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Old Nov 26, 2010 | 5:59 pm
  #16  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: NY
Posts: 342
Originally Posted by Wimpie
This poll is hungry for votes:
President Barack Obama on TSA airport patdowns: Better safe than sorry, but policy will evolve

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/poli...han_sorry.html
i have never seen a poll that didnt have the number of votes cast.

also consider the source of the poll...
Saitek is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 1:07 am
  #17  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,051
There are 2 problems with assuming everyone is a terrorist, like the TSA does, first - you waste a LOT of time and resources looking at folks who aren't and never will be terrorists. Second, you violate the constitutional rights of every American citizen in the process
Precisely what the Israeli security guys say. Think of picking up EVERY straw in a pile of hay to determine if it might be a needle in disguise. That's what we tell the TSA to do. What if you had a metal detector and threw it away, settling for crawling on your needs and pawing at the ground, inch by inch, to discover if anything valuable is there.

TSA has simply forgotten why there are things like supercomputers that are programmed to look for SIGNIFICANT things in the mass of electronic traffic. You DON'T want to look at everything. You want to REDUCE the mass to something that can be scrutinized in a timely way.
LuvAirFrance is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 7:44 am
  #18  
 
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Originally Posted by DevilDog438
Where, exactly, does the Fourth Amendment state that it does not apply in civil matters? Yes, there are court cases that have permitted limited exceptions, titled Administrative Searches, and this is the "exception" that TSA claims to be following. However, there are also cases that have held that the Administrative Search has specific limitations and still may require a warrant (do a search on Child Protective Services and unannounced, unwarranted administrative searches).
Pour yourselves a cup of coffee (or a stiff drink) and read this:
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=5116&page=34

It's long, but presented without emotion. See also Appendix C which lists the legal precedents (handy reference). However, unless and until it makes it to the Supreme Court, this issue will unfortunately remain very much a gray area.
Wally Bird is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 8:07 am
  #19  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Posts: 107
Originally Posted by gojirasan
I would consider the idea of taking a bus to Canada (YUL is only about 400 miles from Boston IIRC) and fly out of YUL instead of BOS, but they still have the MMW scanners without the stick-figure software so I'm not sure what I would gain exactly.
Why don't you fly out of MHT since it is only an hour away from BOS?
r17gordini is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 8:38 am
  #20  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Programs: AA Plat, CO Gold, Marriott Silver
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Originally Posted by Pyswarrior
Forth amendment is for criminal not civil protection. Multiple court cases upholding that and non not.

Why don't you support profiling (although you are probably a white male so won't be profiled)
The Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution protects the "right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures (US Const amend IV)." The reasonableness of the search depends on the context within which it takes place (see O'Connor v Ortega, 480 US 709, 719; New Jersey v T.L.O., 469 US 325, 337). Except in certain carefully defined classes of cases, a search of private property without proper consent is unreasonable unless it has been authorized by a valid search warrant (see Camara v Municipal Court of City and County of San Francisco, 387 US 523, 528). A search warrant is required for "a routine inspection of the physical condition of private property" (Camara v Municipal Court of City and County of San Francisco, 387 US at 530). Thus, ORPS has opined that an assessor, in preparing an assessment roll, should not enter a private residence without first securing the landowner's permission (see Op Counsel SBEA, No. 4; 7 Op Counsel SBEA, No. 19; 2 Op Counsel SBEA, No. 78).

Excerpt from the following link:
http://realestateclips.blogspot.com/...access-to.html

Last edited by r17gordini; Nov 27, 2010 at 9:09 am Reason: Added reference
r17gordini is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 8:46 am
  #21  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 629
Originally Posted by r17gordini
Why don't you fly out of MHT since it is only an hour away from BOS?
Along with Providence (PVD), Manchester is an alternative, but even if they don't have the scanners now, they will eventually get them. YUL could be the basis of a more long term plan to avoid the TSA and deal with CATSA instead.
gojirasan is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 11:04 am
  #22  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Originally Posted by Wally Bird
Pour yourselves a cup of coffee (or a stiff drink) and read this:
http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=5116&page=34

It's long, but presented without emotion. See also Appendix C which lists the legal precedents (handy reference). However, unless and until it makes it to the Supreme Court, this issue will unfortunately remain very much a gray area.
I agree that it is a gray area. I was merely commenting on Pyswarrior's absurd assertion that the 4th Amendment applies exclusively to criminal matters. The Amendment itself makes no such argument and courts have, in a variety of cases, ruled that it both applies and does not apply in civil instances.
DevilDog438 is offline  
Old Nov 27, 2010 | 11:10 am
  #23  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 70
Originally Posted by Wimpie
This poll is hungry for votes:
President Barack Obama on TSA airport patdowns: Better safe than sorry, but policy will evolve

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/poli...han_sorry.html
It's 80% in favor of the TSA right now.
PartlySunny is offline  


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