How Close are We to ENOUGH ALREADY! ?
Apr 1, 2010 | 7:52 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Tha OC
Programs: Outgrew all status except AA: Plat for life (the program's); Costco: Ex Plat
Posts: 682
How Close are We to ENOUGH ALREADY! ?
First Liquid Logic. No more free water, and (for me) no more carry-on only.
Next, Gate Gropes. Fear and loathing at the boarding gate, for whatever they missed at security.
The final chapter?
Coming soon, to EVERY AIRPORT WITH NO OPT-OUT: The Nude-O-Scope!
That's just about enough for me.
Flew out of LAS on a late Sunday (way off-peak). Ever driven home on a usually-jammed Interstate way late, looking forward to having all five lanes to yourself? Only to find four lanes closed off by the Highway Patrol so they could run the street sweeper? It was like that.
Three Nude-O-Scopes in full swing, with TSA dicks barking at the lambs approaching the rotating knives. Other lanes that appeared to be opt-out, but which actually lead nowhere. That's right, litle TSA cul-de-sacs. Get to the front, TSA guy barks at you to go to the back of the adjacent NOS. Your bags will go on without you.
I said no thank you.
Well, he was going to show me. We know jes how to deal with the likes of you. I had to wait to be groped. And groped I was. Everywhere.
I do mean everywhere.
The opt-out punishment took about twenty minutes, enough to risk missing my flight.
People, I say enough is enough.
I'm not going to bother recycling my reasons for protesting this.
You know them all.
There isn't one single thing about this that's right.
I'd say a little civil disobedience is in order here, but I doubt that would work.
What's needed is a LOT of civil disobedience.
Slow it down, gum it up, grind it to a screeching stop.
Make them dot every i and cross every t.
Every time.
Every airport.
Every city.
Every flight.
Here's an example, from a great post here at Flyertalk:
1. I require a private screening
2. I require that you change your gloves, with a fresh pair from an original package or an EMS/FD-style belt pouch (from a pocket is not acceptable)
3. I require that all of my possessions remain in my direct line of sight at all times, with the only acceptable blockage being the time items are being passed through the X-Ray - any failures on this part will result in a report to my corporate Security Officer for federal reporting compliance
4. You will wait while I note the time of this unconstitutional gate grope for tracking purposes should I miss my original flight despite being in the gatehouse in compliance with the airline's policies
That's what I'm talking about.
Can I hear an amen?
Ok, then how about some more like that?
This is my country too.
At least for now.
Next, Gate Gropes. Fear and loathing at the boarding gate, for whatever they missed at security.
The final chapter?
Coming soon, to EVERY AIRPORT WITH NO OPT-OUT: The Nude-O-Scope!
That's just about enough for me.
Flew out of LAS on a late Sunday (way off-peak). Ever driven home on a usually-jammed Interstate way late, looking forward to having all five lanes to yourself? Only to find four lanes closed off by the Highway Patrol so they could run the street sweeper? It was like that.
Three Nude-O-Scopes in full swing, with TSA dicks barking at the lambs approaching the rotating knives. Other lanes that appeared to be opt-out, but which actually lead nowhere. That's right, litle TSA cul-de-sacs. Get to the front, TSA guy barks at you to go to the back of the adjacent NOS. Your bags will go on without you.
I said no thank you.
Well, he was going to show me. We know jes how to deal with the likes of you. I had to wait to be groped. And groped I was. Everywhere.
I do mean everywhere.
The opt-out punishment took about twenty minutes, enough to risk missing my flight.
People, I say enough is enough.
I'm not going to bother recycling my reasons for protesting this.
You know them all.
There isn't one single thing about this that's right.
I'd say a little civil disobedience is in order here, but I doubt that would work.
What's needed is a LOT of civil disobedience.
Slow it down, gum it up, grind it to a screeching stop.
Make them dot every i and cross every t.
Every time.
Every airport.
Every city.
Every flight.
