A Completely Different Screening Experience
 

I was screened yesterday at TLV and at EWR. TVL was wonderful. There were two people working the screening position. One sat behind the monitor and the other came forward to help me. Smiling, very polite. No shouting. Helped me arrange my items. I didn't have to take out my Kippie bag nor my camera. Just my laptop. Helped me put it in a bin. I took off my vest (loaded with electronics) and he put it in a bin for me.

At EWR, completely different experience. A woman TSO yelled at me because I wasn't moving my bins along as I unpacked all the junk: Kippie bag, laptop, camera, vest, jacket, shoes, and loaded my carryon bag and backpack. I told people behind me to go around me. I was trying to take up as little space as possible at the end of the table because I need about five bins. She just stood there, yelling at me. I ignored her basically because if I had moved my stuff along as I unpacked (a difficult task) I would have arrived at the screening machine without all my stuff in its proper position. How much does it take to have a little care and courtesy? Obviously more than TSA is willing to expend.

It is as simple as a mindset. When I was manager of a field office for a nonprofit, I taught my employees basic skills: smile, listen, help. TSA's approach seems to be indimidate, yell, don't listen, and for heaven's sake, don't help. This is why Americans who fly hate TSA.

It's also as simple as training and hiring. TLV is wonderful. TSA? Not so much.

Having said that, I have a thread in here somewhere about my experience at TLV. The people were polite, professional and friendly. And logical. But you need to get to the airport so early for screening that travel is difficult for an entirely different reason.

What we need is TLV attitude and USA timing. It's not impossible, but the TSA needs to increase its hiring and training standards.

Mike

You state that the first part of your experience with the TSA was pleasant and helpful, an overall enjoyable experience as far as that kind of experience can be, and the second part as completely unpleasant. Yet the in commentary at the end of your post you lump both experiences into the same bag and complain about the whole thing as if they were both the same way. Was it your intent to ignore the difference between the two experiences and focus on only the second as the total sum of your screening experience, or was this an oversight, a part of the human condition that is honestly difficult to put to the side and not allow to color one’s perception?

I appreciate that half of your time at the checkpoint was not negative, but to ignore that and place the focus on the other half and make the commentary you did is less than fair, to the readers here, to the TSA, and to those who were helpful and pleasant.

The first part of my post was about an experience NOT with TSA but at Tel Aviv (TLV). TLV is not run by TSA. Read the post and you will understand what I was saying.

;)

TSAron: Try reading the post BEFORE commenting.

Wow, twice in two days. Yesterday it was LHR, today TLV. In your immortal words:
Oh, now I see what TSORon was focusing on. In the second sentence of the OP's initial post, he stated: "TVL was wonderful." I am sure that TSORon was picking up on that being Lake Tahoe (of course the other instances in this thread have been overwhelmingly "TLV.")

You'll have to forgive Ron. He's too busy pointing out others' spelling mistakes to actually read the substance of the posts he's commenting on. ;)

TLV did what is expected from security and EWR didn't. Flew through Helsinki and Schiphol and the security experience was quite pleasant. At Schiphol a member of the aircrew asked if I was hurrying to the flight to Spain. A quick "no, but thank you anyway," and a smile was quite pleasant.

At Schiphol and Helsinki the thing I noticed the most was how quiet the airport was when they don't have droning messages over the PA system. Nice.

Why can't our security measures be respectful of both people and their belongings when other countries (some with a much higher rate of both foreign and domestic terrorism) manage to pull it off?

TSARon may think TSA runs the world, luckily it is not the case and in other countries security can be done in a logical and professional manner, not what TSA moronic approach is.

They're just so nice at Tel Aviv. The attitude is always, "We want to do everything we can to keep you safe, and to make sure that you like it here enough to come back."

They laughed at me earlier this year when I started to take off my jacket. "We can tell who is American," they joked.

My sister was recently there with her toddler, and they did everything possible to make life easier for her.

Their goal is to keep everyone safe; intimidation and rules are not part of their mission.

