what it means. You obviously cannot say the same.

"public transport"

Point
Game
Match

Problem is that we are both on the same side. So, you are keeping the playbook from your own team members. How well do you expect that to work?

By what score keeping method? I'll also point out that you are forced on the carriers so you can't claim property rights as being your excuse to be there.

If you have no answer, just admit it.

Um, I think that's not unique. The military doesn't hold press conferences explaining its tactics for a coming offensive. The FBI doesn't do it when it is planning to shut down a gang operation. Now, anyone can argue we are on the same "team" as the military and the FBI. But the "public" includes those very people we are targeting. Congress has oversight committees for the specific reason that there is some outside oversight. But the members of those committees also don't write home with the details of their briefings.

Very true, but the FBI does publish its rule book. An FBI Agent can't just decide to confiscate your floppy hat because they just made up a rule that floppy hats are illegal.

The Military publishes its training documents and only classifies things that actually REALLY need to be classified.

Yet, both of these agencies have successes that the TSA can only dream of.

LOL! Real knee-slapper. Keep 'em coming.