Yeah, and there was very little screening done either, except for guns and IED's. The prohibited item list was almost non-existent. Now before you start arguing over the prohibited item list, remember that it takes a LOT longer to scan for all the items on it than it did before. Of course you can argue all you want, but until you have actually worked a checkpoint, your opinion is just that, not a fact. So if you want to drop to 3 screeners per lane, you better have 6 police officers on hand to handle the FF's who will certainly go off over the situation.

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Don't take life too seriously, afterall, you won't get out alive.

[This message has been edited by The Unknown Screener (edited 10-14-2003).]

Two years ago, the walkthru's werent set so high. If you did ring, you got a second chance to walk thru. If you rang again you were wanded. So you really only needed like 2 or 3 wanders in the back to do this.

Now, the machines are set more sensitive and you dont get a second chance. You have a average of about 20 to 40 rings if there are at least three lanes running (my airport at least). This requires more wanders to handle the problem. 5 or 6 wanders in the back is the norm now. But most smaller airports like Feinto is saying work with maybe 2 wanders in the back.

The prohibited items list wasnt so long. Now you have to be more aware on the xray and the images. Because unlike guns and IED's, little knifes, scissors, etc.. don't jump out like they others do. So more time is spent on the Xray, adding to the lines.

Your now required to do conuties bag checks, so your required to have a bag checker, of course most small airport FSD's have made little amendents to that rule. But thats still another screener and a little more time.

Then you get a lot of PAX who dont fly on a regular basis and because of it, they don't know the entire prodecure and just do a follow the leader type deal, instead of reading the signs or listening to what a screener is telling them, adding to the lines.

And Pre 9/11 security was quicker because it wasnt really security at all. It was just a more extreme window dressing, that was meant to keep just guns and bombs off a plane. It was more of a get the custom through and if a gun pops up then do something.

Well, it seems we have identified many of the problems that indicate overstaffing.

1)Too many stupid items on the "prohibited list"

2)Continuous Harassment

3)Metal detector set too high/no chance to try again.

So, we need to get these problems corrected, preferrably by throwing Admiral Loy head-first out the door.

Keeping guns and bombs off the airplane is real security. Keeping hockey sticks, pool cues and pocket knives is not.

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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

Why not go back to the "second chance" policy? Wouldn't it be faster for me to take the dime out of my pocket (literally the source of my last few beeps) and put the dime through the x-ray than to wand me? I can see how third/fourth/fifth chances would slow the line, but is there a perceived security risk to letting people remove an article from their person and put it on the x-ray?



Interesting statement which seems believable. What it implies is that if the govt and sheeple go back to a reasonable prohibited-item list that only includes credible threats, it will make life much easier for the screeners and let them focus more on the important parts of the job.

Are there any credibly-threatening items you can think of that are tricky to see on x-ray?

(e.g. I'd consider a 20-inch sword placed thin-side to the x-ray to be a credible threat. Or an umbrella with a fencing-style foil built in. Or an explosive detonator, improvised or otherwise. But I do not consider pocket-knives less than 2-4", small scissors, tweezers, nail clippers, etc. to be credible threats. I probably don't consider box-cutters to be credible threats either, though some would debate that and they're certainly more credible than the small scissors.)

So, I take it you believe we have security now and not extreme window dressing?

Nope, if you've read my priory post, then you would not put words in my mouth. I know that TSA isnt top line security but I do feel in one regard its better, the equipment in a lot of cases is better then pre 9/11.

I worked for the private company right after 9/11. The training I got was pre 9/11 training and it wasnt good at all. Sorry the equipment we worked with, if a gun went through in a way such as you only saw the top of the gun or you saw just the back or front of it, it would get through. And bombs, enless obivious, you didnt see it.


As for the second chance thing. A dime in your pocket isnt going to set the WTMD off. Its going to be a larger item or a combination of items in your pockets and on your person.

