TSA wielding Magic Paper?
 

Seems like it is just this week I've read about the TSA waving some kind of magic paper over travelers liquids.

What is up with that? Is it like my magic rock, or is there something about it?

It wouldn't surprise me to discover that it was simply psychological theater like the rest of their antics. Similar to the earlier, now discontinued, practice of ordering everyone to "freeze" for some limited period of time, presumably hoping to frighten some bad guy into running. . .

Keep piling hay onto the stack, TSA.

Check out this thread: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ages-gate.html

...you sure it isn't the kind of paper that addresses whether a bear does it in the woods?

That is where I read about it. What is the story behind the Magic Paper?

State of the art tech in 2006 was some peroxide sensors, but it looks like they want to actually dip them in.

These tests require swabbing.

As does this one.

OSU says it is a hard process, but they have something that might work on vapors.

Maybe TSA is just using these commercial strips, they're relatively cheap and it makes good security theatre to wave a wand over the bottles.

During the next year we should see the job posting for the position of TSA Shaman coming up.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

yeah, those strips have been around for a while. i know the strips at my airport were always expired but we were told to use them anyway.:td:

So a valid question to the TSO wielding the strips might be "has the use by date on those strips passed and if so then why are you using them?"

Actors never drink real wine or stab anyone on a stage. Always remember its "Security Theater" to calm the masses and keep those tickets selling.

MisterNice

That definitely would be a valid question.

Thanks for taking the time to post these links. Have you found any info for the non-dipping test strips?

I did a search for non-dipping test strips and came up with NOTHING.

The only thing I've found was related to colorimetric testing which might be consistent with anecdotal evidence.

LINK

If it is in fact peroxide they are trying to detect with these strips, the volatility is quite low, and when it degrades it generates ordinary oxygen. As a result, if no dipping is used, I would contend that the chances of getting a false negative are very high (and that is without considering that they are using expired ones).

I'm failing to see the logic here. All liquids consumed in the sterile area (save for baby formula and medication) have to come from WITHIN the sterile area. Doesn't it make more sense for TSA to 'randomly select' deliveries of drinks, ingredients, etc. going into sterile area vendors than it does to hassle the passengers?

Oh, right...logic doesn't apply where the TSA is concerned.

Your brain is far to feeble to understand.

As I posted in the related thread, there is a TSA powerpoint on the SITA website with pictures of these strips. It indicates they are used for pH testing.
http://www.sita.aero/file/2419/Secur...18Mar2009.pptx

Good one! But don't shamans have to have years of training, as well as skill and talent?

Alas, I have been found out. :( :eek:

They are very similar to Ph strips you would use to test a swimming pool. I would be willing to bet that they are supposed to dipped into a liquid.

Sounds like the TSA might soon be in the market for some Sniffex devices -- dowsing rods for explosives.

Notwithstanding the above, apparently they are still being used in Iraq by Iraqi forces.

Should be a perfect fit for the TSA.

Only if they add another "0" to the price! ;)

You'd lose. Hence the term, non-dipping test strips. I've seen these at MKE. They have a small pad on one side that is the testing medium. I've seen them on the floor occasionally, apparently not being disposed of properly.

pH test strips are dipped and react to the pH of the liquid, which is either acidic, neutral, or alkaline.

Since you seem to be in the know, can you tell us what chemical property these non-dipping test strips are designed to detect? I ask because, knowing the basic chemistry of hydrogen peroxide (which seems to be what they are all worried about), I don´t see how it could be reliably detected with a non-dipping strip.

They could probably detect certain ammonia compounds, but you could smell those quicker and easier than a wave over the bottle indicator paper.

Absolutely. They could detect volatile compounds in general. On the other hand, peroxide volatility is quite low.

Wish I could tell you, but I don't know. All I can report is what I have seen. I spent an hour googling for info one time but was unable to find any info regarding these. In this same thread, both Mr. Gel-pack and AngryMiller also had no success finding info on them. In another thread, I had asked TSORon about these and what liquid explosives they are designed to detect but he stated he could not divulge any info on them. The container for these that I saw was unmarked. If I look up any other equipment that TSA uses, there is plenty of open source info on these. However, to date, I have not found any open source info on the non-dipping test strips.

Well, I can give you my expert opinion (you´ll have to trust me that I know something about this) that no non-dip stick could reliably detect hydrogen peroxide. So they make a big deal about peroxides, prohibit contact solution that contains it, etc, but use a test that can´t detect it.

(emphasis mine)
Nobody from TSA is coming anywhere near my gear with some "testing" supply that comes out of an unmarked bottle. If I don't have the ability to locate an MSDS for a chemical product, it ain't getting in close proximity to me (sorry, too many years in the firehouse and too many HazMat classes).

Of course, my guess at the reason for the unmarked bottle - TSA knows some people will search for information, find out that it is more BS theater and post on the 'net.

I, too, spent a long time looking for such, using every combination of search terms I could come up with, and found nothing.

So they must, indeed, be magic.

Their magic paper is more powerful than your magic rock. Magic paper can be defeated only by magic scissors.

And they took those away from us! I KNEW there was a reason other than, "security." ;)

Naw, the TSA just has a complete clampdown on the procurement process, vendors and MSDS materials. And we know how good they are at trying to keep stuff secret. :D

Anyone else seen the magic strips at work yet? We had our fellow FTer have that SEA experience. Anyone else have to tell Comrade TSO to pound sand on this?

I had my prescription mouthwash go through the magic paper test in DFW a little over 2 years ago. So it is not that new.

There is no open source info out there on non-dipping test strips, including the ones we are talking about, so your statement that "no non-dip stick could reliably detect hydrogen peroxide" is invalid. Without info regarding the manufacturer and capabilities of these non-dipping test strips, any statements for or against them are just conjecture.

Also, hydrogen peroxide by itself does not make a liquid explosive. I believe it is an oxidizer, which burns rather than explodes.

They only test liquids with these non-dipping test strips. However, I see your point. Without knowing anything about these, though, including their chemical composition, it's premature to make any statements for or against them.

I'm a patient person. I will continue to look on the Internet, from time to time, to search for info on them.

Without any knowledge of them, it is absolutely appropriate to make a negative statement about them.

I will say it again - none of that drek is going anywhere near any item I am going to ingest without my being able to see appropriate safety information in the form of an MSDS or being able to research the materials with the manufacturer of record. Based on personal observations, both of the components of this testing system are stored in unmarked containers, which is a violation of OSHA standards according to my HazMat instructors. The TSA is obfuscating this issue behind SSI...the intentional "trust us, it's for security" attitudes don't cut it.

Regarding the bolded statements, your opinion, not mine.

Regarding the non-bolded statement on the safety issue, point taken.

I encountered these "strips" this week for the first time. As a result, searched here and found the thread. This "strips test" is about as ridiculous as having to take my wallet out of my pocket and place it on the belt because it is "oversized." Why was the TSA agent looking at my rear in the first place?

Has anyone else ever been through security at BTV, those people are ruthless. Not to mention the ratio of agents/travelers is just absurd. I'm guessing it's due to the proximity to Canada, but still...

Prurient interest?

:td::td: