Publically Requesting to be Recorded
Jul 22, 2011 | 12:42 pm
#31
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
Thank you for answering her question and the compassion that you showed in doing so. These answers, as I understand you, are not SOP, but how you would handle the situation. My next questions may or may not be able to be answered without revealing SSI, but here goes.
2. Would the LTSO or STSO that are required to be present also be required to be of the same sex? Would both TSOs have to observe the removal of the clothes? Would the person be allowed keep their underwear on, or to wear a drape or cover to cover up sensitive naked areas (breasts, buttox, genitals) like they do in a doctors office until the actual moment of examination?
3. Would the clothing have to be taken out of the private room to be examined, say to be tested for explosive residue?
2. Would the LTSO or STSO that are required to be present also be required to be of the same sex? Would both TSOs have to observe the removal of the clothes? Would the person be allowed keep their underwear on, or to wear a drape or cover to cover up sensitive naked areas (breasts, buttox, genitals) like they do in a doctors office until the actual moment of examination?
3. Would the clothing have to be taken out of the private room to be examined, say to be tested for explosive residue?
If you disrobe down to your undies, you will be asked to put on a drape but you will still have a pat down. If you have any kind of clothes on you , you will get one.
I am talking about all the clothes nothing on you.
To me it doesnt make any kind of sence to leave my undies on cause I will still get a grope.
The point and/or reason to me to do it my way is so I dont get touched period.
Hopefully this will never happen to me. But who knows since all my flights are to Europe.
Jul 22, 2011 | 12:44 pm
#32
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
Hmm.
It's an interesting question, actually. There are situations in the screening process that allows for visual inspection in lieu of physical inspection (a la undergarment body piercings in sensitive areas of the body). Logically, this would seem like just an extension of that, and would even seem to be appropriate given the extenuating circumstances surrounding your past. It satisfies the screening requirements as I understand them to be, and is tailored to your own personal needs, which is something we're supposed to try to do.
I don't personally see how this would be a problem, and I could see it going like this:
1. It would be in a private screening area.
2. There would be two TSOs present - and, given the sensitivity of the issue, one of those present would likely end up being an LTSO or an STSO. Like any other private screening, you could obviously have a witness in there yourself, if you so choose.
3. The clothing would need to be physically inspected after the disrobing, prior to you putting it back on.
Note, however, that this is conjecture and logical deduction. If I were in charge, that's how I would do it (or, more specifically, how I would direct it to be done. Obviously, I wouldn't be one of the two in the room with you, given as how I'm not a female).
It's an interesting question, actually. There are situations in the screening process that allows for visual inspection in lieu of physical inspection (a la undergarment body piercings in sensitive areas of the body). Logically, this would seem like just an extension of that, and would even seem to be appropriate given the extenuating circumstances surrounding your past. It satisfies the screening requirements as I understand them to be, and is tailored to your own personal needs, which is something we're supposed to try to do.
I don't personally see how this would be a problem, and I could see it going like this:
1. It would be in a private screening area.
2. There would be two TSOs present - and, given the sensitivity of the issue, one of those present would likely end up being an LTSO or an STSO. Like any other private screening, you could obviously have a witness in there yourself, if you so choose.
3. The clothing would need to be physically inspected after the disrobing, prior to you putting it back on.
Note, however, that this is conjecture and logical deduction. If I were in charge, that's how I would do it (or, more specifically, how I would direct it to be done. Obviously, I wouldn't be one of the two in the room with you, given as how I'm not a female).
About a witness. Not in my case. I dont think my grown up son would like to see his mother without clothes. And my partner would be pissed off that some one is looking at me.
Jul 22, 2011 | 1:16 pm
#33
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 959
This is how I understand it after asking questions about it for some time.
If you disrobe down to your undies, you will be asked to put on a drape but you will still have a pat down. If you have any kind of clothes on you , you will get one.
I am talking about all the clothes nothing on you.
To me it doesnt make any kind of sence to leave my undies on cause I will still get a grope.
The point and/or reason to me to do it my way is so I dont get touched period.
Hopefully this will never happen to me. But who knows since all my flights are to Europe.
If you disrobe down to your undies, you will be asked to put on a drape but you will still have a pat down. If you have any kind of clothes on you , you will get one.
I am talking about all the clothes nothing on you.
To me it doesnt make any kind of sence to leave my undies on cause I will still get a grope.
The point and/or reason to me to do it my way is so I dont get touched period.
Hopefully this will never happen to me. But who knows since all my flights are to Europe.
HSVDean,
Is this true? If so, why on God's green earth would a person that has stripped down to their undies not be able to be cleared visually?
Please give us a straight-forward, truthful answer, unless your job is in jeopardy if you do.
Jul 22, 2011 | 1:43 pm
#34
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Join Date: Sep 2006
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There have been instances at various checkpoints where someone was told to cover-up for the patdown. You have to wonder...if it's about security, why have TSOs objected to folks going through checkpoints without shirts, in bikinis, in spandex body suits...One would think that the less flesh that a groper has to grope, the better for the groper and the pax, but they sure don't seem to see it that way. You want to get TSOs riled at a checkpoint, line up and take your shirt off and watch the reaction.