But honestly I dont see a second chance as a way to help stop lines. The machines are just set to high to do so. Easier in my view just to screen the PAX in the back real quick.

Honestly, I would like more training into items such as Hazardous chemicals and such, (lighter fluid containers, Mace, etc..). Not enough training was giving and we as screeners have just learned over time what this items look like.

Pocket Knives, Scissors (small scissors), box cutter, Pool cues, Nail Clippers with Knives, not flies but a knife, and tweezers (expect gem tweezers) are not credible threats in my view.

Now larger scissors and Gem tweezers are a credible threat in my view, because they would equal about the length of 4 to 6"'s.

I wouldnt say there is really anything hard to see on the xray, anymore. What has happened overtime is screeners just learned what the items looked like.

oh, and I would love more training based on explosives.

[This message has been edited by screenerx (edited 10-14-2003).]

The following sentence is irrelevant:

It's Incident, not Incedent.

Grammer Check complete, your bill is $1.50.

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"If life doesn't offer a game worth playing, then invent a new one."
-Anthony J. D'Angelo

Grammar? This is a spelling mistake; there's no such word as incedent.

One beer, please.



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"Give me Liberty or give me Death." - Patrick Henry

Informative post; thanks for the answers.

As a follow-up, metal "on my person" when I
travel:

-mostly-titanium frame glasses
-plastic-band digital watch w/ metal backing behind case
-small belt buckle
-shanks in shoes
-small aluminium cross (religious item) in wallet

I have no dental work, medical implants, etc. Slacks I wear have plastic buttons/zippers.

Post-9/11 and shoe-guy, I always have to remove the wallet, the belt buckle, the shoes, and the wallet to avoid beeping. The watch and glasses have never been a problem in the US, but the watch + glasses + 1 dime is enough to consistently set off the alarm.

I beeped the pre-board (at the gate) WTMD in Istanbul w/ just the glasses and watch, but removing the glasses fixed it.

I sincerely hope they never turn the detectors up any more. I would refuse to remove my glasses in the USA as that's excessively demeaning.

Today is different, as you say.

You have the screener saying "I strongly advise you to remove your shoes and place them on the belt."

And then he asks, "do you have any metal in your pocket, keys, change, lighter, knives."

All of that takes time.

Then the laptops have to go thru separately.

And the shoes go through.

And the coats.

And because my bag has been pulled aside for secondary screening "because the X Ray revealed a sharp object" -- my cell phone -- I now put the cell phone in a plastic tub too.

So they are screening my rollaboard, my computer bag, a tub with my computer, a tub with the shoes, a tub with my jacket and a tub with the cell phone.

Quite a project, don't you think?

Multiply your experience by over 650 million (total number of passengers in USA this year) and no wonder the TSA needs 55,000 employees to do what the airlines did with less than half as many. All to constantly screen you, a nonterrorist. And while doing nothing to actually discover if you are, in fact, a terrorist. Almost two million people a day.

Mineta's (and now Loy's) infantile preoccupation with finding and confiscating sharp and pointy objects instead of finding terrorists is the real reason behind the long lines and millions of wasted hours. All in all, our great sharp and pointy object search costs society many billions of dollars per year on top of the TSA's multi-billion dollar budget.

And it has nothing to do with prevention of a September 11-type terrorist attack (or any other credible threat, for that matter).

You are correct in that the TSA has no way of knowing whether the passengers they are screening are terrorists or not, but even if they are, they will be terrorists without "sharp or pointy objects."



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Don't take life too seriously, afterall, you won't get out alive.

Mall security doesn't count.

Mall Security Guards are OVERQUALIFIED to be TSA Screeners.

I agree with you that it takes more people to search for dimes and kiddie scissors.

What I and many other people are trying to say is that screening for dimes and kiddie scissors is a waste of time.

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"Yippie-kay-yay, Mr. Falcon!" -- John McClane, Die Hard II As Seen on TV