My recent travails with EuroBonus
Dec 7, 2014, 1:57 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2
My recent travails with EuroBonus
Hi all,
I am a new member to this forum. While browsing through the forum, I decided to share my experience with EuroBonus & SAS, which has been really unpleasant to say the least.
Please bear with me for this bit long post.
Case 1 :
-----
I had a trip a while back with Star Alliance according to the Route : Helsinki-Frankfurt-Seattle & back. ( I am a somewhat regular flier on this route).Due to the late departure of the Helsinki-Frankfurt flight , I missed my connection from Frankfurt to Seattle. Lufthansa put me on a Condor Airlines flight for that leg. While checking with the Lufthansa ground staff, they assured me that since it was an involuntary reassignment, I was entitled to the points for Frankfurt-Seattle leg and they told me to contact “Euro Bonus” for crediting the points for the Frankfurt-Seattle leg. When I called EuroBonus, they assured me that it was no big deal and I should just write an email to them explaining the details and that would take care of it. I have been writing emails to Eurobonus and they have been consistently rejecting my claims.
This is what their latest response says :
"Please kindly note that you were involuntarily re-booked, but the delay was caused by Lufthansa, not by Scandinavian Airlines. Therefore we are not responsible for the delay. It was the decision of Lufthansa to book you on non EuroBonus partner, in this case Condor Airlines.
We apologize for your inconveniences, but in this case we unfortunately cannot credit points for this particular flight."
In a nutshell, Lufthansa's decision to involuntarily rebook me on a non-Star Alliance flight has made me loose points for that route for no fault of mine.
Case 2:
-----
I flew a code share flight between Air China & Finnair. EuroBonus refuses to give any points for that flight saying the flight was operated by finnair which is not a star alliance member and hence I am not entitled to any points.
In both cases, the EB retro department always points out to the terms & conditions here : http://www.flysas.com/fi/fi/EuroBonu...ip_conditions/
Where it says :
EuroBonus members earn points in accordance with the class originally booked and paid for, regardless of upgrades or downgrades unless otherwise stated. Discount tickets of the type e.g. Industry Discount, Agent Discount, award tickets, standby tickets and charter tickets as well as certain discounts do not entitle members to earn points. No points can be earned for tickets paid, wholly or partly, with points.
If you purchase a ticket on a flight that is marketed by SAS or Star Alliance but operated by another airline (i.e. code share flight) the operating airline determines how many points you earn for your flight. The booking class on the ticket may differ from the booking class that the operating airline uses to determine points earned.
SAS is not responsible for delays or flights cancelled due to reasons beyond SAS’ control, e.g. partner companies, partner’s bankruptcy, weather etc. Special rules apply to points earned through extraordinary circumstances provided the activity has been completed.
Atleast for me if I read these, i dont understand how I can be denied from the points in both cases.
Anyway I am tired of arguing with SAS. I decided to not fly them anymore nor participate in EuroBonus anymore.
Still if people have gone through this kind of situations, any tips or ideas are welcome.
Best regards
-Kaustabh
I am a new member to this forum. While browsing through the forum, I decided to share my experience with EuroBonus & SAS, which has been really unpleasant to say the least.
Please bear with me for this bit long post.
Case 1 :
-----
I had a trip a while back with Star Alliance according to the Route : Helsinki-Frankfurt-Seattle & back. ( I am a somewhat regular flier on this route).Due to the late departure of the Helsinki-Frankfurt flight , I missed my connection from Frankfurt to Seattle. Lufthansa put me on a Condor Airlines flight for that leg. While checking with the Lufthansa ground staff, they assured me that since it was an involuntary reassignment, I was entitled to the points for Frankfurt-Seattle leg and they told me to contact “Euro Bonus” for crediting the points for the Frankfurt-Seattle leg. When I called EuroBonus, they assured me that it was no big deal and I should just write an email to them explaining the details and that would take care of it. I have been writing emails to Eurobonus and they have been consistently rejecting my claims.