Here's an example, from a great post here at Flyertalk:
1. I require a private screening
2. I require that you change your gloves, with a fresh pair from an original package or an EMS/FD-style belt pouch (from a pocket is not acceptable)
3. I require that all of my possessions remain in my direct line of sight at all times, with the only acceptable blockage being the time items are being passed through the X-Ray - any failures on this part will result in a report to my corporate Security Officer for federal reporting compliance
4. You will wait while I note the time of this unconstitutional gate grope for tracking purposes should I miss my original flight despite being in the gatehouse in compliance with the airline's policies
That's what I'm talking about.
Can I hear an amen?
Ok, then how about some more like that?
This is my country too.
At least for now.
Last edited by Podcat; Apr 1, 2010 at 8:13 pm
Apr 1, 2010 | 8:03 pm
#2
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Berlin and Buggenhagen, Germany
Posts: 3,509
I couldn't agree more!!! When will it stop?
I recently thought of another thing but don't know if that's feasible. Do they have pre-printed complaint forms? If so, one could ask for such a form as soon as the ID checker is done with your ID. Every time. Just in case.
After all, they control you every time, too. Just in case. So you ask for the complaint form, too. Psychologically this can go two ways. They get so pissed they will do the full program to you. But the more they do, the more they mess up. Of course, you don't want to tell them to use new gloves because you want to denounce them for not using new gloves in the complaint form. See the system?
The other way this could play out is that they actually get intimidated or don't want to risk backing up the line because of a potential troublemaker and your process will be smooth as butter. In which case you should thank them and compliment them. Positive affirmation after thread of reprimand. Very effective tool psychologically.
Till
I recently thought of another thing but don't know if that's feasible. Do they have pre-printed complaint forms? If so, one could ask for such a form as soon as the ID checker is done with your ID. Every time. Just in case.
After all, they control you every time, too. Just in case. So you ask for the complaint form, too. Psychologically this can go two ways. They get so pissed they will do the full program to you. But the more they do, the more they mess up. Of course, you don't want to tell them to use new gloves because you want to denounce them for not using new gloves in the complaint form. See the system?
The other way this could play out is that they actually get intimidated or don't want to risk backing up the line because of a potential troublemaker and your process will be smooth as butter. In which case you should thank them and compliment them. Positive affirmation after thread of reprimand. Very effective tool psychologically.
Till
Apr 1, 2010 | 8:14 pm
#3
Join Date: May 2006
Location: MYF/CMA/SAN
Programs: COdbaUA MM, AA EXP, AF G, Bonbon Gold, Hilton G, All G, GHA Titanium, Hertz PC, Avis Presidential
Posts: 5,929
Enough already time has already passed.
You can also call TSA and do a complaint by phone. I now carry their little blue card in my pocket and can pull it out and call right there.
I couldn't agree more!!! When will it stop?
I recently thought of another thing but don't know if that's feasible. Do they have pre-printed complaint forms? If so, one could ask for such a form as soon as the ID checker is done with your ID. Every time. Just in case.
After all, they control you every time, too. Just in case. So you ask for the complaint form, too. Psychologically this can go two ways. They get so pissed they will do the full program to you. But the more they do, the more they mess up. Of course, you don't want to tell them to use new gloves because you want to denounce them for not using new gloves in the complaint form. See the system?
The other way this could play out is that they actually get intimidated or don't want to risk backing up the line because of a potential troublemaker and your process will be smooth as butter. In which case you should thank them and compliment them. Positive affirmation after thread of reprimand. Very effective tool psychologically.
Till
I recently thought of another thing but don't know if that's feasible. Do they have pre-printed complaint forms? If so, one could ask for such a form as soon as the ID checker is done with your ID. Every time. Just in case.
After all, they control you every time, too. Just in case. So you ask for the complaint form, too. Psychologically this can go two ways. They get so pissed they will do the full program to you. But the more they do, the more they mess up. Of course, you don't want to tell them to use new gloves because you want to denounce them for not using new gloves in the complaint form. See the system?
The other way this could play out is that they actually get intimidated or don't want to risk backing up the line because of a potential troublemaker and your process will be smooth as butter. In which case you should thank them and compliment them. Positive affirmation after thread of reprimand. Very effective tool psychologically.