TLV? That must be Tiny Little Vermont. :p

You will also have to forgive a person with a USA Centric Only view of the world and no desire to learn about the other parts of the aviation industry which he is connected to. Who sees no need and has no desire to learn airport codes of major destinations, even though it would help him in his job and prevent "D'oh" level statements on FT. ;)

Quote from the Snooker Cue thread in TSS: "So, I'm now required to memorize the 3 letter codes for all 9495 airports around the world? You first, and let me know how that goes." said one "TSORon".

$6.8 billion last year spent by TSA and what do we get? Federalized and Professionalized as promised? Or TSARobbed.

I am bumping this, hoping that TSORon might apologize for his "less than fair" response to my posting. Of course, I don't expect one.

Don't you know that TSORon never responds when others point out that the statements he made were wrong, even when the other reps of the TSA whom most of us respect point out that he is wrong? I wonder what it's like in TSORon world? I don't think it's a happy place.

And you believe that you will never get that kind of experience here in the USA. Hmmm, how sad for you.

http://www.tsa.gov/press/releases/20...ease_0571.shtm

And I see this report every year, which is always far more positive than negative. Sure, we have areas we can improve, and we work on those daily, its an ongoing process.

TSA partners with most foreign governments to help maintain security in the air. Israeli as well as Russian.

I have a question for you though. If you by had had a knife in your pocket, just how friendly do you think those Israeli screeners would have been?

Gee doob, what makes you think I was wrong in my statement? Reading issues? Comprehension?

Ergo, you will not admit your egregious fault, nor apologise (that is the English spelling of the word, before you post some inane spelling retort). Typical. Your attempt at redirecting the discussion will not work.

Why do you have such a hard time addressing direct questions and posts addressed to you? Not only in this thread either; I have addressed several direct questions to you that have been ignored and I have worked with your feckless agency and seen much of your SOP, so my questions are not “out there” nor are the ones posted to you above.

We eagerly await your response!

Ciao,
FH

Perhaps reading comprehension of your own posts? ;) What is so hard about admitting that on two occasions in a span of just two days you made the same mistake about the TSA being directly involved with screening at first LHR and now TLV?

I recognize it thanks. I spent 4 wonderful years over there at the behest of the United States Air Force, and with the permission of her Majesty’s government. Quite the interesting place.

I don’t. I do tend to ignore the more ignorant questions posted, those who answer the questions for themselves or who’s questions I have answered before, but I don’t think it’s a problem.

Feckless? The experience is what you make of it. Its based on your choice, not ours.

That linkage is to a TSA press release that’s over 4 years old.

Ronnie, here's a grammar lesson:

Who's is a contraction of "who is" or "who has"; whose is the possessive form of "who."

The term "feckless" can also be applied to individuals. ;)

And further, it's generated by the TSA itself and we all know how the TSA loves to tout what a fantastic job it is doing to keep us safe.

So all that blaterskite typed with nothing actually said, wow, but the short answer is: you do not have the capability to answer the questions nor admit fault. I see. That is about what I expected, a weak, 7th grade L-D debate style answer where you cannot admit fault, but hopelessly post in other threads that you demand satisfaction when none is due. Typical..., that is why your are where you are now. "Nuff said"

That pretty much answers my question about your character.
I would love to see your examples of questions you view as unacceptable, since all were addressed to the topic at hand, and directly quoted one of your respones. You just want "softballs"?

We eagerly await your mea culpa for yet another mistake in this thread. We shan't hold our breath.

Ciao,
FH

1. I was pointing out the difference between the experience in TLV (that's in Israel) and in EWR (that's in the US). That was my experience. And yes, it is sad for me and for every person who travels in the US. It would be less sad if what I experienced in TLV were common in the US. After your response, though, I understand why it won't change for the better anytime soon.

2. So, TSA partners with foreign governments. How does that improve my experience of going through security?

3. As for the knife in my pocket, this is certainly the favorite tactic of those who have lost an argument: divert attention from the issue at hand, try to drive the discussion to another, unrelated issue. The question is irrelevant to my experience with security in other countries and with the TSA.