This is what their latest response says :
"Please kindly note that you were involuntarily re-booked, but the delay was caused by Lufthansa, not by Scandinavian Airlines. Therefore we are not responsible for the delay. It was the decision of Lufthansa to book you on non EuroBonus partner, in this case Condor Airlines.
We apologize for your inconveniences, but in this case we unfortunately cannot credit points for this particular flight."
In a nutshell, Lufthansa's decision to involuntarily rebook me on a non-Star Alliance flight has made me loose points for that route for no fault of mine.
Case 2:
-----
I flew a code share flight between Air China & Finnair. EuroBonus refuses to give any points for that flight saying the flight was operated by finnair which is not a star alliance member and hence I am not entitled to any points.
In both cases, the EB retro department always points out to the terms & conditions here : http://www.flysas.com/fi/fi/EuroBonu...ip_conditions/
Where it says :
EuroBonus members earn points in accordance with the class originally booked and paid for, regardless of upgrades or downgrades unless otherwise stated. Discount tickets of the type e.g. Industry Discount, Agent Discount, award tickets, standby tickets and charter tickets as well as certain discounts do not entitle members to earn points. No points can be earned for tickets paid, wholly or partly, with points.
If you purchase a ticket on a flight that is marketed by SAS or Star Alliance but operated by another airline (i.e. code share flight) the operating airline determines how many points you earn for your flight. The booking class on the ticket may differ from the booking class that the operating airline uses to determine points earned.
SAS is not responsible for delays or flights cancelled due to reasons beyond SAS’ control, e.g. partner companies, partner’s bankruptcy, weather etc. Special rules apply to points earned through extraordinary circumstances provided the activity has been completed.
Atleast for me if I read these, i dont understand how I can be denied from the points in both cases.
Anyway I am tired of arguing with SAS. I decided to not fly them anymore nor participate in EuroBonus anymore.
Still if people have gone through this kind of situations, any tips or ideas are welcome.
Best regards
-Kaustabh
Dec 7, 2014, 3:20 pm
#2
Join Date: Mar 2014
Programs: *G
Posts: 463
Case 1: I think you've been informed wrong being told to contact eurobonus to be creditted wrong if it was lufthansa that rebooked you. I think you should contact lufthansa/miles and more for solving that, although it is a pickle when getting rebooked by another carrier than the one that has your FFP. If EuroBonus told you that you could just email them when LH rebooked you they have informed you wrong. From the united forum I've read that getting miles for the original booking is possible, just a bit more difficult with different FFP, not sure how difficult it is, but you should contact LH.
Case 2: In star alliance it is always the operating carrier that counts, so there is nothing EuroBonus can do here.
Case 2: In star alliance it is always the operating carrier that counts, so there is nothing EuroBonus can do here.
Dec 7, 2014, 3:25 pm
#3
Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: EBG4Life, EBD, 1MM
Posts: 1,397
Welcome to FT! Lots of unhappy people in the SAS forum at the moment due to recent devaluations. Regarding your cases:
(1) Out of curiosity, which ticket stock was the original ticket issued on? If it is on 117 stock (SAS), then I suggest that you try calling again as you should indeed receive credit for the original flights. Things become more complicated if you were on LH stock and crediting to Eurobonus. I suspect that this is the problem.
(2) Sorry to say, but codeshares are tricky situation and I am afraid to say that SAS is correct to deny your claim for points. Metals counts, and Finnair is not in *A. Quite the frustrating experience, but I can assure you that the same problem exists in other alliances. You need to be aware when booking. When in doubt, avoid codeshares as this is a common problem.
SAS is similar to other airlines in that customer service is frustrating. I would not try anything by email at this point and concentrate on contacting them by phone. Good luck getting your points on Case 1...nothing can be done in Case 2.
(1) Out of curiosity, which ticket stock was the original ticket issued on? If it is on 117 stock (SAS), then I suggest that you try calling again as you should indeed receive credit for the original flights. Things become more complicated if you were on LH stock and crediting to Eurobonus. I suspect that this is the problem.
(2) Sorry to say, but codeshares are tricky situation and I am afraid to say that SAS is correct to deny your claim for points. Metals counts, and Finnair is not in *A. Quite the frustrating experience, but I can assure you that the same problem exists in other alliances. You need to be aware when booking. When in doubt, avoid codeshares as this is a common problem.
