What do you think? Bankrupt or not bankrupt
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Switzerland
Programs: AY Plat (OWE), Bonvoy Gold, ALL Silver
Posts: 3,038
What do you think? Bankrupt or not bankrupt
So the talk around town is whether SAS will go bankrupt or not.
I believe the unions have until Sunday evening (18.11.2012) and I was wondering what the general feeling is in here?
I personally believe there is too much pride and politics involved so we'll see SAS operating beyond 31 Dec 2012...
I believe the unions have until Sunday evening (18.11.2012) and I was wondering what the general feeling is in here?
I personally believe there is too much pride and politics involved so we'll see SAS operating beyond 31 Dec 2012...
#2
Join Date: Jul 2008
Programs: EBG4Life, EBD, 1MM
Posts: 1,397
I hope you are right, but I fear the worst and suspect that we will see SAS bankrupt within a year.
Maybe we should have a contest (similar to the Kingfisher thread in the Airlines of India forum) where we see who can come closest to predicting the date (or maybe time in the case it comes on Monday).
Maybe we should have a contest (similar to the Kingfisher thread in the Airlines of India forum) where we see who can come closest to predicting the date (or maybe time in the case it comes on Monday).
#3
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,188
We were planning on taking them from Amsterdam to Copenhagen next June to connect to a cruise (evening bfore the cruise, after a conference in Rotterdam). Other options out of Amsterdam not requiring an overnight (in Riga or Helsinki) much pricier, so may have to consider planniing on taking a longer train ride and flying out of Brussels on Air Brussels to get to Copenhagen.
2 hour advance check-in time for either?
2 hour advance check-in time for either?
#4
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: KSU (Kristiansund N, Norway)
Programs: SAS EBD/ *G
Posts: 2,163
I still buy a lot of SK tickets, but obviously using credit cards to protect my money in case of bankrupcy. I have trips to Sogndal (all WF, so more secure than SK itself, technically being a separate company), Narvik and Haugesund coming up the next week, and have to go by SK (or by bus to MOL to fly DY, which I don't particularly want to)
SAS has for many years suffered from too many unions blackmailing the company: one for each profession in each countries. Even though the Norwegian unions regularly strike in May every two years, the worst unions for creating havoc have been the Danish unions. The Danish pilot's unions is essentially treatening to bankrupt SAS by refusing to accept the reorganization plan. This is a strategy that have worked very well for them earlier, but my feeling this time is that their bluff will be called. I suspect that a bakrupcy would be easier to handle for the authorities than a negotiated dismantling.
In the Norwegian media and non-flyer news websites there generally is a feeling that SAS Norge would be better off on its own. SAS exists to have Norwegians pay to change planes in Copenhagen to pay Swedish directors is a common sentiment. The success of Norwegian shows that having a multi-national airline is not a necessity for giving good domestic and international connections.
So I expect the Danish pilots will force a bankrupcy, with SAS ceasing operations on Tuesday morning.
SAS has for many years suffered from too many unions blackmailing the company: one for each profession in each countries. Even though the Norwegian unions regularly strike in May every two years, the worst unions for creating havoc have been the Danish unions. The Danish pilot's unions is essentially treatening to bankrupt SAS by refusing to accept the reorganization plan. This is a strategy that have worked very well for them earlier, but my feeling this time is that their bluff will be called. I suspect that a bakrupcy would be easier to handle for the authorities than a negotiated dismantling.
In the Norwegian media and non-flyer news websites there generally is a feeling that SAS Norge would be better off on its own. SAS exists to have Norwegians pay to change planes in Copenhagen to pay Swedish directors is a common sentiment. The success of Norwegian shows that having a multi-national airline is not a necessity for giving good domestic and international connections.
So I expect the Danish pilots will force a bankrupcy, with SAS ceasing operations on Tuesday morning.
#5
Join Date: Jul 2005
Programs: AY, SK, AF/KL + randomly others
Posts: 239
We were planning on taking them from Amsterdam to Copenhagen next June to connect to a cruise (evening bfore the cruise, after a conference in Rotterdam). Other options out of Amsterdam not requiring an overnight (in Riga or Helsinki) much pricier, so may have to consider planniing on taking a longer train ride and flying out of Brussels on Air Brussels to get to Copenhagen.
And the train trip to BRU s not that long from Rotterdam. About two hours to the airport.
#6
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: KSU (Kristiansund N, Norway)
Programs: SAS EBD/ *G
Posts: 2,163
We were planning on taking them from Amsterdam to Copenhagen next June to connect to a cruise (evening bfore the cruise, after a conference in Rotterdam). Other options out of Amsterdam not requiring an overnight (in Riga or Helsinki) much pricier, so may have to consider planniing on taking a longer train ride and flying out of Brussels on Air Brussels to get to Copenhagen.
