New Screening Procedures?
Nov 18, 2004 | 2:51 pm
#16
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 456
Originally Posted by Pat89339
While I wholly agree with you, this is wrong wrong wrong wrong. I am a female and had this happen to me. The screener patted all the way down the zipper to the crotch and when I instructed the screener to use the back of her hand, she forcefully told me "this is not a sensitive area, I do not have to use the back of my hand." While it may not be a sensitive area on her body, it certainly is on mine. She said she needed to clear the alarm the handheld made when it passed over my zipper.
While you don't see how there can be any waffle room, it happens anyway. What do you suggest we do or say when this occurs? Is there a specific non SSI rule to quote?
While you don't see how there can be any waffle room, it happens anyway. What do you suggest we do or say when this occurs? Is there a specific non SSI rule to quote?
Nov 18, 2004 | 3:00 pm
#18
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: LAX; AA EXP, MM; HH Gold
Posts: 31,789
Originally Posted by myrgirl
I honest to goodness don't know. If she doesn't think the crotch is a sensitive area, then what the heck is? Maybe we can find something online that states what can and can not be touched during a wanding/pat-down, but I imagine that's already been tried.
Pat-down, Other Screening Enhancements Must be Carried Out Appropriately
The Transportation Security Administration (TSA) is committed to constantly reviewing screening procedures to ensure our measures are targeted to counter potential threats.
On Sept. 22, TSA made changes to passenger screening procedures to strengthen our ability to detect explosives at the security checkpoints. One significant enhancement, which has generated discussion and concerns among some passengers, involves more frequent use of pat-down searches. We take each situation seriously and TSA has procedures in place to address any and all concerns.
In addition, TSA screeners are trained to conduct the inspections in a professional, respectful manner, while maintaining our high level of security. Here is more information on the new procedures:
To better allow TSA to identify explosives, the agency implemented new passenger screening procedures that, in addition to expanded use of pat-down searches, increase the use of explosives trace detector machines and provide screeners more latitude to refer individuals for additional screening.
The changes are in line with a recent recommendation of the 9/11 Commission Report that all passengers selected for additional screening be checked for explosives.
Additional screening, including pat-down searches, may be required of passengers based on visual observations by screeners, even if an audible alarm has not gone off.
Screeners are also required to communicate their actions to the passenger prior to conducting the inspection.
Federal Security Directors are responsible for ensuring at the local level that screeners are properly trained in the new protocols. TSA Headquarters is also closely involved in ensuring that such training has taken place. In addition, the training regimen is available to screeners on TSAs Online Learning Center.
TSA policy is that screeners are to use the back of the hand when screening sensitive body areas, which include the breasts (females only), genitals, and buttocks.
For non-sensitive areas, including other parts of the torso, screeners are required to use the front of the hand.
Screeners are required to offer private screening to passengers who are subject to additional screening. If you are not offered private screening you have the option to request a private screening location.
Screeners of the same gender as the passenger will conduct the additional screening (except in extraordinary circumstances).
The Transportation Security Administration (TSA) is committed to constantly reviewing screening procedures to ensure our measures are targeted to counter potential threats.
On Sept. 22, TSA made changes to passenger screening procedures to strengthen our ability to detect explosives at the security checkpoints. One significant enhancement, which has generated discussion and concerns among some passengers, involves more frequent use of pat-down searches. We take each situation seriously and TSA has procedures in place to address any and all concerns.
In addition, TSA screeners are trained to conduct the inspections in a professional, respectful manner, while maintaining our high level of security. Here is more information on the new procedures:
To better allow TSA to identify explosives, the agency implemented new passenger screening procedures that, in addition to expanded use of pat-down searches, increase the use of explosives trace detector machines and provide screeners more latitude to refer individuals for additional screening.
The changes are in line with a recent recommendation of the 9/11 Commission Report that all passengers selected for additional screening be checked for explosives.
Additional screening, including pat-down searches, may be required of passengers based on visual observations by screeners, even if an audible alarm has not gone off.
Screeners are also required to communicate their actions to the passenger prior to conducting the inspection.
Federal Security Directors are responsible for ensuring at the local level that screeners are properly trained in the new protocols. TSA Headquarters is also closely involved in ensuring that such training has taken place. In addition, the training regimen is available to screeners on TSAs Online Learning Center.
TSA policy is that screeners are to use the back of the hand when screening sensitive body areas, which include the breasts (females only), genitals, and buttocks.
For non-sensitive areas, including other parts of the torso, screeners are required to use the front of the hand.
Screeners are required to offer private screening to passengers who are subject to additional screening. If you are not offered private screening you have the option to request a private screening location.
Screeners of the same gender as the passenger will conduct the additional screening (except in extraordinary circumstances).
The bolded bullet point makes clear that the agency contemplates the "zipper" area to be patted down, albeit with the back of the hand instead of the palm (as if that makes any real difference to the victim . . . uh, I mean passenger).
Now, if you and/or your colleagues are refusing to touch passengers' genitals, then ^ ^ to you.
That would make you a freedom fighter.
But sadly, I suspect your superiors just aren't following the published policies to the letter.
The policies should prohibit the touching of genitals, but I'm guessing it requires it, instead.
