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-   -   Why the terrorists will always win with our current mentality (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/1036606-why-terrorists-will-always-win-our-current-mentality.html)

Superguy Jan 6, 2010 8:40 pm

Why the terrorists will always win with our current mentality
 
We've had a bad couple weeks when it comes to security. We saw the underwear bomber, the EWR terminal dump, putting more FAMs on planes is a race against time, etc.

We look at the knee jerk reactions we see in place. 1 hour no pee rules, nothing on the laps, etc, etc. All the CYA.

I think I understand why.

Only one real way to say this. If Mel Brooks only knew the sad commentary he was making about society 20 years into the future. Sad thing is, I thought this was funny as a kid, that good would never be this dumb. Apparently, it is.

http://de.motiv.me/wp-content/upload...od_is_dumb.jpg

Looking at the clip here (at about 1:20):

http://www.evtv1.com/player.aspx?itemnum=1938

The bad guy does stupid tricks. The good guys fall for them. And who wins? Not the good guy. And of course, the bad guy is laughing his arse off.

I don't know ... it's just depressing seeing how clueless our government is, to watch them keep playing into these idiots' hands, and feeling practically powerless to stop it.

Super

tommyleo Jan 6, 2010 8:44 pm


Originally Posted by Superguy (Post 13128949)
I don't know ... it's just depressing seeing how clueless our government is, to watch them keep playing into these idiots' hands, and feeling practically powerless to stop it.


But I thought Bush was the idiot and Obama was the bright one. Isn't that why this country celebrated like crazy when Obama was elected?

Lesson: don't expect much from your president. Any president.

Superguy Jan 6, 2010 8:46 pm


Originally Posted by tommyleo (Post 13128978)
But I thought Bush was the idiot and Obama was the bright one. Isn't that why this country celebrated like crazy when Obama was elected?

Lesson: don't expect much from your president. Any president.

Not to take this into Omni P/R territory, but both are idiots - just different kinds.

halls120 Jan 6, 2010 8:48 pm


Originally Posted by tommyleo (Post 13128978)
But I thought Bush was the idiot and Obama was the bright one. Isn't that why this country celebrated like crazy when Obama was elected?

Lesson: don't expect much from your president. Any president.

Years from now, when our grandchildren study history, TSA and the construction of the Maginot Line will be discussed as prime examples of governments looking backward instead of forward.

us2 Jan 7, 2010 12:21 am

Terrorists win with the current mentality because we allow ourselves to be terrorized. I shudder to think what this country would do if it was faced with REAL terror, such as was faced by Britain circa 1940-45.

This nation survived 40-odd years with the very real prospect of a nuclear holocaust that would have caused an unimaginable level of death and destruction. Somehow, we managed to cope with that and to do so in a manner that, generally but not completely, did not gut our Constitution and basic values. Yet, when confronted with a handful of lunatic fanatics who lack the ability to destroy us, we seem hell-bent on destroying ourselves with a response that is completely out of proportion to the threat we face and, in the process, wreak a level of violence on our basic values that tens of thousands of Soviet nuclear warheads could not do.

At the beginning of the new Administration, I had hoped that we might finally find a calmer approach to dealing with terrorism that put it into a proper perspective as a risk to our lives. The response of the past few weeks would seem to indicate that my hope was misplaced. The hand-wringing and bed-wetting over terrorism continues, which is a sad state of affairs indeed.

debua1k Jan 7, 2010 8:10 am


Originally Posted by us2 (Post 13130197)
Terrorists win with the current mentality because we allow ourselves to be terrorized. I shudder to think what this country would do if it was faced with REAL terror, such as was faced by Britain circa 1940-45.

This nation survived 40-odd years with the very real prospect of a nuclear holocaust that would have caused an unimaginable level of death and destruction. Somehow, we managed to cope with that and to do so in a manner that, generally but not completely, did not gut our Constitution and basic values. Yet, when confronted with a handful of lunatic fanatics who lack the ability to destroy us, we seem hell-bent on destroying ourselves with a response that is completely out of proportion to the threat we face and, in the process, wreak a level of violence on our basic values that tens of thousands of Soviet nuclear warheads could not do.

At the beginning of the new Administration, I had hoped that we might finally find a calmer approach to dealing with terrorism that put it into a proper perspective as a risk to our lives. The response of the past few weeks would seem to indicate that my hope was misplaced. The hand-wringing and bed-wetting over terrorism continues, which is a sad state of affairs indeed.


Beautifully put!

makfan Jan 7, 2010 12:14 pm


Originally Posted by us2 (Post 13130197)
Terrorists win with the current mentality because we allow ourselves to be terrorized. I shudder to think what this country would do if it was faced with REAL terror, such as was faced by Britain circa 1940-45.

This nation survived 40-odd years with the very real prospect of a nuclear holocaust that would have caused an unimaginable level of death and destruction. Somehow, we managed to cope with that and to do so in a manner that, generally but not completely, did not gut our Constitution and basic values. Yet, when confronted with a handful of lunatic fanatics who lack the ability to destroy us, we seem hell-bent on destroying ourselves with a response that is completely out of proportion to the threat we face and, in the process, wreak a level of violence on our basic values that tens of thousands of Soviet nuclear warheads could not do.

At the beginning of the new Administration, I had hoped that we might finally find a calmer approach to dealing with terrorism that put it into a proper perspective as a risk to our lives. The response of the past few weeks would seem to indicate that my hope was misplaced. The hand-wringing and bed-wetting over terrorism continues, which is a sad state of affairs indeed.