2 hour advance check-in time for either?
2 hour advance check-in time for either?
#7
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: DCA
Programs: TK*G OZ*G AA Plat
Posts: 627
I have a ticket booked in February for TLL-CPH-LHR on OV and SK. I guess that makes me quite a risk-taker since both carriers have had talks of bankruptcy lately.
I booked with my credit card, and the total ticket cost was $170, so I'm not too concerned.
As for SK going bankrupt, I wish I knew more about the business culture in the three governments that control SK. To me, it's really hard to predict the outcome.
I booked with my credit card, and the total ticket cost was $170, so I'm not too concerned.
As for SK going bankrupt, I wish I knew more about the business culture in the three governments that control SK. To me, it's really hard to predict the outcome.
#8
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Koala Lemur
Programs: SK EBD LTG (*G)
Posts: 2,447
I actually believe that it is very hard to predict outcome.
Also for those who live there. "Uncontrolled" airline bunkrupcies in Scandinavia last several years have been a part of the reality. We have seen Cimber going down, earlier Sterling going down. Earlier there was FlyMe and I am sure I forgot a few others. We all know that bunkrupcy is clearly a possibilty. Also governments have very different attitute towards state owned businesses than a few years ago. DSB, for instance, regularly needs to face tough and non-obvious negotiations with their owner. SAS is certainly less dear to the Danish government heart than DSB.
On the other hand SAS is SAS .... :P
Also for those who live there. "Uncontrolled" airline bunkrupcies in Scandinavia last several years have been a part of the reality. We have seen Cimber going down, earlier Sterling going down. Earlier there was FlyMe and I am sure I forgot a few others. We all know that bunkrupcy is clearly a possibilty. Also governments have very different attitute towards state owned businesses than a few years ago. DSB, for instance, regularly needs to face tough and non-obvious negotiations with their owner. SAS is certainly less dear to the Danish government heart than DSB.
On the other hand SAS is SAS .... :P
#10
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: KSU (Kristiansund N, Norway)
Programs: SAS EBD/ *G
Posts: 2,163
If you want a update go to
www.thelocal.se Swedish news in English .. It doesn't look good
www.thelocal.se Swedish news in English .. It doesn't look good
#11
Join Date: Nov 2004
Programs: EB*G, BT VIP
Posts: 770
by the way on a connected subject
Do you think Estonian Air will go bankrupt if SK goes under? ARN/CPH/OSL is their main operation and a cash cow, most other destinations are loss makers and those 3 routes are living on SK codeshare and connections. Fair to say there are plenty of OD pax to OSL, less to ARN and by far less to CPH.
Given a very shaky state of OV today, when Government openly said there are only two options: cash injection (already applied to EU for clearance) or bankruptcy, it could be a determination factor, don't you think so?
Do you think Estonian Air will go bankrupt if SK goes under? ARN/CPH/OSL is their main operation and a cash cow, most other destinations are loss makers and those 3 routes are living on SK codeshare and connections. Fair to say there are plenty of OD pax to OSL, less to ARN and by far less to CPH.
Given a very shaky state of OV today, when Government openly said there are only two options: cash injection (already applied to EU for clearance) or bankruptcy, it could be a determination factor, don't you think so?
#12
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: PUF (past: IAH, TRD)
Programs: KLM Gold
Posts: 67
Latest news is that 1 of the 8 unions now actually have signed a deal.
Being a Scandinavian myself I have a feeling that SAS will be seen in the air also in 2013, however I won't expect miracles in terms of the long term situation for the airline.
Being a Scandinavian myself I have a feeling that SAS will be seen in the air also in 2013, however I won't expect miracles in terms of the long term situation for the airline.
#13
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Helsinki
Programs: A3 Gold, BA Silver
Posts: 1,014
by the way on a connected subject
Do you think Estonian Air will go bankrupt if SK goes under? ARN/CPH/OSL is their main operation and a cash cow, most other destinations are loss makers and those 3 routes are living on SK codeshare and connections. Fair to say there are plenty of OD pax to OSL, less to ARN and by far less to CPH.
Given a very shaky state of OV today, when Government openly said there are only two options: cash injection (already applied to EU for clearance) or bankruptcy, it could be a determination factor, don't you think so?
Do you think Estonian Air will go bankrupt if SK goes under? ARN/CPH/OSL is their main operation and a cash cow, most other destinations are loss makers and those 3 routes are living on SK codeshare and connections. Fair to say there are plenty of OD pax to OSL, less to ARN and by far less to CPH.
Given a very shaky state of OV today, when Government openly said there are only two options: cash injection (already applied to EU for clearance) or bankruptcy, it could be a determination factor, don't you think so?
#15
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: PUF (past: IAH, TRD)
Programs: KLM Gold
Posts: 67