Denied check-in/boarding because of incorrect entry requirements
Mar 5, 2009, 12:28 pm
#16
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ORD / DUB / LHR
Programs: UA 1K MM; BA Silver; Marriott Plat
Posts: 8,243
They exist. On entry to TXL last Saturday, I handed border drone #1 my passport opened to p. 16, the first page with free space. The drone dutifully flipped through each page looking for an earlier spot.
On departure from TXL Tuesday, I handed border drone #2 my passport, and said "page 16" when she started flipping through the pages. Drone #2 continued flipping through the pages until she reached ... page 16.
Neither drone said a peep to me. I need to return to TXL after I get a supplement added & almost full.
On departure from TXL Tuesday, I handed border drone #2 my passport, and said "page 16" when she started flipping through the pages. Drone #2 continued flipping through the pages until she reached ... page 16.
Neither drone said a peep to me. I need to return to TXL after I get a supplement added & almost full.
Mar 5, 2009, 2:08 pm
#17
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Exile
Posts: 15,656
Not quite denied checkin but almost had our entire crew denied entry at Johannesburg when the immigration officer decided to ask us for our return tickets. No amount of explaining by the captain that he didn't need a ticket because he would be flying the plane out convinced her. Finally a manager was summoned and he deigned to let us through.
I always find it hilarious when airline staff in places like London and Amsterdam try to interpret visa requirements for countries in sub-Saharan Africa. In most places a valid passport, a positive attitude and a wallet size picture of Benjamin Franklin is sufficient to arrange "visa-on-arrival"
I always find it hilarious when airline staff in places like London and Amsterdam try to interpret visa requirements for countries in sub-Saharan Africa. In most places a valid passport, a positive attitude and a wallet size picture of Benjamin Franklin is sufficient to arrange "visa-on-arrival"
Mar 5, 2009, 2:29 pm
#18
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: IAD, DCA, SAN
Programs: UA 1K, Hertz PC, AMEX PLAT
Posts: 1,236
Not quite denied checkin but almost had our entire crew denied entry at Johannesburg when the immigration officer decided to ask us for our return tickets. No amount of explaining by the captain that he didn't need a ticket because he would be flying the plane out convinced her. Finally a manager was summoned and he deigned to let us through.
I always find it hilarious when airline staff in places like London and Amsterdam try to interpret visa requirements for countries in sub-Saharan Africa. In most places a valid passport, a positive attitude and a wallet size picture of Benjamin Franklin is sufficient to arrange "visa-on-arrival"
I always find it hilarious when airline staff in places like London and Amsterdam try to interpret visa requirements for countries in sub-Saharan Africa. In most places a valid passport, a positive attitude and a wallet size picture of Benjamin Franklin is sufficient to arrange "visa-on-arrival"
Mar 7, 2009, 11:54 am
#19
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 280
that is extreme! i love it.
what kind of proof of living and working did you present if i may ask?
sadly france is not a country with punitive damages in civil lawsuits. imagine if that happened to you in the usa. could make an interesting lawsuit and finance many future trips.
does english law know punitive damages?
al
what kind of proof of living and working did you present if i may ask?
sadly france is not a country with punitive damages in civil lawsuits. imagine if that happened to you in the usa. could make an interesting lawsuit and finance many future trips.
does english law know punitive damages?
al
I was almost refused boarding at LHR by AirFrance once as I was checking in for LHR-CDG-RUN. I'm a British passport holder and RUN is a French Island in the Indian Ocean (on which I also happen to live!). It is part of France and has exactly the same immigration laws as France if you are a European passport holder. Unfortunately for me, Air France's internal computer system kept sending the check in assistant a warning that I had to have a valid visa in my passport in order to travel there. It was only after huge discussions with the groundstaff at LHR and proof of my living and working on the island for the past 3 years that I was allowed to board. The most annoying thing in this situation was that the airline was substituting its own ideas on immigration over the official rules and just flat out refused to believe anything I was saying.
Mar 7, 2009, 11:58 am
#20
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 280
interesting. do you think if you signed the passport (by mistake or to make sure you don't get problems with foreign immigration agencies) the canadians would give you grief?
al
al
A child's Canadian passport is required to remain unsigned. The signature line says something like 'signature not required.' In fact, if a child's Canadian passport is signed it's made unvalid. Last October my wife, 7-month old daughter and I were flying from RSW in Florida home to Vancouver. However, the check-in clerk refused to check us in because our 6-month old child's passport was unsigned.