Till
Apr 1, 2010 | 9:57 pm
#4
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Programs: American Airlines, Delta Air Lines, Rapids Reward
Posts: 40,088
Apr 1, 2010 | 10:08 pm
#5
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Programs: Star Alliance, One World, Skyteam, BR, GA, EK, VX, SPG, Marriott, Hyatt, Hilton, IC
Posts: 4,066
Apr 2, 2010 | 1:24 am
#6
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Programs: American Airlines, Delta Air Lines, Rapids Reward
Posts: 40,088
Apr 2, 2010 | 5:28 am
#7
Suspended
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 4,953
First Liquid Logic. No more free water, and (for me) no more carry-on only.
Next, Gate Gropes. Fear and loathing at the boarding gate, for whatever they missed at security.
The final chapter?
Coming soon, to EVERY AIRPORT WITH NO OPT-OUT: The Nude-O-Scope!
That's just about enough for me.
Flew out of LAS on a late Sunday (way off-peak). Ever driven home on a usually-jammed Interstate way late, looking forward to having all five lanes to yourself? Only to find four lanes closed off by the Highway Patrol so they could run the street sweeper? It was like that.
Three Nude-O-Scopes in full swing, with TSA dicks barking at the lambs approaching the rotating knives. Other lanes that appeared to be opt-out, but which actually lead nowhere. That's right, litle TSA cul-de-sacs. Get to the front, TSA guy barks at you to go to the back of the adjacent NOS. Your bags will go on without you.
I said no thank you.
Well, he was going to show me. We know jes how to deal with the likes of you. I had to wait to be groped. And groped I was. Everywhere.
I do mean everywhere.
The opt-out punishment took about twenty minutes, enough to risk missing my flight.
People, I say enough is enough.
I'm not going to bother recycling my reasons for protesting this.
You know them all.
There isn't one single thing about this that's right.
I'd say a little civil disobedience is in order here, but I doubt that would work.
What's needed is a LOT of civil disobedience.
Slow it down, gum it up, grind it to a screeching stop.
Make them dot every i and cross every t.
Every time.
Every airport.
Every city.
Every flight.
Here's an example, from a great post here at Flyertalk:
1. I require a private screening
2. I require that you change your gloves, with a fresh pair from an original package or an EMS/FD-style belt pouch (from a pocket is not acceptable)
3. I require that all of my possessions remain in my direct line of sight at all times, with the only acceptable blockage being the time items are being passed through the X-Ray - any failures on this part will result in a report to my corporate Security Officer for federal reporting compliance
4. You will wait while I note the time of this unconstitutional gate grope for tracking purposes should I miss my original flight despite being in the gatehouse in compliance with the airline's policies
That's what I'm talking about.
Can I hear an amen?
Ok, then how about some more like that?
This is my country too.
At least for now.
Next, Gate Gropes. Fear and loathing at the boarding gate, for whatever they missed at security.
The final chapter?
Coming soon, to EVERY AIRPORT WITH NO OPT-OUT: The Nude-O-Scope!
That's just about enough for me.
Flew out of LAS on a late Sunday (way off-peak). Ever driven home on a usually-jammed Interstate way late, looking forward to having all five lanes to yourself? Only to find four lanes closed off by the Highway Patrol so they could run the street sweeper? It was like that.
Three Nude-O-Scopes in full swing, with TSA dicks barking at the lambs approaching the rotating knives. Other lanes that appeared to be opt-out, but which actually lead nowhere. That's right, litle TSA cul-de-sacs. Get to the front, TSA guy barks at you to go to the back of the adjacent NOS. Your bags will go on without you.
I said no thank you.
Well, he was going to show me. We know jes how to deal with the likes of you. I had to wait to be groped. And groped I was. Everywhere.
I do mean everywhere.
The opt-out punishment took about twenty minutes, enough to risk missing my flight.
People, I say enough is enough.
I'm not going to bother recycling my reasons for protesting this.
You know them all.
There isn't one single thing about this that's right.
