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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:10 pm
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Question Is a sane type of security coming?

Airports encourage governments to reassess security approach

http://atwonline.com/airports-routes...-approach-1005

Officials speaking at last week's Airports Council International-North America Conference and Exhibition in Pittsburgh said governments need to work cooperatively to develop a global, standardized approach and move away from treating all passengers as potential terrorists.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:13 pm
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Originally Posted by IslandBased
Airports encourage governments to reassess security approach

http://atwonline.com/airports-routes...-approach-1005
The problem is that the US government will push for TSA's way to be adopted globally, which many nations will (correctly) not adopt. And, frankly, I don't see Israel taking advice from TSA or anyone else anytime soon.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:19 pm
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A sane approach would be most of the other nations on the planet telling the USA to go to hell and readopting security procedures that were in place on 10 Sept 2001, with increased use of ETP/ETD.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:23 pm
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Originally Posted by ATWOnline
While acknowledging "some learning curves" with administering the AIT devices, he said checkpoint processing is being slowed by the "number and size of checked bags passengers are bringing" through security. "Our throughput problems have been the [carry-on] x-ray machines, not the AITs," he said
Checked bags being brought through security? Does this even make sense?
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:24 pm
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Originally Posted by Spiff
A sane approach would be most of the other nations on the planet telling the USA to go to hell and readopting security procedures that were in place on 10 Sept 2001, with increased use of ETP/ETD.
At least the discussion is taking place, and the viewpoint has been voiced. ^ Winding down the current crap is another story.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 12:35 pm
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move away from treating all passengers as potential terrorists.
Knowing TSA, that message will be lost in translation.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 3:43 pm
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I hope something comes of this, but frankly I don't think anything will.

My sense that TSA arrogance and politics will prevail.

If the organization can give some tangible proof that a substantial amount of money has been lost because of the TSA, then something might become of this. Short of that, the TSA will carry on with their misguided mission of questionable technology and execution.

[TSA Assistant Administrator-Office of Security Technology Robin] Kane insisted that AIT machines, currently being deployed side-by-side with legacy walk-through metal detectors at airport checkpoints, are not slowing passenger throughput (ATW Airports Today, May 5). While acknowledging "some learning curves" with administering the AIT devices, he said checkpoint processing is being slowed by the "number and size of checked bags passengers are bringing" through security. "Our throughput problems have been the [carry-on] x-ray machines, not the AITs," he said.
Baloney.

I do not dispute people bringing larger or too many bags, but what I see is not a huge amount of passengers doing this.

If the TSA wants to claim that the virtual strip search machines will not slow down screening, they are going to be in for a huge surprise when the lines at airports grow longer.

THAT will affect revenue, both for the airlines (in missed flights) and for the airports (that will get less in the way of revenue because people won't have time to stop and buy that $5.00 bottle of water at Hudson News). And TSA-era history has shown that people will not wait an excessive amount of time for "security."
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 4:07 pm
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The only 'improvements' we will see here in the US will be linked to $$ in someone's pockets and/or more invasion of privacy (passenger information).

There will be no review of procedures to see if improvements can be made there because no one will make a profit off a process change.

I find the references to carry-on bags disturbing. Both TSA and the airlines would be quite happy to find an excuse to prohibit carry-ons - TSA so their screeners have less work to do and the airlines because it will drive more checked bag revenue their way.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 4:22 pm
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Originally Posted by chollie
Both TSA and the airlines would be quite happy to find an excuse to prohibit carry-ons - TSA so their screeners have less work to do and the airlines because it will drive more checked bag revenue their way.
I'm sure the front-liners with both the TSA and airlines (gate agents, FAs) would love to prohibit carry-ons. But I don't think that will happen.

The problem is that more checked bags would slow down the screening. It would also result in a need for increased manpower for the TSA, and the airlines (in baggage handlers). Plus, it would likely mean more people waiting in line to check a bag, increased time necessary to check-in and increased time to wait for a bag or bags to claim. Not to mention the additional costs to the airlines for delayed/lost bags. And less cargo space (a big source of revenue for airlines).

Even LHR backed off of the one-bag thing.

I don't think they will completely prohibit carry-ons.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:13 pm
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Originally Posted by LessO2
I'm sure the front-liners with both the TSA and airlines (gate agents, FAs) would love to prohibit carry-ons. But I don't think that will happen.

The problem is that more checked bags would slow down the screening. It would also result in a need for increased manpower for the TSA, and the airlines (in baggage handlers). Plus, it would likely mean more people waiting in line to check a bag, increased time necessary to check-in and increased time to wait for a bag or bags to claim. Not to mention the additional costs to the airlines for delayed/lost bags. And less cargo space (a big source of revenue for airlines).

Even LHR backed off of the one-bag thing.

I don't think they will completely prohibit carry-ons.
I hope you are right.

I have to say, I don't think TSA or the airlines would factor in increased time waiting in line at check-in or baggage claim. Neither the TSA nor the airline would be impacted by that, only the passenger.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:15 pm
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Originally Posted by chollie
I hope you are right.

I have to say, I don't think TSA or the airlines would factor in increased time waiting in line at check-in or baggage claim. Neither the TSA nor the airline would be impacted by that, only the passenger.
Instead of people being suggested to arrive two-hours before the flight, it would have to be at least three or four. Certain airport, especially huge hubs (JFK,ORD,IAD,IAH,DEN,SFO,LAX...) would be packed to the gills with people waiting in line.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:17 pm
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Originally Posted by chollie
I have to say, I don't think TSA or the airlines would factor in increased time waiting in line at check-in or baggage claim. Neither the TSA nor the airline would be impacted by that, only the passenger.
They better, because that would be an excuse for business travelers to not travel.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:45 pm
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Originally Posted by LessO2
I'm sure the front-liners with both the TSA and airlines (gate agents, FAs) would love to prohibit carry-ons. But I don't think that will happen.

The problem is that more checked bags would slow down the screening. It would also result in a need for increased manpower for the TSA, and the airlines (in baggage handlers). Plus, it would likely mean more people waiting in line to check a bag, increased time necessary to check-in and increased time to wait for a bag or bags to claim. Not to mention the additional costs to the airlines for delayed/lost bags. And less cargo space (a big source of revenue for airlines).

Even LHR backed off of the one-bag thing.

I don't think they will completely prohibit carry-ons.
Not to mention the mess flying out of Canada after Christmas last year.

Unfortunately I can see airlines changing carry-on rules not out of safety, but to boost the bottom line.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:53 pm
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Originally Posted by Vecturist14
Not to mention the mess flying out of Canada after Christmas last year.

Unfortunately I can see airlines changing carry-on rules not out of safety, but to boost the bottom line.
The safety of my electronics means that they travel with me. Period.

No electronics, no travel. I'll buy that new big-screen TV or better yet, keep my money in my pocket. Screw the airlines, screw the economy.
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Old Oct 5, 2010 | 5:55 pm
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Originally Posted by Vecturist14
Not to mention the mess flying out of Canada after Christmas last year.

Unfortunately I can see airlines changing carry-on rules not out of safety, but to boost the bottom line.
A large part of the chaos was probably because it happened virtually without warning. Even then, frequent and savvy flyers started trying to network and find out how to handle it very quickly. And wasn't that when the Scott E-vest really got attention?

I don't think the airlines or TSA would take passenger convenience or short-term chaos into consideration at all. The airlines would probably be guess-timating how much additional revenue it might generate and some TSOs would be having a field day with all the new influx of take-home goodies and some baggage handlers and TSA luggage screeners would also no doubt be rubbing their hands in anticipation of new bonus opportunities.
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