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New Earning Table (esp Partner Airlines)
The company's financial troubles have hit the Qantas Frequent Flyer program, with a set of devaluations from 1 July.
Mileage earning on normal fares (aka "deep discount economy" in Qantas terminology) is down by about 30%. SC's earnt on partner flights to/from Australia (Cathay, LAN etc) appear to be down by about half. |
New Earning Table (esp Partner Airlines)
I see that QF have effectively halved on partner airline earnings where they compete with QF. E.g. Australia-UK on QF in F is 420, 210 on non-QF.
Rather interesting change. It has no effect on me at all (as I only credit QF and JQ flights to QF), but for those of you crediting partner flights to QF the effects could be quite substantial, if flying on competing routes. I see that non-competing routes haven't really changed. Do you think QF believe that the SCs/Points earning on partner airlines will change consumer behaviour without accompanying lowering of the fares on QF? |
The latest "enhancement" - clearly aimed at "enhancing" the volume of business going to Virgin Australia.
Will no one rid me of this troublesome Irishman? |
Following on from DL.
the laughable part is the headline says "... simpler ... fairer " hilariously WRONG from the following pages of tables, confusing stuff to non airline geeks (eg: classes), exceptions to flights, partners.. oh my God there's nothing simpler about it at all.. though I do note from my 10 minute reading that SC earning, at least in higher classes (eg: biz, first) seems to be maintained for the discount levels (eg D, I) on domestic/int gives same SC as current, but the higher ones (D,J) give a little bonus, which makes sense and seems "fair" to me. I also note closing of the ASA "loophole" people were using. Makes sense from a company/revenue point of view. The rest of it is no real surprise, despite how complex it is. oy!! It's very much like the Delta model... it was only a matter of time. |
Almost doubling the number of booking class categorise, and changing the earning table to two pages is classed as "more simplified program"?
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The changes to QFF/JQ earn are here in this colossal crackpot chart:
http://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/...hanges-to-earn And the partner-earning devaluations are listed here http://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/...rtner-airlines Perhaps signalling the last days of a tragic QF management, crackpot announcements, unsustainably complicated, a whiff of desperation, reminds me of the days leading up to the Ansett demise |
All this announcement has done is give me a headache. Used to be a very simple calculation on how to retain status, now all too hard.
Certainly no incentive from a SC point of view to fly PE on a partner airline. Also good to see the zero points or credit recognition for PER residents to SIN set in stone. Afterall, why would anyone in perth want to visit Singapore on our national carrier? However thought this was a good idea needs to explain it to me! |
It's a big downgrade. I think it's 360 SCs earned for QF one-way in F from UK to "East Coast Australia". So just under a halving for partners on 210.
In J, it's from 240 to 140. The only real thing keeping me in QF is the prospect of Lifetime Gold. As I live in London, these changes will increase my incentive to fly QF rather than CX, but there's a limit on how much I value SCs. Return J fares in QF are about £1000 more expensive on QF and I'm not sure an extra 160 SCs are worth it. I'm relieved short-haul BA flights won't be changed too much, but it's very annoying that LHR-AMS falls under the new 250 mile limit. So 20 SCs for J instead of 40. I will fly in J less on BA because of this. I also fly to Doha every now and then for work and flying through Dubai would be ridiculous, but QF is still slashing the SCs earned for a LHR-DOH flight on QR. I like QF, but has been testing my loyalty a lot with all the changes it has made since I moved to London 8 years ago. |
I'm glad I'm not the only one to call "bulltish" on this "simpler" call..
oy, vey |
Originally Posted by da.....L
(Post 22596381)
The only real thing keeping me in QF is the prospect of Lifetime Gold.
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Originally Posted by RichardMEL
(Post 22596365)
the laughable part is the headline says "... simpler ... fairer "
And as for fairer, maybe to Qantas, I suppose, because they are now giving people less for flying with competitors - but not for us or their OW competitors (not that I expect them to be, but still). |
Seems to me AA flights in the US booked in P class will still earn "First" SC's.... I thought that one would be sorted out. Or am I misreading the infodump?
