What would YOU do?
#1
Original Poster
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, In Memoriam




Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Yiron, Israel
Programs: Bates Motel Plat
Posts: 69,201
What would YOU do?
FlyerTalk is loaded with posts calling for the abolishment of the TSA and getting rid of air marshalls. One person even suggested that Al Qaeda disappeared with the Taliban (I doubt he would find much agreement in Madrid, Jordan, Saudi Arabia or Pakistan) so there is no longer a need for security.
Assuming that most of us don't agree that all danger is past, I would like to know what YOU would do if you could establish the security procedures at airports and on airplanes.
Having asked that question, I will start the ball rolling with my own answers:
1. I would keep cockpit doors locked before the first passenger boards and kept locked throughout the flight. I would not arm pilots because I don't want them tempted, in case of an emergency, to open the cockpit in order to handle the situation.
2. I would keep armed air marshalls. In fact, I would put them on all flights. However, I would arrange that they boarded together with everyone else, did not take particular seats, and kept their appearance as inconspicuous as possible.
3. I would get rid of the pointy object search. With the cockpit doors locked a knife is no more dangerous in the air than it is anywhere else. Guns and explosives, of course, would still be forbidden.
4. I would make certain that each time a piece of checked luggage is opened, the passenger is present. This can be done as it is at FLL (where you stand near the checker as it is x-rayed) or as it is at Frankfurt (where they call you and escort you to your bag if it seems suspicious). I think the FLL system is much better and would lead to less delays.
5. I would stop the wanding, except where an alarm has gone off when someone passed through the metal detector.
(I am talking about the US. A tiny country, like Israel, can also make profiling and questioning extremely effective, but I doubt it would work well in a much larger country.)
Assuming that most of us don't agree that all danger is past, I would like to know what YOU would do if you could establish the security procedures at airports and on airplanes.
Having asked that question, I will start the ball rolling with my own answers:
1. I would keep cockpit doors locked before the first passenger boards and kept locked throughout the flight. I would not arm pilots because I don't want them tempted, in case of an emergency, to open the cockpit in order to handle the situation.
2. I would keep armed air marshalls. In fact, I would put them on all flights. However, I would arrange that they boarded together with everyone else, did not take particular seats, and kept their appearance as inconspicuous as possible.
3. I would get rid of the pointy object search. With the cockpit doors locked a knife is no more dangerous in the air than it is anywhere else. Guns and explosives, of course, would still be forbidden.
4. I would make certain that each time a piece of checked luggage is opened, the passenger is present. This can be done as it is at FLL (where you stand near the checker as it is x-rayed) or as it is at Frankfurt (where they call you and escort you to your bag if it seems suspicious). I think the FLL system is much better and would lead to less delays.
5. I would stop the wanding, except where an alarm has gone off when someone passed through the metal detector.
(I am talking about the US. A tiny country, like Israel, can also make profiling and questioning extremely effective, but I doubt it would work well in a much larger country.)
Last edited by Dovster; May 4, 2004 at 2:56 am
#2
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Greenfield, NH
Programs: US Airways Chairman's Preferred, NWA Gold, Marriott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,199
I'd hire dogs and have them sniffing around. They'e infinitely more effective than Trained Shoe Analysts at finding contraband where ever it may be hidden -- dogs know that shoes aren't the only place where interesting things can be found.
I'd lenghten the rollers leading into and out of the bag check machines. Aside from the shoe shuffle the major source of delays that I see at screening is that the whole process of getting your bags up and onto those tables, filling the bins and then moving them along (and navigating around the piles of bins...) is a cluster-puck.
I'd have the TSA start paying attention to the rest of the airport. As tempting a target as the screening machines, and baggage belts may be I think that there are other areas that they should be guarding. Why, for instance, isn't there a requirement that there be a TSA person greeting every catering worker and checking ID when they load the pretzels? (Of course that's another thing that dogs would do a better job of but I digress...)
I'd drop the boarding pass requirement. Let anyone who wants to put up with it go through the checkpoint.
I'd lenghten the rollers leading into and out of the bag check machines. Aside from the shoe shuffle the major source of delays that I see at screening is that the whole process of getting your bags up and onto those tables, filling the bins and then moving them along (and navigating around the piles of bins...) is a cluster-puck.
I'd have the TSA start paying attention to the rest of the airport. As tempting a target as the screening machines, and baggage belts may be I think that there are other areas that they should be guarding. Why, for instance, isn't there a requirement that there be a TSA person greeting every catering worker and checking ID when they load the pretzels? (Of course that's another thing that dogs would do a better job of but I digress...)
I'd drop the boarding pass requirement. Let anyone who wants to put up with it go through the checkpoint.
#4
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M




Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 58,133
Agree with all except #2. Air marshals increase the chance of an incident occuring by bringing a weapon on board. And several of these yahoos have demonstrated that they cannot take care of their weapon, or that their only response to even the mildest of "situations" is to draw their weapons. Also, they steal premium class seats, thereby stealing revenue from the airlines and depriving passengers of these seats.
I would trade every air marshal in for a device that does a chemical check on an entire person with no x-rays or strip searching. Several devices exist and could be implemented today, were the leaders of the TSA not criminally incompetent fools.
I also agree with public access to airside.
Before you folks go electing Dovster, remember, I've been espousing these ideas since black day when the TSA was created.
I would trade every air marshal in for a device that does a chemical check on an entire person with no x-rays or strip searching. Several devices exist and could be implemented today, were the leaders of the TSA not criminally incompetent fools.
I also agree with public access to airside.
Before you folks go electing Dovster, remember, I've been espousing these ideas since black day when the TSA was created.
#5
Original Poster
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, In Memoriam




Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Yiron, Israel
Programs: Bates Motel Plat
Posts: 69,201
Originally Posted by Spiff
Agree with all except #2. Air marshals increase the chance of an incident occuring by bringing a weapon on board. ...I would trade every air marshal in for a device that does a chemical check on an entire person with no x-rays or strip searching. Several devices exist and could be implemented today, were the leaders of the TSA not criminally incompetent fools.
You might be interested in a story which appeared in Friday's newspapers in Israel. A mid-sized high tech firm here has developed a device that will detect any explosives or chemicals (including drugs) on your person or in your luggage. It uses a harmless laser and can work from a distance of several yards. It sends a chemical analysis to a computer which immediately identifies the substances you are watching for.
The company says that its own field tests have shown the device to be 100% effective and that several security companies in Israel, Europe, and the States have expressed interest. They expect it to go on the market in January, after independent testing.
If the device lives up to their expectations, they say, both passengers and their luggage will be able to be scanned in a matter of seconds.
#6
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M




Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 58,133
Do you happen to have a link to the story, preferrably in English?
I think such a device should be employed, but it definitely should not be checking for drugs or anything else that is not a threat to an aircraft.
I think such a device should be employed, but it definitely should not be checking for drugs or anything else that is not a threat to an aircraft.
#7
Original Poster
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend, In Memoriam




Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Yiron, Israel
Programs: Bates Motel Plat
Posts: 69,201
Originally Posted by Spiff
Do you happen to have a link to the story, preferrably in English?
I think such a device should be employed, but it definitely should not be checking for drugs or anything else that is not a threat to an aircraft.
I think such a device should be employed, but it definitely should not be checking for drugs or anything else that is not a threat to an aircraft.
I imagine that Customs would be the one to use it for drugs.
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/422048.html
#8
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M




Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 58,133
Interesting article, thanks.
I hope these or similar devices will be employed ASAP so that the select FSDs with a perverted shoe fetish can go find some other way to get their thrills, preferrably not at the airport.
I hope these or similar devices will be employed ASAP so that the select FSDs with a perverted shoe fetish can go find some other way to get their thrills, preferrably not at the airport.
#9
FlyerTalk Evangelist


Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: FW, TX, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Programs: 2008 FT1 Fantasy Football Champion
Posts: 10,862
I don't necessarily see a problem with air marshals, but I will agree that the conduct of some of them has been less than professional, which is partially due to the fact that they instituted the program fast instead of correctly. I do think, however, that the government needs to buy their seats. If they want them to sit up front, fine, pony up the $$$.
#10
Moderator: Coupon Connection & S.P.A.M




Join Date: May 2000
Location: Louisville, KY
Programs: Destination Unknown, TSA Disparager Diamond (LTDD)
Posts: 58,133
Originally Posted by empedocles
I don't necessarily see a problem with air marshals, but I will agree that the conduct of some of them has been less than professional, which is partially due to the fact that they instituted the program fast instead of correctly. I do think, however, that the government needs to buy their seats. If they want them to sit up front, fine, pony up the $$$.
I'd just as soon leave them at the gate.
#11
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Richmond, BC, Canada
Posts: 1,511
#1: You can't keep the cockpit door locked at all times, particularly on long flights where crew changes are required. Locking before passengers boards seems to be a lot of pain for little gain - "useful" highjackings take place in the air.
The biggest change that is required is to the paternalistic propaganda of our govt's that makes absolute or near-absolute security a desirable and believable goal in the public's mind when it is not. Then reasonable measures that balance cost, effectiveness and civil rights could be deployed using rational analysis.
The biggest change that is required is to the paternalistic propaganda of our govt's that makes absolute or near-absolute security a desirable and believable goal in the public's mind when it is not. Then reasonable measures that balance cost, effectiveness and civil rights could be deployed using rational analysis.