We tried to explain that Canadian child's passports remain unsigned, but she would have nothing for it, claiming she'd 'been to a course and knew the facts' and that she'd 'pay a huge fine if she let us through'.
Finally we convinced her to phone head office, which she did, only to discover we were correct. Even then she told us we'd be turned away at security. We weren't of course.
We now have the relevant explanatory pages from the Passport Canada web site printed and folded up inside our daughter's passport.
We tried to explain that Canadian child's passports remain unsigned, but she would have nothing for it, claiming she'd 'been to a course and knew the facts' and that she'd 'pay a huge fine if she let us through'.
Finally we convinced her to phone head office, which she did, only to discover we were correct. Even then she told us we'd be turned away at security. We weren't of course.
We now have the relevant explanatory pages from the Passport Canada web site printed and folded up inside our daughter's passport.
Mar 7, 2009, 12:07 pm
#21
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 280
timatic won't help
this actually reminds me of another story that i believe exemplifies the absurd situations that the airlines can sometimes find themselves in with the requirement to make sure the passengers are admissible in the country of destination.
flying from ord to nrt i was queuing to check in at the ana counter. in front of me stood a few south americans i believe, perhaps brazilians or so. they seemed to have come from there and were flying on to tokyo. the only agents at the check-in counters were 2 americans. apparently one of the guys had a japanese (work) visa in his passport that (i presume) was expired but had been extended by a piece of paper or stamp or something like this, which was obviously only written in japanese. the other guys had similar docs. they only spoke their own language and basic japanese. the americans spoke... english.
this delayed the progress of the queue for quite a while until a japanese agent was tracked down who quickly looked at it all and deemed it to be "ok". although to what extent japanese check-in agents will be familiar with their country's work permit/visa etc. paperwork and possible fakes AND brazilian (or whatever) passports and possible fakes is also an open question.
al
flying from ord to nrt i was queuing to check in at the ana counter. in front of me stood a few south americans i believe, perhaps brazilians or so. they seemed to have come from there and were flying on to tokyo. the only agents at the check-in counters were 2 americans. apparently one of the guys had a japanese (work) visa in his passport that (i presume) was expired but had been extended by a piece of paper or stamp or something like this, which was obviously only written in japanese. the other guys had similar docs. they only spoke their own language and basic japanese. the americans spoke... english.
this delayed the progress of the queue for quite a while until a japanese agent was tracked down who quickly looked at it all and deemed it to be "ok". although to what extent japanese check-in agents will be familiar with their country's work permit/visa etc. paperwork and possible fakes AND brazilian (or whatever) passports and possible fakes is also an open question.
al
Mar 7, 2009, 12:22 pm
#22
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,639
A child's Canadian passport is required to remain unsigned. The signature line says something like 'signature not required.' In fact, if a child's Canadian passport is signed it's made unvalid. Last October my wife, 7-month old daughter and I were flying from RSW in Florida home to Vancouver. However, the check-in clerk refused to check us in because our 6-month old child's passport was unsigned.
We tried to explain that Canadian child's passports remain unsigned, but she would have nothing for it, claiming she'd 'been to a course and knew the facts' and that she'd 'pay a huge fine if she let us through'.
Finally we convinced her to phone head office, which she did, only to discover we were correct. Even then she told us we'd be turned away at security. We weren't of course.
We now have the relevant explanatory pages from the Passport Canada web site printed and folded up inside our daughter's passport.
We tried to explain that Canadian child's passports remain unsigned, but she would have nothing for it, claiming she'd 'been to a course and knew the facts' and that she'd 'pay a huge fine if she let us through'.
Finally we convinced her to phone head office, which she did, only to discover we were correct. Even then she told us we'd be turned away at security. We weren't of course.
We now have the relevant explanatory pages from the Passport Canada web site printed and folded up inside our daughter's passport.
But then, government and common sense are mutually exclusive.
Mar 7, 2009, 10:00 pm
#23
Join Date: Jul 2007
Programs: QFF
Posts: 5,304
I almost had a problem last year. I was at check in for an F9 flight DEN-YVR. The agent asked where my visa to enter Canada was. I said that as an Australian citizen, I did not need a visa to enter a commonwealth country (and several non commonwealth counties for that matter). She shock her head, and disappeared into a back room with my passport. When she came back a few minutes later she had a stunned look and gave me my boarding pass without saying anything else.