And please, we don't need TSOs telling us "think of the children" like that jerk that got upset when someone used the word 'penis' before the grope. Hello? He's worried some little kid might hear the word 'penis', but he's not worried that same little kid (possibly of opposite gender) will watch him grope that same penis and wonder what's going on?
(I'm thinking of that iconic picture of the middle-aged male screener down on his knees with his hand in the older gentleman's business. Kids will find that image less unsettling than hearing the word 'penis' or seeing someone without a shirt or in a bikini going through the checkpoint?)
They clearly have issues with visual screening. They really really want hands-on. I suspect you would have to strip naked, put on a drape, get groped through the drape, have your clothes inspected and swabbed. And I'm confident that no matter where the anomaly is, you will not leave without a full-body grope.
Last edited by chollie; Jul 22, 2011 at 1:50 pm
Jul 22, 2011 | 2:48 pm
#35
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: IAD
Programs: *wood Gold
Posts: 1,780
People just need to figure out 'cute' ways of harassing TSOs while not interfering with the screening process - today's version of a peaceful demonstration. Think about this...
If enough people were to take a minute or two to figure out their names when asking to recite them, this could cause a back-up.
And then if those same folks insisted upon a TSA frisk instead of going through the cancer machine, this creates another problem as folks begin to line up perhaps a dozen or so deep.
Another problem can be created by feigning a hearing problem when the TSOs make requests, causing them to repeat themselves a few times before action is taken.
Another problem can be created by intentionally carrying a couple bottles of water in your bag while going through the checkpoint. If the bottles aren't discovered, then quickly "discover" them yourself just before leaving the checkpoint. Hold them up and make a big deal out of it, acting like you are surprised about them, and apologizing profusely for forgetting about them. Make TSA look like fools in the process.
Another situation can be created to draw TSO attention elsewhere by whipping out your cell phone and starting to record video - or at least making it look like you are. I'm sure that will attract the attention of at least 1 or 2 people.
Overwhelm them. If that isn't enough, cause them stress. Push them to the edge. They're only human, so it's only a matter of time before they can't take the pressure and wind up cracking. And then, if they crack on you, be ready to file a lawsuit - not necessarily against TSA, but against them personally. Show them how society can intentionally stack the deck of cards against them, simply because of the job they do and the employer they have.
Jul 22, 2011 | 3:00 pm
#36
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: California. USA
Posts: 1,404
Sounds true.
There have been instances at various checkpoints where someone was told to cover-up for the patdown. You have to wonder...if it's about security, why have TSOs objected to folks going through checkpoints without shirts, in bikinis, in spandex body suits...One would think that the less flesh that a groper has to grope, the better for the groper and the pax, but they sure don't seem to see it that way. You want to get TSOs riled at a checkpoint, line up and take your shirt off and watch the reaction.
And please, we don't need TSOs telling us "think of the children" like that jerk that got upset when someone used the word 'penis' before the grope. Hello? He's worried some little kid might hear the word 'penis', but he's not worried that same little kid (possibly of opposite gender) will watch him grope that same penis and wonder what's going on?
(I'm thinking of that iconic picture of the middle-aged male screener down on his knees with his hand in the older gentleman's business. Kids will find that image less unsettling than hearing the word 'penis' or seeing someone without a shirt or in a bikini going through the checkpoint?)
They clearly have issues with visual screening. They really really want hands-on. I suspect you would have to strip naked, put on a drape, get groped through the drape, have your clothes inspected and swabbed. And I'm confident that no matter where the anomaly is, you will not leave without a full-body grope.
There have been instances at various checkpoints where someone was told to cover-up for the patdown. You have to wonder...if it's about security, why have TSOs objected to folks going through checkpoints without shirts, in bikinis, in spandex body suits...One would think that the less flesh that a groper has to grope, the better for the groper and the pax, but they sure don't seem to see it that way. You want to get TSOs riled at a checkpoint, line up and take your shirt off and watch the reaction.
And please, we don't need TSOs telling us "think of the children" like that jerk that got upset when someone used the word 'penis' before the grope. Hello? He's worried some little kid might hear the word 'penis', but he's not worried that same little kid (possibly of opposite gender) will watch him grope that same penis and wonder what's going on?
(I'm thinking of that iconic picture of the middle-aged male screener down on his knees with his hand in the older gentleman's business. Kids will find that image less unsettling than hearing the word 'penis' or seeing someone without a shirt or in a bikini going through the checkpoint?)
They clearly have issues with visual screening. They really really want hands-on. I suspect you would have to strip naked, put on a drape, get groped through the drape, have your clothes inspected and swabbed. And I'm confident that no matter where the anomaly is, you will not leave without a full-body grope.
Most foreigners will not understand to put on a drape. since they have no clue what it is.
So what are they going to do then? Arrest every person who dont put on the drape and walks out to them butt naked?
Also after what I have read about women who wears skirts and have to put on a drape. They get groped under the drape til "resistance" is met. Being naked under the drape that means touching bare skin.
Jul 22, 2011 | 3:08 pm
#37
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,728
Jul 22, 2011 | 3:13 pm
#38
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: IAD
Programs: *wood Gold
Posts: 1,780
Jul 22, 2011 | 3:38 pm
#40
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: where the chile is hot
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Posts: 49,061