SAS is similar to other airlines in that customer service is frustrating. I would not try anything by email at this point and concentrate on contacting them by phone. Good luck getting your points on Case 1...nothing can be done in Case 2.
Last edited by livious; Dec 8, 2014 at 12:26 am
Dec 7, 2014, 9:10 pm
#4
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: 280 from HMR DVOR
Programs: EBG
Posts: 335
Lots of unhappy people
[QUOTE=livious;23958096]Welcome to FT! Lots of unhappy people in the SAS forum at the moment due to recent devaluations. Regarding your cases:
Suggest you use whatever points you have quite soon, most of the SAS Eurobonus members only flew this airline for its points nothing else and since the points offerings are now the same with quality airlines like Swiss or LH I would suggest a lot of their members will switch and start gaining points on those.
A airline that loses its customers, especially its "more valued customers" usually disappears from the game and since SAS has already almost died once in the last few years I guess it might be ready to go under yet again.
I intend to use my points as fast as I can before they become worthless.
Suggest you use whatever points you have quite soon, most of the SAS Eurobonus members only flew this airline for its points nothing else and since the points offerings are now the same with quality airlines like Swiss or LH I would suggest a lot of their members will switch and start gaining points on those.
A airline that loses its customers, especially its "more valued customers" usually disappears from the game and since SAS has already almost died once in the last few years I guess it might be ready to go under yet again.
I intend to use my points as fast as I can before they become worthless.
Dec 7, 2014, 11:27 pm
#5
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Tokyo
Programs: JAL Metal Card (OWE), SAS Eurobonus Gold (*G), Marriott Titanium (LTP), Tokyu Hotels Platinum
Posts: 21,249
(2) Sorry to say, but codeshares are tricky situation and I am afraid to say that SAS is correct to deny your claim for points. Metals counts, and Finnair is not in *A. Quite the frustrating experience, but I can assure you that the same problem exists in all alliances. You need to be aware when booking. When in doubt, avoid codeshares as this is a common problem.
Dec 8, 2014, 12:29 am
#6
Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: EBG4Life, EBD, 1MM
Posts: 1,397
For Oneworld it is the flight number that counts, not the metal. When I connect in Thailand with a JL flight number it counts as if I was on a JL operated flight. One main difference between OW and *A. Once you know the rules there are advantages for either way of doing it, but changing alliance always causes confusion.
Perhaps the real point is that FFPs are not that easy to navigate, especially for those that aren't on FT often (as I note this was the OP's first post). As I proved, even those of us on FT still get things mixed up. Either way, you need to do some research before booking! Given all the upcoming *A program changes in 2015, it will be an interesting start to the year until we find the new soft spots in each program. In the case of SAS, perhaps we need to find the not-so-hard spots as opposed to the soft spots
Dec 8, 2014, 1:36 am
#7
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Tokyo
Programs: JAL Metal Card (OWE), SAS Eurobonus Gold (*G), Marriott Titanium (LTP), Tokyu Hotels Platinum
Posts: 21,249
Thanks for correcting me... I changed my earlier post to reflect this.
Perhaps the real point is that FFPs are not that easy to navigate, especially for those that aren't on FT often (as I note this was the OP's first post). As I proved, even those of us on FT still get things mixed up. Either way, you need to do some research before booking! Given all the upcoming *A program changes in 2015, it will be an interesting start to the year until we find the new soft spots in each program. In the case of SAS, perhaps we need to find the not-so-hard spots as opposed to the soft spots
Perhaps the real point is that FFPs are not that easy to navigate, especially for those that aren't on FT often (as I note this was the OP's first post). As I proved, even those of us on FT still get things mixed up. Either way, you need to do some research before booking! Given all the upcoming *A program changes in 2015, it will be an interesting start to the year until we find the new soft spots in each program. In the case of SAS, perhaps we need to find the not-so-hard spots as opposed to the soft spots
I think the the not-so-hard so hard spots on qualification will be SK flights in Scandinavia, or long haul *A business class flights. But let's see how the Z's develop on the latter...
