I got the 2nd screening.....

It's a sad part of American History - one I do not want to see repeated, but sadly we're on a slippery slope again.

How many prisoners in GITMO have had a trial yet? I'm sure some of the folks at GITMO are the scum of the earth and violent criminals wanting to cause the US harm, but I do believe they have the right to a fair trial, or at least the benefit of a tribunal.

I believe in the god given rights that are provided to us as part of the US Constitution. Sadly, some administrations get away with violating the constitution. History shows it has happened in the past, and sadly its happening again.

Hopefully things will change after 2008....

SDF_Traveler

Let's not forget the folks that blow up abortion clinics too. While I'm against abortion, bombing the clinics is just wrong and is an act of terrorism.

Gitmo is a sad case in and of itself, Red cross and Amnesty estimates say that over 90% of the people held there never had anything to do with Al Queda in any capacity and consist mostly of people who were acused by their neighbours in Afghanistan so the neighbour could steal his farmland or people turned in by people that didnt like them and who made up stories in order to claim cash payments the US was handing out for information about Al Queda members etcetera.

When Ashcroft was asked about the 14 year old kids that were detained at Gitmo he said they were extremely dangerous, had killed before and would kill again.
Almost all minors since he said that have quietly been freed and send back to Afghanistan without aving been charged with anything ever.

Dark pages in a dark book, history will be just as critical of the current period in US history as it has been over the salem witch hunts and the Communist hunts of the 50s.

And you are aware that some of the terrorists got secondary screenings but were permitted to board. That's because they didn't carry on anything that wasn't prohibited.

The appeasement is working in reverse. Fascism is starting to rise in this country because we appease the government every time it asks to take away more freedoms to keep us safe.

At least my understanding of most elected bodies, it's not a winner take all system like we have in the US. If a party gets 2% of the vote, it gets 2% of the seats. So even if 60% of the populating didn't vote for Hezbollah, but 40% did (for the sake of the argument), Hezbollah still got seats despite the fact that the majority of the country didn't want them there.

While I generally agree with that sentiment, wasn't just recently that we were getting criticized for staying out of the Israeli/Lebanese conflict?

Not really, the critiscism stems more from the blanket support israel enjoys from the US no matter what Israel does and the financial and millitary support Israel gets from the US.
Just check the history of UN security counsil veto's or the amount of weapons Israel gets free of charge and the amount of US hi tech weapons they received.
Despite that the US never condems any action by israel and gives them blanket support for everything they do so you cant say the US is not involved.

I'll go one up on you. If somone gets to screening, then law enforcement has failed. If they've made it that far, my bet is that they can make it past screening.


_m

No, but that dosent mean that islamists haven't used truck bombs before.

To the person who said somthing along the lines of "that was 10 years ago", I'd like them to check the date on the link above. There doesn't seem to be an expiration limit on schmucks.

_m

I agree GITMO is a sad case. Problem with GITMO is I don't know who to believe with respect to who is being held there.

There are different groups saying different things. When someone is arrested in the US, it becomes a subject of public record. You can find out who is being held and why; they're also given a fair and speedy trial.

Everything about GITMO is kept secret. Kids have no place at GITMO for starters -- as for the others, who are they and what are they accused of? Why are they being held?

What disgusts me even more is they've been sitting there for years with no trial, no arrangnment --- nothing. I would like to think there are some real criminals there wanting cause the US harm and they're being held for a good reason, but I don't know that it is true. If they were prisoners of war, I got news, the War in Afganistan is over. There has been a new govt in Afganistan for awhile and they should have been released.

This "Enemy Combantant" classification is what really bothers me. They're being held on Cuban soil leased by the US for a naval base -- a no mans land, so to speak when it comes to law.

It's time they get fair trials.

To get back on topic, as far as 2nd screenings I flew this past Sat out of ORD. It was a last minute ticket purchased at the airport. I got marked a selectee and had to go through the full drill.

I saw the TSA at a couple of gates doing searches, but not at all gates (would be impossible at ORD). After boarding my aircraft, about 10 pax had coffees / sodas purchased at ORD -- they were all ordered to deplane to dispose of the beverages prior to our pushback. The whole thing was silly. It was a 50 minute flight, we did get a beverage service and an announcement was made "Per TSA regulations, beverages served on-board cannot be removed from the aircraft" Who's bright idea was that?

At the security checkpoint, one of the other selectees was a senior citizen. I witnessed orthropedic inserts removed from his shoes because there were gel components. He couldn't walk without being in pain with the inserts gone. He finally had to get wheelchair assistance thanks to the TSA.

I plan on calling my congresscritters again on Tuesday -- some of what I saw really outraged me. We shouldn't be treating senior citizens like this. This great ban on beverages, esp beverages purchased in the sterile area is a joke.

SDF_Traveler

Like I said, sad times we live in.
Flying has become even more of a hassle and in Gitmo hundreds have quietly been released after spending years locked up without any charges having been filed against them ever.

I doubt we are safer flying today then we were a decade ago(internationaly anyway, i never felt really safe flying in the US before 9/11, I paradoxically felt safer AFTER 9/11) but it has become such a hassle and a pain in the butt.

To me, it's all smoke and mirrors. We're not any safer now than before 9/11, US domestic or International. There will always be risk -- all these new TSA measures do are hassle people.

The only benefit I see is the screening of checked luggage, but until cargo is screened there's still a big open hole in the system.

At the checkpoints we need to drop the shoe carnival and focus more on ETD screening -- I'm all for use of the puffer. Have been through the GE Entry Scan a couple of times.

Internationally, not much has changed. Same ICTS interviews, same routines on US carriers. Only difference now are some smoke and mirrors policies such as "no congregating" and now the liquid/gel ban.

If anything, it is the international flights where we really need cargo screened. The widebodies (747/767/777/A330/A340s) are capable of carrying a lot of cargo in addition to passenger luggage vs an MD-80 on a domestic flight.

Most people don't realize this, but in addition to your luggage, you're sitting on top of a lot of cargo... and the cargo is all unscreened. Even on turbo-props, especially into smaller communities (i.e. Horizon Air) you're flying with unscreened cargo on-board -- some of it even belonging to UPS, FedEx, and DHL.

Ever see the UPS driver or DHL driver pull up to the baggage claim to get their goods? I once met a UPS driver at an airport to get a delayed UPS Red Next Day Air package. Let's say the driver was surprised to see me, but I knew the commercial flight my package was on (through common sense & process of elimination) and I met the UPS driver at the airport as I needed it urgently. The UPS stuff was all shrink wrapped into a few loads, came down the belt just like the other luggage, and I was able to point out my package to the driver. The driver got his signature pad, scanned the package and allowed me to sign for it as delivered (after showing ID) at the baggage claim.

SDF_Traveler

I always assumed cargo did get rudimentary screening ever since that controversial El Al incident in Amsterdam

So do I. The problem is defining "us." Many, many people believe that God gave these rights only to American citizens, resident aliens and maybe, just maybe, non-resident aliens who have managed to land on U.S. soil. The other 6 billion or so people were overlooked. (Maybe God was busy that day? It takes time to give people rights!)

This nation of cowards and idiots is not the country in which I grew up 40 or 50 years ago. I cannot recognize it.

Bruce

Basically, no. The government relies on "known shippers," instead. A portion of cargo gets examined, but not very much.

Bruce