FlyerTalk Forums - TSA may be indirectly causing 1000's of deaths

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- - TSA may be indirectly causing 1000's of deaths (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/1116504-tsa-may-indirectly-causing-1000s-deaths.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 14500237)

Different people have different definitions of what the term "groped" means. Here, it is commonly used for a physical search of any kind. In the real world, among rational people, there are a few people who might define it that way but they are few and far between.

That's because some posters and part of the media are drama queens. Instead of explaining an action using clear and descriptive language, it's much easier to use terms out of context.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wimpie (Post 14500463)

* FAIL*

Law Enforcement Officers have to have REASONABLE CAUSE to search a person and cannot strip search anybody without a warrant, physically or with a strip-search machine.

The two legal standards are reasonable suspicion and probable cause for a warrantless search of a person. Neither applies in a checkpoint search as it falls under implied consent, thus no standard is required. The courts have yet to give a definitive ruling on whether a virtual "strip search" would require the same justification as a physical one. The TSA has avoided this by claiming that all scans are "consensual" as the passenger has the ability to opt out. According to some on this board, that isn't always the case either through direct action or implication.

Ron is semi-right in his assertion, but a screeners search is limited to weapons/prohibited items and not inclusive of means to escape or evidence of criminal activity. However, should such items be discovered during a "good faith" search for weapons or prohibited items, they are not necessarily excludable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wimpie (Post 14500463)

* FAIL*

Law Enforcement Officers have to have REASONABLE CAUSE to search a person and cannot strip search anybody without a warrant, physically or with a strip-search machine.

Wow, that’s 2 for 2 there wimpie! This is becoming habit dude.

Sorry to tell ya, but your wrong ... again. A LEO does not need "reasonable cause" or a warrant if he asks and is given permission by the individual. Happens all the time, and it’s done for the officers safety. TSO's on the other hand are searching under the "administrative" exception to the warrant or reasonable cause requirements, and cannot conduct a search even then without the consent of the passenger. That consent is implied when a passenger submits themselves and their property for screening.

That’s 2 *FAIL*'s for you in a row. Geez dude, take a break and get it together. Get some fruit juice and lay off the caffeine. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by We Will Never Forget (Post 14501809)

That's because some posters and part of the media are drama queens. Instead of explaining an action using clear and descriptive language, it's much easier to use terms out of context.

:D I could not have said it better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by We Will Never Forget (Post 14501809)

Ron is semi-right in his assertion, but a screeners search is limited to weapons/prohibited items and not inclusive of means to escape or evidence of criminal activity. However, should such items be discovered during a "good faith" search for weapons or prohibited items, they are not necessarily excludable.

^

One other point that often gets missed here. “WEI” can appear to be anything. Anything at all. Our training includes not excluding anything because it “appears” to be one thing or another. So if I am looking at your watch a bit odd, or that battery powered device in your case with concern, it’s because that’s what we are trained to do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by doober (Post 14484642)

If you'd do some reading both here and on other internet sites, you will see that many have chosen to drive due directly to the TSA, not because they are afraid of being a victim of a terrorist attack.

Agreed! I am now driving any trip less than 800 miles RT due to not wanting to deal with the TSA. I am fed up with the TSA wasting my time, and with having my luggage rifled and my body groped. I used to fly ORD-MSP, am now driving on a weekly basis.