I'd say a little civil disobedience is in order here, but I doubt that would work.
What's needed is a LOT of civil disobedience.
Slow it down, gum it up, grind it to a screeching stop.
Make them dot every i and cross every t.
Every time.
Every airport.
Every city.
Every flight.
Here's an example, from a great post here at Flyertalk:
1. I require a private screening
2. I require that you change your gloves, with a fresh pair from an original package or an EMS/FD-style belt pouch (from a pocket is not acceptable)
3. I require that all of my possessions remain in my direct line of sight at all times, with the only acceptable blockage being the time items are being passed through the X-Ray - any failures on this part will result in a report to my corporate Security Officer for federal reporting compliance
4. You will wait while I note the time of this unconstitutional gate grope for tracking purposes should I miss my original flight despite being in the gatehouse in compliance with the airline's policies
That's what I'm talking about.
Can I hear an amen?
Ok, then how about some more like that?
This is my country too.
At least for now.
and thank you!
Last edited by doober; Apr 2, 2010 at 5:29 am Reason: too early in the morning.
Apr 2, 2010 | 5:35 am
#8
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: BOS and vicinity
Programs: Former UA 1P
Posts: 3,730
Agreed. "Enough already" was passed no later than when the war-on-water started.
The shoe carnival was (maybe) tolerable, but banning an entire state of matter is not, let alone banning it over an improbable threat.
The virtual strip search machines are so far beyond the line I can't explain it. In addition to the privacy issues, I hope that people at many levels will lose their careers, all of their assets, and their reputation when these devices are found to increase the risk of some medical issue. And I hope that a few of the leadership are sent to prison, permanently, over the issue. (I consider the identification of a medical threat to be inevitable; you just don't increase ionizing radiation dose across such a large number population with no consequences.)
The no-fly list and Secure Flight are also way beyond the line, but they are more abstract because most people are not directly impacted by them. But for those who are impacted, it sounds like an experience out of the USSR or East Germany, not something that is supposed to happen in the USA.
I have little doubt that the people who originally instituted airport "security" to deter hijackings with WTMDs and x-rays of carry-on would be horrified at what their decisions have led to. I suspect that the judges that originally ruled that such limited administrative searches were OK would be horrified that their rulings are now being used to justify strip searches of thousands of non-suspect American passengers.
I wasn't alive then, but in hindsight, during the hijacking craze of the 60s/70s that led to airport security, I think we would have been better off putting a pair of armed LEOs on every flight until the threat subsided and skipping the searches all together. Without the (fairly harmless) WTMD and x-ray as a way of testing the waters and conditioning the people, nothing else we have today would pass muster. If/when bombing became a threat, a limited screening based entirely on explosives detection (e.g., ETD) could then have been instituted.
Instead we have a risk averse TSA insisting on 100% ban on water, widespread strip searches, and 100% humiliation of anyone who dares have a prosthetic or personal medical device that they would rather not discuss in public.
The shoe carnival was (maybe) tolerable, but banning an entire state of matter is not, let alone banning it over an improbable threat.
The virtual strip search machines are so far beyond the line I can't explain it. In addition to the privacy issues, I hope that people at many levels will lose their careers, all of their assets, and their reputation when these devices are found to increase the risk of some medical issue. And I hope that a few of the leadership are sent to prison, permanently, over the issue. (I consider the identification of a medical threat to be inevitable; you just don't increase ionizing radiation dose across such a large number population with no consequences.)
The no-fly list and Secure Flight are also way beyond the line, but they are more abstract because most people are not directly impacted by them. But for those who are impacted, it sounds like an experience out of the USSR or East Germany, not something that is supposed to happen in the USA.
I have little doubt that the people who originally instituted airport "security" to deter hijackings with WTMDs and x-rays of carry-on would be horrified at what their decisions have led to. I suspect that the judges that originally ruled that such limited administrative searches were OK would be horrified that their rulings are now being used to justify strip searches of thousands of non-suspect American passengers.