Nov 19, 2004 | 5:20 am
#19
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 456
Originally Posted by FWAAA
The bolded bullet point makes clear that the agency contemplates the "zipper" area to be patted down, albeit with the back of the hand instead of the palm (as if that makes any real difference to the victim . . . uh, I mean passenger).
Now, if you and/or your colleagues are refusing to touch passengers' genitals, then ^ ^ to you.
That would make you a freedom fighter.
But sadly, I suspect your superiors just aren't following the published policies to the letter.
The policies should prohibit the touching of genitals, but I'm guessing it requires it, instead.
Now, if you and/or your colleagues are refusing to touch passengers' genitals, then ^ ^ to you.
That would make you a freedom fighter.
But sadly, I suspect your superiors just aren't following the published policies to the letter.
The policies should prohibit the touching of genitals, but I'm guessing it requires it, instead.
Nov 19, 2004 | 9:17 am
#20
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Louisville, KY, US
Programs: QF Plat - OW EMD | DL Gold / Starwood Gold
Posts: 6,106
Originally Posted by myrgirl
I guess the only thing I can say about the quote from the website is that there's a lot more to the genital area than what's below the zipper. It is possible to effectively screen what is considered the genital area without touching the zipper itself and the body part underneath it. I suppose on some men that wouldn't be any help based on their, um, anatomy? The thing that concerns me more than anything is why is the zipper alarming? I've wanded a lot of women and I don't think I've ever had a zipper alarm. Plenty of buttons, snaps, and clasps but not the zipper itself.
It couldn't be the button on my slacks being that it is not metal. I wasn't wearing jeans that day either as I went from the office to the airport, which is my typical routine for evening departures. I normally wear a pair of slacks/khaki type slacks when traveling. No peicings or anything out of the ordinary that would cause an alarm in that area (or any other area).
I have a feeling it could be how this screener was trained -- or alternatively he was making things difficult for me because of my vebal exchanges with him, other screeners and the checkpoint supervisor.
Best,
SDF_Traveler
P.S: To TSA Screeners:
I appreciate your contributions, Mygirl, TSAMGR, eyecue, turner, and others. It's great having you on the board and I value your opinions and contributions. When frusterated with an agency such as the TSA, it's easy to say things on the board which may seem personal to you. I don't believe in personal attacks, as they don't acomplish anything, but I know I've used words in the past such as "shoe nazi, etc". If I ever say such a thing, it isn't directed towards any of you personally.
Our views may differ, but I want you to know I have the utmost respect for you. I understand you're here on your own time and that says a lot, considering the frustrations and the overall dislike many of us, including me, have for the agency as a whole and it's policies from the higher ups.
I'm sure your positions are not easy and I also believe all of you have the best of intentions. I believe you all had good intentions when you made the decision to join the TSA and still do. In conclusion, I am posting this because I feel some of you are frustrated here with some of the posts you see on a daily basis; I just want to take a minute and say thank you - I believe your presense is valuable here and I, for one, appreciate your input and opinions as individuals.
Last edited by SDF_Traveler; Nov 19, 2004 at 9:20 am
Nov 19, 2004 | 10:05 am
#21
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Colorado
Programs: TSA
Posts: 2,745
hmmm
The round wands that are Garrett superwands, have a tendency to produce extreme sensitivity afterwhile. I have written to Garrett about this and got no good response. The issue with these wands appears after they have been dropped. I wont go into why. If a zipper is alarming then the wand is too close to it.
Nov 21, 2004 | 8:32 am
#22
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alabama
Posts: 400
Perhaps if the TSA website rephrased the area and stated "groin area" instead of "genitals", it would make more sense. Most screeners do not make contact with genitals, but have to conduct patdowns near them. This area requires the use of the back of their hand. I know it dowsn't solve anything, but it may clarify a bit.
Nov 21, 2004 | 9:48 am
#23
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 1,673
Originally Posted by eyecue
The round wands that are Garrett superwands, have a tendency to produce extreme sensitivity afterwhile. I have written to Garrett about this and got no good response. The issue with these wands appears after they have been dropped. I wont go into why. If a zipper is alarming then the wand is too close to it.
Nov 22, 2004 | 12:53 pm
#24
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 1,722
Well here is the answer, at least in my experience.
Nothing
At both ORD and LGA this weekend, absolutely nothing was different. I was able to go through without removing my shoes and without getting felt-up. I still had to hold my BP when going through the WTMD at LGA, but they have been doing that since the summer. With any luck, my flights later this week will also be as easy and painless.
Part of this "success" could be attributed to that fact that I have started "sizing up" screeners these days. Before joining a line, I look at the screeners at the WTMD to see if anyone is overly aggressive. When I see a hardcore screener, I avoid that line, and I look for a line with a screener who seems to be more in tune with reality. Obviously, this only works at some airports.
Nothing
At both ORD and LGA this weekend, absolutely nothing was different. I was able to go through without removing my shoes and without getting felt-up. I still had to hold my BP when going through the WTMD at LGA, but they have been doing that since the summer. With any luck, my flights later this week will also be as easy and painless.
Part of this "success" could be attributed to that fact that I have started "sizing up" screeners these days. Before joining a line, I look at the screeners at the WTMD to see if anyone is overly aggressive. When I see a hardcore screener, I avoid that line, and I look for a line with a screener who seems to be more in tune with reality. Obviously, this only works at some airports.