GUWonder

“Scandinavian standards + Scandinavian wages for working class would simply lead to empty airplanes and empty hotels because everything is excessively overpriced due to wages”? If so, then how is it that Scandinavian hotels can fill up and afford to fill up while providing guests included breakfasts more typically and better than US hotels? They don’t have the benefit of having management able to hide behind Chapter 11, and yet Sweden’s hotels seem to have delivered better on included breakfasts for customers in Sweden than hotel management in the US.

fassy

Well, to be honest in all fairness… breakfasts in US hotels is just a profit-maximizing rip off.

And the free breakfast in many Scandinavian chains… well… alright to satisfy the need to intake of some calories but hardly ever a great breakfast. Sure, there are some exceptions (e.g. the RB Malmö) but more often than not, the free breakfast is nothing to write home about.

GUWonder

Better on average than what the more common Hilton Diamond and Marriott Platinum+ “breakfasts” are in the US at similar level hotels.

the810

Considering that Nordic countries are among the wealthiest countries in the world, have one of the highest standard of living and, crucially, one of the happiest populations, I would say it does work.

GUWonder

Some may say it worked, but that it no longer can work like it used to work.

A response to that is that a lot of developed places are in relative decline too, including places where union participation levels and strength are extremely low in comparison.

Management gets the employees it deserves.

FlyingMoose

Ever had an a la carte breakfast with table service in a Scandinavian hotel chain? I think you have a bigger chance meeting Santa Clause. A crappy buffet is all you get and whether you want it or not you have to pay for it because its typically included in the rate (few exceptions apply).

I've had great hotel breakfasts in the US, you just pay for them which is perfectly fine. The free status stuff is worthless, hence its free.

I don't get the happiness part, super high taxes, relatively low wages for educated labor, overpriced goods and services, everything fun is illegal, sub-par infrastructure, poor public healthcare (good private healthcare but you pay for the public one whether you use/want it or not), idiotic outdated alcohol monopolies, crappy service everywhere, a post system that delivers 1 out of 5 packages and claims you're not home for the other 4. I wonder who those happiness surveys go to.

the810

And yet people in Scandinavia are satisfied with it. Perhaps the American "economy first" approach isn't the best to achieve good life? Economy is a tool, not the goal.

It's not just polls, but also how people vote in elections. These policies get overwhelming public support. It's not like Scandinavians are miserable, want their countries to change but some dictator is stopping them from doing it. Nordic countries also get a lot of immigration, proving once again that they are a good place to live.

fassy

Well, it is quite interesting what people are "satisfied" with. There is a great German movie which picks up the line "satisfied" all the time (Ödipussi). Unfortunalty it doesn't translate well und you have to be German to really understand why this movie is so fantastic as it paints a pretty good picture about "being German", as all things Loriot/von Bülow did.. Anyway, the line "so far, we were satisfied with X" shows that the people were accepting a "product" but were clearly not HAPPY (and that word is not used in the whole movie ONCE). But SATISFIED.

After my ten-something years here in Sweden, I have to say, Swedish people have perfected the concept of "accepting all the crap around you as satisfactory and never complain about anything but just say "this is fine"" in ways I never could imagine being possible.

oliver2002

Germans are never satisfied nor happy. This is fine, as it leads to rather precise engineering.

FlyingMoose

I feel that people are just telling themselves this a lot rather than actually believing it. Obviously economic success is the quickest path to happiness.

Haha, yes, I can relate! Keeping up the appearance of the country being flawless and better than anything else despite all the obvious stuff that doesn't work and has unlimited potential for improvement, I guess more rational Europeans can't pull that off!

FlyingMoose

I specifically appreciate the German way of getting upset with inefficiency.

the810

Obviously not. While money are important for happiness (if for nothing else, to satisfy basic physiological needs), they are not sufficient to make one happy - making money at the expense of psychological needs (such as good work/life ratio, enough free time, social security, education, health care..) won't make you happy. As I said, economy is a tool to achieve some of the things needed for happiness but it's not the goal itself.

Anyway, even if you are right, it's a moot time as Nordic countries are among the wealthiest in the world and have very high standard of living.

FlyingMoose

I'm sure this is what Swedeschool tells you to think.

If someone tells you that you are rich and happy but you don't feel rich and happy and you can objectively tell you're not rich and happy, are you rich and happy?

slickvik

I'm not Swedish and agree with the line of thought...

JR67

Have you even been to Sweden recently? I am an American, and I think the service here is better than in the US. It used to be crap, but nw it is above US levels. Most states have alcohol laws - the difference between Sweden and the US is that the employees at Systembolaget know what they are talking about, and the prices are higher. If it is opening hours you are worried about then you need to plan your days better. Postnord has upped its game and is doing a fine job again. On top of that, Swedes have almost unlimited sick days, 5 - 6 weeks vacation a year, free university, heavily subsidized child care. Pretty much everything in Sweden is better than the US unless you are in the highest income groups.