I wasn't alive then, but in hindsight, during the hijacking craze of the 60s/70s that led to airport security, I think we would have been better off putting a pair of armed LEOs on every flight until the threat subsided and skipping the searches all together. Without the (fairly harmless) WTMD and x-ray as a way of testing the waters and conditioning the people, nothing else we have today would pass muster. If/when bombing became a threat, a limited screening based entirely on explosives detection (e.g., ETD) could then have been instituted.
Instead we have a risk averse TSA insisting on 100% ban on water, widespread strip searches, and 100% humiliation of anyone who dares have a prosthetic or personal medical device that they would rather not discuss in public.
Apr 2, 2010 | 9:02 am
#10
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 364
As disgusting as it is, it is amazing that we as a whole allow this to happen.
The government has unlimited resources to institute anything that they deem necessary for our safety. In reality it has nothing to do with safety. It is about control, and getting people to conform to a set of standards.
Where can individuals that are truly disgusted with all this nonsense turn for any relief? Probably nowhere, because even minor dissent will invite even more scrutiny of one's self by the very government that claims is there for your safety.
So just what is the breaking point? When will enough people be so disgusted that something happens? I doubt it will happen in our lifetime.
The government has effectively convinced enough people that we must fear the unknown and keep fighting a battle that doesn't exist.
Sad to say this about the USA, but it is no longer "Land of the free, home of the brave".
The government has unlimited resources to institute anything that they deem necessary for our safety. In reality it has nothing to do with safety. It is about control, and getting people to conform to a set of standards.
Where can individuals that are truly disgusted with all this nonsense turn for any relief? Probably nowhere, because even minor dissent will invite even more scrutiny of one's self by the very government that claims is there for your safety.
So just what is the breaking point? When will enough people be so disgusted that something happens? I doubt it will happen in our lifetime.
The government has effectively convinced enough people that we must fear the unknown and keep fighting a battle that doesn't exist.
Sad to say this about the USA, but it is no longer "Land of the free, home of the brave".
Apr 2, 2010 | 4:29 pm
#13
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ORD / DUB / LHR
Programs: UA 1K MM; BA Silver; Marriott Plat
Posts: 8,240
Why don't you all stay at home furiously pounding out letters to your elected representatives?
You could call it the Anti-TSA-Triple-WhammyTM:
1. You would cause massive, unsustainable revenue loss to the airlines, causing them to take notice
2. The TSA would not be able to survive the onslaught of fearful politicians, all terrified of losing their seats
3. The airports would be significantly quieter for the rest of us
You could call it the Anti-TSA-Triple-WhammyTM:
1. You would cause massive, unsustainable revenue loss to the airlines, causing them to take notice
2. The TSA would not be able to survive the onslaught of fearful politicians, all terrified of losing their seats
3. The airports would be significantly quieter for the rest of us
Apr 2, 2010 | 5:01 pm
#14
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 30,971
Why don't you all stay at home furiously pounding out letters to your elected representatives?
You could call it the Anti-TSA-Triple-WhammyTM:
1. You would cause massive, unsustainable revenue loss to the airlines, causing them to take notice
2. The TSA would not be able to survive the onslaught of fearful politicians, all terrified of losing their seats
3. The airports would be significantly quieter for the rest of us
You could call it the Anti-TSA-Triple-WhammyTM:
1. You would cause massive, unsustainable revenue loss to the airlines, causing them to take notice
2. The TSA would not be able to survive the onslaught of fearful politicians, all terrified of losing their seats
3. The airports would be significantly quieter for the rest of us
Do you have a point that would exceed your acceptance of TSA procedures?
If so what would it be?
Apr 2, 2010 | 5:06 pm
#15
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ORD / DUB / LHR
Programs: UA 1K MM; BA Silver; Marriott Plat
Posts: 8,240
Far from it. Don't jump to conclusions. Or to be precise - don't mistake pragmatism for support for the TSA and their ridiculous policies. Seriously - there's a big difference.Please see any number of additional threads on the subject. Repeating myself apparently doesn't work
The fact remains though that I have to travel - a lot. At least with this proposal there'll be a bunch of people writing all those extra letters while I'm getting on with my life / job.