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Click here to join the AA frequent flyer program
http://www.americanairlines.com.au/i...false&from=Nav https://www.aa.com/AAdvantage/quickE...utmk=137033907 I wonder why this link was not in the QF email |
Originally Posted by Mwenenzi
(Post 22596462)
Click here to join the AA frequent flyer program
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Here's hoping BAEC starts offering a Status Match.
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Originally Posted by SQ421
(Post 22596525)
Here's hoping BAEC starts offering a Status Match.
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Originally Posted by nux
(Post 22596411)
Remember it is the lifetime of the current Qantas FF program..
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Originally Posted by Kremmen
(Post 22596506)
While that is an option, it's not very useful for discount economy, at 25-50% of flown miles. Better off joining Alaska's MileagePlan which credits 100% on all economy classes.
I'm now very glad indeed that I stopped crediting to QF when I got to lifetime Silver. I couldn't have foreseen (or even dreamed) any of this, but I fear that the things that drove me away from QF are also driving this. Incidentally, is it permissible under OW rules to have differential status earn on a route depending on which airline is being "flown"? I'm not familiar enough with schemes that count flown miles (and applicable multiples) for status rather than having a separate status/tier counter. |
Originally Posted by SQ421
(Post 22596525)
Here's hoping BAEC starts offering a Status Match.
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Originally Posted by Kremmen
(Post 22596506)
While that is an option, it's not very useful for discount economy, at 25-50% of flown miles. Better off joining Alaska's MileagePlan which credits 100% on all economy classes.
I have not credited a QF flight to QF ffp in the last 5 years, except for some low priced tickets, that at the time, were non earning on AA |
Originally Posted by Globaliser
(Post 22596543)
Incidentally, is it permissible under OW rules to have differential status earn on a route depending on which airline is being "flown"? I'm not familiar enough with schemes that count flown miles (and applicable multiples) for status rather than having a separate status/tier counter.
Mileage earn can be different depending on marketing carrier for the same route and booking class. Elite mileage earn on the likes of AAdvantage and other programs differs based on marketing carrier also. |
I just compared the SC earn from the trip I took last year (DAS13+DONE3+5 extra short flights [in L and N] total 31 sectors) and what I can muddle out of the new tables.
CBR-SYD-NRT,HND-HKG-JFK-BOS-JFK-SFO-ORD-RDU-ORD-CLE,DTW-ORD-MIA-BCN-HEL-ARN-HEL-LHR-DXB-LHR-PVG-KUL-SIN-HND-ITM,KIX-TPE-HKG-KUL-SIN-BNE-CBR QF CBR-NRT, DXB-LHR, SIN-CBR CX HND-JFK, KIX-KUL AA JFK-BCN AY BCN-LHR BA LHR-DXB, LHR-PVG MH PVG-KUL, KUL-SIN(x2) JL SIN-ITM 2440 (old) vs 1880 (new) |
Originally Posted by da.....L
(Post 22596381)
I also fly to Doha every now and then for work and flying through Dubai would be ridiculous, but QF is still slashing the SCs earned for a LHR-DOH flight on QR.
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Originally Posted by DH188
(Post 22596547)
Can't even join BAEC with an Australian address.
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I suspect like most on this forum, I'm still trying to get my head around the considerable detail contained in these 'enhancements'. Neither Simple nor Fair from my perspective, but I digress.
Curiously, there seems to be no mention of points earn rates on partner airlines. They've announced new SC earn rates on partner flights, and new points earn rates for QF and JQ flights, but I would have also expected a 'simplification' of mileage earn on partner airlines, unless I've missed something? |
Letter from QF
For those who have not received the letter from QF:
Originally Posted by QF
Dear Traveloguy, We know how important it is for you to be rewarded when you fly. It's also important that the reward should reflect the value of your fare. So, we're making changes to how you earn in the air. It's all about creating a fairer, more simplified program, designed to align the number of Qantas Points1 and Status credits2 you earn more closely with the fare you pay, where you fly and the airline you choose. Effective for travel from 1 July 2014, the number of Qantas Points and Status credits you earn will change when you fly with Qantas and Jetstar Airlines. Put simply, these changes will mean that you'll earn more Qantas Points and Status credits when you choose more flexible fares. At the same time, we're reducing the Qantas Points you'll earn on our lower fares to reflect your spend. While we're making changes in the air, rest assured this does not affect your current points balance, or the way you earn with our broad range of partners on the ground. And, when it's time to redeem, there's no change to the number of points you need for a Classic Award3 or how you use your points for your chosen reward.4 Our commitment is to offer you the most comprehensive, rewarding loyalty program in Australia, wherever your journey takes you. As these and other changes, including Status credit earn with other partner airlines, may affect you, we suggest you take a look at all the details, available on qantas.com Yours sincerely, The Qantas Frequent Flyer Team |
The SC earn rate on partner airline flights between Australia and Southeast Asia has been halved. Looks like my upcoming BA flights in April will be the last to earn at the existing rate. What a bummer. :(
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Originally Posted by eminere
(Post 22596629)
The SC earn rate on partner airline flights between Australia and Southeast Asia has been halved. Looks like my upcoming BA flights in April will be the last to earn at the existing rate. What a bummer. :(
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Originally Posted by Dave Noble
(Post 22596637)
Credit BA to AA. Full earning on AA plus much better value redemption rates
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Overall, it appears to me that if your travelling is predominantly on non-QF/JQ carriers, you will be better of crediting to another programme if you are keen on status.
It appears that changes to points earnings on partner airlines are still to be announced, based on the comments on the partner airlines SC earnings page: The way you earn Qantas Points on partner airline flights will transition to the same regional framework as the table above. Please ensure Your Profile is up to date so that we can keep you informed of these changes. |
Originally Posted by eminere
(Post 22596629)
The SC earn rate on partner airline flights between Australia and Southeast Asia has been halved. Looks like my upcoming BA flights in April will be the last to earn at the existing rate. What a bummer. :(
What's more bizarre is it means someone travelling PER-HKG on CX will earn more SCs for a shorter flight than someone travelling SYD-HKG on CX on the same fare basis. |
The whole change seems ill thought out, although I'm even more annoyed at their choice of language.
At the end of the day, I've stopped crediting to QFF so this is in reality unlikely to affect me, although it would have been nice to continue to take advantage of a MASA which also have been terminated. |
Originally Posted by LTN Phobia
(Post 22596676)
Overall, it appears to me that if your travelling is predominantly on non-QF/JQ carriers, you will be better of crediting to another programme if you are keen on status.
It appears that changes to points earnings on partner airlines are still to be announced, based on the comments on the partner airlines SC earnings page: I can't find any references to SC/points earnings on EK. Partner Airlines only refers to OW carriers, plus Fiji Airways. I probably have paid insufficient attention to it, but can you see anything? |
Another step closer to QF withdrawing from OW.
More to the point, it shows QF has given up on competing with partners such as CX on HKG-SYD. QF know they have a substandard product and just can't figure out how to meet the competition. |
Originally Posted by og
(Post 22596758)
Another step closer to QF withdrawing from OW.
For those of you reading this thread who are affected by the changes, do make sure you write into QF and state your dissatisfaction. I would also encourage those who are able to sign up to AA, CX or BA's programmes and credit to those instead should you still need to fly QF domestically. |
Originally Posted by LTN Phobia
(Post 22596676)
I can't find any references to SC/points earnings on EK. Partner Airlines only refers to OW carriers, plus Fiji Airways. I probably have paid insufficient attention to it, but can you see anything?
Points earn for all other carriers including EK to follow. |
Originally Posted by Traveloguy
(Post 22596783)
My feeling too. It really is a death of 1000 cuts though.
For those of you reading this thread who are affected by the changes, do make sure you write into QF and state your dissatisfaction. I would also encourage those who are able to sign up to AA, CX or BA's programmes and credit to those instead should you still need to fly QF domestically. |
Oh man.
Needs to evaluate my stuff. seems to me that partner flights originating or terminating from Asia isn't affected. |
Originally Posted by Dave Noble
(Post 22596802)
Or better still, don't support Qantas. If Qantas was to lose money due to the change then it may figure it made a mistake. If all that happens is that some people whine about it but continue to fly on Qantas, then those deciding on the changes will likely be quite happy
Life is definitely greener on the other side. |
So should one assume that DFW is now on the West coast of the USA?
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