+1, especially the final paragraph.

mikeef Jan 7, 2010 12:21 pm


Originally Posted by us2 (Post 13130197)
Terrorists win with the current mentality because we allow ourselves to be terrorized. I shudder to think what this country would do if it was faced with REAL terror, such as was faced by Britain circa 1940-45.

This nation survived 40-odd years with the very real prospect of a nuclear holocaust that would have caused an unimaginable level of death and destruction. Somehow, we managed to cope with that and to do so in a manner that, generally but not completely, did not gut our Constitution and basic values. Yet, when confronted with a handful of lunatic fanatics who lack the ability to destroy us, we seem hell-bent on destroying ourselves with a response that is completely out of proportion to the threat we face and, in the process, wreak a level of violence on our basic values that tens of thousands of Soviet nuclear warheads could not do.

At the beginning of the new Administration, I had hoped that we might finally find a calmer approach to dealing with terrorism that put it into a proper perspective as a risk to our lives. The response of the past few weeks would seem to indicate that my hope was misplaced. The hand-wringing and bed-wetting over terrorism continues, which is a sad state of affairs indeed.

Part of the issue, and I'm not commenting on whether I think this is good or bad, is that there are so many more outlets for news now. The internet and widespread television have made talking heads, no matter how idiotic they were, widely available to scare the crap out of anyone. Media isn't about the news, it's about ratings, and he who scares the most people wins.

Mike

rico567 Jan 7, 2010 12:29 pm


Originally Posted by halls120 (Post 13129006)
Years from now, when our grandchildren study history, TSA and the construction of the Maginot Line will be discussed as prime examples of governments looking backward instead of forward.

Which, in turn, is inevitable, given the unreliability of crystal balls. What we engage in when these things happen is also a syndrome; it's called "Monday morning quarterbacking."

mikeef Jan 7, 2010 12:55 pm


Originally Posted by rico567 (Post 13133840)
Which, in turn, is inevitable, given the unreliability of crystal balls. What we engage in when these things happen is also a syndrome; it's called "Monday morning quarterbacking."

Here's what really scares me: What happens when the terrorists decide, "We've had enough of airports. Instead, we're going to set off bombs in podunk towns in each of the 50 states, with a few extras thrown in at random. We're going to try and show you that we can hit you anywhere, at anytime, and that no one is safe." Mass panic, martial law and all of our worst tendencies would immediately come out. Fighting yesterday's war is going to get us nothing except probes at the airport.

Mike

jjwjjw Jan 7, 2010 1:13 pm

It would sure be nice if we could have an agency that is proactive about these things instead of reactive. Makes you wonder if they've ever heard of a brainstorming session. Why can't they just get together and ask everyone, "If I was a bad guy, what would I do?"

Ken hAAmer Jan 7, 2010 1:31 pm


Originally Posted by mikeef (Post 13133801)
Part of the issue...

Another part of the issue, I'm convinced, is the number of people who have a vested intersted in keeping things the way they are. Everybody from managers in the TSA whose salary is dependent upon their budget, security "experts" who write books, equipment manufacturers, contracted security companies, the news media selling their "scary time" ratings, to who knows, is benefiting from the "current mentality."

Those people will see no reason to change.

4444 Jan 7, 2010 1:36 pm


Originally Posted by mikeef (Post 13134040)
Here's what really scares me: What happens when the terrorists decide, "We've had enough of airports. Instead, we're going to set off bombs in podunk towns in each of the 50 states, with a few extras thrown in at random. We're going to try and show you that we can hit you anywhere, at anytime, and that no one is safe." Mass panic, martial law and all of our worst tendencies would immediately come out. Fighting yesterday's war is going to get us nothing except probes at the airport.

Mike

great point mike. real terror. bomb the mall down the street. hit the supermarket or, god forbid, a few schools. we would have to adjust our lives. if people in power would just admit, to the masses, that we cannot beat terrorism maybe we could move on with our lives. i can accept the fact that air travel cannot be 100% safe. i still like my chances and will take them. i do not let fear dictate. we have a society that demands answers even if there are none. our politicians love to string us along. some say it would be a bad political move to tell the truth. it would show a weakness. how much weaker can we be? hell you can now shut down an entire airport by just using the phone to call in a threat. from bombs to boxcutters the only real weapon the terrorist need is fear and every single american has some. we need to be a little more thick skinned and it is not in our nature.

4444 Jan 7, 2010 1:40 pm


Originally Posted by Ken hAAmer (Post 13134306)
Another part of the issue, I'm convinced, is the number of people who have a vested intersted in keeping things the way they are. Everybody from managers in the TSA whose salary is dependent upon their budget, security "experts" who write books, equipment manufacturers, contracted security companies, the news media selling their "scary time" ratings, to who knows, is benefiting from the "current mentality."

Those people will see no reason to change.

how true. the mayor of ny says that the terror trial will cost the city over 200 million dollars next year and the same for every year after. ahh 200 million? are ya fvckin kidding me? lol. every year after? there is no other reason to drag something out that long EXCEPT that all the "boys" are getting rich.

YVR Cockroach Jan 7, 2010 1:47 pm


Originally Posted by Ken hAAmer (Post 13134306)
Another part of the issue, I'm convinced, is the number of people who have a vested intersted in keeping things the way they are. Everybody from managers in the TSA whose salary is dependent upon their budget, security "experts" who write books, equipment manufacturers, contracted security companies, the news media selling their "scary time" ratings, to who knows, is benefiting from the "current mentality."

Those people will see no reason to change.

Much like the whole industry built up around the War on Drugs (sm).


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