Dec 8, 2014, 3:43 am
#8
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2
Hi all,
Thanks for the tips & ideas.
For case -1, I intend to keep on trying with both Lufthansa & SAS. It was a Lufthansa ticket. And I really don't see the point of denying me ,since it was not my fault that I was re-routed.
For case-2, lesson learnt. Not flying this kind of arrangement anymore. Even though the 1st time I called Eurobonus helpline, the agent told me that I should atleast get points with one of them. In this case, SAS says no points since it was a Finnair operated flight. Finnair says no points since it was a Star Alliance ticket.
BTW since I have noticed that I fly Lufthansa more than SAS, I have been thinking if it makes sense to move to miles & more from Eurobonus. Any ideas how it is ?
Moving to One World is another option, since the routes I fly are from Finland & Finnair is a good starting Airline for me .
I am not so much keen to continue with Eurobonus anymore. I have been a Eurobonus member for 14 years and this experience left a pretty bitter taste.
Thanks for the tips & ideas.
For case -1, I intend to keep on trying with both Lufthansa & SAS. It was a Lufthansa ticket. And I really don't see the point of denying me ,since it was not my fault that I was re-routed.
For case-2, lesson learnt. Not flying this kind of arrangement anymore. Even though the 1st time I called Eurobonus helpline, the agent told me that I should atleast get points with one of them. In this case, SAS says no points since it was a Finnair operated flight. Finnair says no points since it was a Star Alliance ticket.
BTW since I have noticed that I fly Lufthansa more than SAS, I have been thinking if it makes sense to move to miles & more from Eurobonus. Any ideas how it is ?
Moving to One World is another option, since the routes I fly are from Finland & Finnair is a good starting Airline for me .
I am not so much keen to continue with Eurobonus anymore. I have been a Eurobonus member for 14 years and this experience left a pretty bitter taste.
Dec 8, 2014, 8:13 am
#9
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: OSL
Programs: SK Diamond, LH SEN, KL Ivory, AY Basic, OZ silver
Posts: 1,103
BTW since I have noticed that I fly Lufthansa more than SAS, I have been thinking if it makes sense to move to miles & more from Eurobonus. Any ideas how it is ?
Moving to One World is another option, since the routes I fly are from Finland & Finnair is a good starting Airline for me .
I am not so much keen to continue with Eurobonus anymore. I have been a Eurobonus member for 14 years and this experience left a pretty bitter taste.
Moving to One World is another option, since the routes I fly are from Finland & Finnair is a good starting Airline for me .
I am not so much keen to continue with Eurobonus anymore. I have been a Eurobonus member for 14 years and this experience left a pretty bitter taste.
LH has significantly inflated its program at the very beginning of this year. As of today, you shouldn't join M&M if you fly a lot on other airlines than LH, as point earnings with almost every partner airline are horrible. Furthermore you should stay away if you mainly book 'cheap' booking classes (discounted economy and discounted business), as you will get more points on most European routes by crediting these to EB instead.
This basically leaves you with flying a *lot* on LH, OS, LX, LO, JP, SN and OU metal (not codeshares, but the real deal). M&M does not have the possibility to gain gold status by flying a number of legs and earnings on most classes are appalling. Let's just put it this way: under the current conditions I will never make it to SEN again. In the M&M forum it's frequently stated that the bonus program is nowadays only there for people who always fly on full flex business class tickets and I second that opinion. The only good thing left about the program is that you maintain your gold status for two years.
When should you join then? Well, if you credit more than 35 legs per year you'll make it to silver, which also gets you the 25% bonus miles. That eases the pain in making it to Senator, as you suddenly need 20% less flown miles. Also if you fly a lot long haul in more expensive booking classes and you have at least silver status (Frequent Traveler), you may gain quite some points. You can actually calculate how much you will earn on your trips with their mileage calculator: http://www.meilenrechner.de/earn_miles.php?language=eng or with their point earning chart: http://www.miles-and-more.com/online...en&cid=1000328
I actually just opened an account at AY. I am curious to see what they have to offer as I don't have that much experience with OneWorld's bonus programs.