And if I don't reply, it's because I'm going out of the country again tomorrow morning.

A lot more sensible than the TSA, that's for sure.

Mike

The survey said that 80-85% of passengers surveyed "had confidence" in TSA. I'll bet anything that 80-85% correlates with the percentage of casual fliers -- the ones who have the, "anything for safety and security," mindset, who neither understand the pointlessness of TSA procedures, nor have any basis of comparison with how other countries conduct security (this thread is about Israel, I've previously contrasted TSA with their counterparts in China).

Of course, TSORon has never responded to any of the factual points that I have raised, preferring instead to say, "Obviously I can never change your mind."

I don't know what you mean by, "partners." I can tell you this: security in China has absolutely nothing to do with TSA. Unlike TSA, it is conducted by professional LEOs, who are professional, polite, helpful, efficient and effective.

I wouldn't know. I don't have knives in my pocket when I go through security screening, though I'm still often treated rudely and like a criminal suspect when it's TSA doing the screening.

Let me ask you a question: How many terrorists has TSA caught? I'm not talking about people with pot, illegal aliens, someone who had a trophy shaped like a rifle, or any similar nonsense. I'm talking about an honest-to-god, dyed-in-the-wool, Allah akbar-shouting fanatic bent on causing injury, death and destruction to as many people as possible.

So, how many has TSA caught?

Ron (or maybe bart, the two are sort of joined at the uniform, in my mind) answered that question not too long ago. Something about their job was to deter terrorists, not catch them. You know, the 20 layers of security thing. Make airport security so confusing that nobody can get through it with their composure intact. If you do, you are suspect.:rolleyes:

From Leslie Stahl's 60 Minutes segment on TSA (specifically referencing BDO's):

She missed a good opportunity for a question just as telling. “How many terrorists, once they had seen the TSA in action, have walked away and not even tried?”

It's hubris to think that it has been more than one.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: lol. the answer is zero. if someone wants to bring down an aircraft you can bet your a*s that the tsa is powerless to stop them. what a friggin joke......

It doesn't. It's the reason there are extra security checks before flights to the US but of course you already know this. You also know those extra checks are completely unnecessary because in most countries airport security is much, much more efficient* than in the US. The exception is LHR and I haven't tried Africa yet so some of these countries could be just as bad as USA. Since the Americans never trust them foreigners this has been the case since long before TSA but I seriously doubt it's gotten better recently...

*I'm talking about what happens at the actual checkpoint. Some airports have long lines and are confusing but that's beside the point.

That's for sure & tsoron proves it every time he posts.

If you believe the answer is greater than zero, then they've walked away because, as they see TSA in action, they realize their job here is done.

Americans pay $7B every year for a circus - just look at the unnecessary sideshow over whether "shoes out of bins" is mandatory or not as one small example of the Keystone Kops approach to security. Americans are constantly reminded to be suspicious of anyone who's a little bit "different" and to watch what their neighbors are doing. They bleat about "anything is okay as long as there's not another 9/11". :rolleyes:

The purpose of terrorism is not to fly aircraft into buildings. That's one of the means, not the end. The purpose of terrorism is to make people live in fear, to break down a sense of community, to eliminate freedom, to drain governments of money that could be going to far better things. Any of that sound familiar?

Well, that's quite a good point. After all, I always put on my elephant repellent before leaving the house each morning and, since I've started doing it, I have not seen one single elephant near me. Clearly my elephant repellent is equally as effective as TSA.

Can you interest you in the asteroid chaser in the trunk of my car? I guarantee you that you won't have any trouble with asteroids if you buy it.

How good is your guarantee? If I do get killed by an asteroid, will you call it a fluke and then sign my survivors up for a more expensive version of your asteroid chaser? That's the MO I expect from TSA.

In the event the world is destroyed by an asteroid, you'll get my sincere apologies, while I look for someone else to blame. Just like TSA.

Postmortem, I presume?

You expected a logical response? ;)

Hmmm, logical... I'll get back to you on that....;)