Mar 8, 2009, 2:09 pm
#24
Moderator, Hilton Honors
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: on a short leash
Programs: some
Posts: 71,422
Due to entry requirements I've been denied boarding once with two other attempts by airline to deny boarding (different times).
The time I was denied it hinged on interpretation of wording. Airline at my origina airport interpreted in a way I would have entry but at the transfer point interpreted that I wouldn't have entry. This same airline has been known to allow pax to fly who sign a waiver of indemnity (basically a form accepting you'll pay any and all costs if denied entry - these can be huge).
One time I was almost denied was due to error by gate agent - entered wrong country code for my passport. Easily corrected when I showed a printout from timatec.
The other time I was almost denied (actually I had already boarded and they were trying to kick me off the aircraft) the airline agreed to reroute me (from ADD-KRT-LHR to ADD-FRA-LHR with ADD-KRT-FRA being same flight).
I use timatec to check entry requirements (link) - I keep a link on my blog for easy access. I also use a visa specialist company to double check.
The time I was denied it hinged on interpretation of wording. Airline at my origina airport interpreted in a way I would have entry but at the transfer point interpreted that I wouldn't have entry. This same airline has been known to allow pax to fly who sign a waiver of indemnity (basically a form accepting you'll pay any and all costs if denied entry - these can be huge).
One time I was almost denied was due to error by gate agent - entered wrong country code for my passport. Easily corrected when I showed a printout from timatec.
The other time I was almost denied (actually I had already boarded and they were trying to kick me off the aircraft) the airline agreed to reroute me (from ADD-KRT-LHR to ADD-FRA-LHR with ADD-KRT-FRA being same flight).
I use timatec to check entry requirements (link) - I keep a link on my blog for easy access. I also use a visa specialist company to double check.
Mar 8, 2009, 3:33 pm
#25
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 280
hiya,
would it be indiscrete to ask for more details regarding this instance?
al
would it be indiscrete to ask for more details regarding this instance?
al
The time I was denied it hinged on interpretation of wording. Airline at my origina airport interpreted in a way I would have entry but at the transfer point interpreted that I wouldn't have entry. This same airline has been known to allow pax to fly who sign a waiver of indemnity (basically a form accepting you'll pay any and all costs if denied entry - these can be huge).
Mar 8, 2009, 5:46 pm
#26
Moderator, Hilton Honors
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: on a short leash
Programs: some
Posts: 71,422
I was travelling A to B to C to D (all transits). At A the airline checked requirements for C and decided I was okay. The same airline at B refused to carry me to C.
I wasn't given an option of signing a waiver, but I know others flying the same airline who have been (in similar circumstances).
I wasn't given an option of signing a waiver, but I know others flying the same airline who have been (in similar circumstances).
Mar 8, 2009, 7:48 pm
#27
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 280
oh i was hoping you could tell us which countres A, B and C were and what the point of contention concerning C's entry requirements for you was... no worries though.
al
al
I was travelling A to B to C to D (all transits). At A the airline checked requirements for C and decided I was okay. The same airline at B refused to carry me to C.
I wasn't given an option of signing a waiver, but I know others flying the same airline who have been (in similar circumstances).
I wasn't given an option of signing a waiver, but I know others flying the same airline who have been (in similar circumstances).
Mar 9, 2009, 2:17 pm
#29
Join Date: Jun 2005
Programs: UA 1K , AK, DL, TG
Posts: 161
I have had problems getting on flights into Indonesia - as they require an onward or outbound ticket - - both from check in and from inbound immigration - - my question of "do they not sell airplane tickets in Indonesia?" sometimes works - - carry an old (13 years now) CGK-RUH ticket with me for people will not move off that point . . . guess an onward ticket does not need to be a valid ticket
keeping a ticket alive and readable that long has been a challenge
keeping a ticket alive and readable that long has been a challenge
Mar 9, 2009, 3:42 pm
#30
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Programs: United MileagePlus Silver, Nexus, Global Entry
Posts: 8,798
What I consider 'odd' would be requiring a signature in an 8 month old's passport. She can't sign, and it doesn't make sense for a parent to sign because what if the other parent is traveling with her?
Furthermore, why is it the job of the airline to enforce passport signature rules anyway? If I haven't signed my passport I could just scribble in there. Presto, there's your signature. I can see the airline requiring that the photo matches and it hasn't expired, but after that...?