Dec 8, 2014, 8:19 am
#10
Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: EBG4Life, EBD, 1MM
Posts: 1,397
I think LH would only make sense if you can reach FTL status, and even then I wouldn't do it as the miles are pretty much orphaned as (1) YQ on awards is often just as high as paying for a ticket and (2) upgrades with miles to business class is only possible on full flex tickets (Y,B). FTL will get you into a few lounges in the LH group hubs (FRA,MUC,VIE,ZRH,GVA,BRU, etc.), but it is only worthwhile if you find yourself often in these airports.
Given that both LH and SK have cut their earning tables, neither is particularly attractive unless you can reach SEN (or HON) on LH...which does not seem possible for the OP. I switched from LH to SK 4 years ago and have been much happier as I could hit EBG as opposed to FTL (note: this comment is made before the new earning tables go into effect). I stick to SAS as I can make use of the miles I earn, otherwise I would switch to OW.
Given that both LH and SK have cut their earning tables, neither is particularly attractive unless you can reach SEN (or HON) on LH...which does not seem possible for the OP. I switched from LH to SK 4 years ago and have been much happier as I could hit EBG as opposed to FTL (note: this comment is made before the new earning tables go into effect). I stick to SAS as I can make use of the miles I earn, otherwise I would switch to OW.
Last edited by livious; Dec 8, 2014 at 11:13 am
Dec 8, 2014, 8:30 am
#11
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,238
Since when? AFAIK only super cheap eco (L,T, & K) are excluded.
Dec 8, 2014, 8:39 am
#12
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: OSL
Programs: SK Diamond, LH SEN, KL Ivory, AY Basic, OZ silver
Posts: 1,103
The Y and B classes only apply to *A upgrades (for example using EB to upgrade LH flights) - that's the same alliance-wide.
One more positive thing I forgot to mention about LH is the mileage deals. They continuously have a few destinations (in business and economy) for a very reduced amount of miles. The downside is that the added costs on LH mileages trips are the highest in the whole Alliance.
One more positive thing I forgot to mention about LH is the mileage deals. They continuously have a few destinations (in business and economy) for a very reduced amount of miles. The downside is that the added costs on LH mileages trips are the highest in the whole Alliance.
Dec 8, 2014, 9:42 am
#13
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: CPH, BRU
Programs: LH SEN* (*G), EBG (*G)
Posts: 796
One more positive thing I forgot to mention about LH is the mileage deals. They continuously have a few destinations (in business and economy) for a very reduced amount of miles. The downside is that the added costs on LH mileages trips are the highest in the whole Alliance.
Like now, they have a bunch of North American destinations for 55K, a bunch of asian for 70K and some middle Eastern for 40K all to be flown in April. Takes are crazy 500 EUR, but still. Travel in Business.
Dec 8, 2014, 11:11 am
#14
Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: EBG4Life, EBD, 1MM
Posts: 1,397
Aha...has LH finally come around and added Y+
I stopped coming over to the LH forum after they enhanced Club Ren
I see that you can upgrade to Y+ from a larger set of buckets, which is an improvement (although the value did not seem particularly good). My comment was correct if trying to upgrade to C class, so I will edit my post. As others noted, the mileage bargains are a worthwhile use of miles if you book in C class.
My brain has apparently started vacation, so I best go back to lurking until mid-January when I need to start thinking again
I stopped coming over to the LH forum after they enhanced Club RenI see that you can upgrade to Y+ from a larger set of buckets, which is an improvement (although the value did not seem particularly good). My comment was correct if trying to upgrade to C class, so I will edit my post. As others noted, the mileage bargains are a worthwhile use of miles if you book in C class.
My brain has apparently started vacation, so I best go back to lurking until mid-January when I need to start thinking again
Dec 9, 2014, 2:32 am
#15
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,238
LH/OS/LX operated flights allow upgrades to C from all Y booking classes other than L/T/K. Premium Economy (E) upgrades are possible too. If you use LH version of optiontown (operated by a competitor of optiontown) you can do cash upgrades which are reissued in G/E/N.