Attacking people and attacking positions are not the same thing. And thoughtful attack/defense is precisely what happens and should happen in discussion and argumentation: positions are in fact attacked (and should be). Defending one's positions and making one's positions stronger by offering in turn new evidence, etc., is how discussion works. None of that has anything whatsoever to do with attacking people.

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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Unfortunately, it is the attacks on others that have driven away some of the most valuable and, IMHO, interesting posters.

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If their arguments were bad and if they were unable to understand the distinction between a spirited debate on their positions and an attack on them personally, then so be it.

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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">...we aren't running for office here and don't need to sling mud...

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I'm not sure what that has to do with discussing and arguing positions. It appears a non-sequitur to me.

Yeah, let's stereotype.

Punki - the swiss may even be more orderly than our northern neighbours ... I am glad you didn't use my country in that (somehow negativ comment about northern 'behaviour') comparison ...

I think I can see the 'Latin v/s German' type distinction daily on these boards.

There is a difference for sure. And yes, 'Latin' is more fun. IMHO. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

We have seen a ton of threads here about the Moderation style of patron for instance on the Lufthansa Forum. Gerhard is Austrian, and has a very cut and dried interpretation of what is and is not "possible" in the LH forum. The "currywurst" thread is of course an obvious example. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

In many folks from this area there is IMO little gray in their approach to most things. There is black, and there is white. And very little in between. That is not a bad thing at all some times.

I like him, and accept that is how he thinks, and how he moderates. And those on the LH board seem happy with that too.

OTOH - Australians are generally more Latin than Latins, (and I can say that without fear of bias!) and are very Laissez-Faire. We are easy going folks, and let most of the balls go through to the keeper and do not stress about it.

Hey, Joh and I fly by choice to Puerto Rico soon for a short break. And to Argentina and Brazil for Xmas and we do that each year. The 'Latin' mind-set suits us. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Go check out the Qantas board as a comparison. Half the posts have nothing whatever to do with QF quite often, and those who visit there like it just fine like that. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I suspect if you reversed the moderators there would be mini riots on BOTH boards for a while. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

The same applies to the AC board. much off topic there but no one (at least no regular visitors) seem to mind.

Hmmmm, Rudi, what did you find negative in the observation that, in general, the Germans (as well as the Swiss, now that you mention it) are more orderly than Mexicans or Spaniards? Presumably, both are exactly the way they are, because that is the way they desire to be. One way is not more negative or positive than the other, just different.

In Germany, as you well know, if you make an appointment for 10:00 a.m., you are late at 10:01 a.m. Whereas in Mexico, an appointment for 10:00 a.m., might mean 11:00 or even 11:30. Even their respective trains understand this. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I am with Ozstamps in that I think a more relaxed style, creates a lot more enjoyable atmosphere. Others who feel more comfortable in an more strict and orderly environment, will naturally seek that as well. Both approaches are perfectly fine, just different. I just happen to prefer the former.

Sounds like maybe I am going to really love Australia. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

Si. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I think the real difference here on FLYERTALK is between those who 'get it', and those that don't.

Dan

May I suggest that This Site is a PRIME example of why certain people's ideas about moderation do NOT work.

However, since that site is still somewhat operational, I might suggest that those of you who think that FT is broken hang out there.

Sheez. All this noise about Latin/German "stereotyping" - http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif - especially from some of those who bemoan political correctness. And you guys travel? Do you put on your blinders when you do?

Punki/Oz are right.

I am so sick and tired of this constant whining about moderators and moderation.

They are here to stay and I think they are doing a great job.

The problem is, there will always be the "freedom of speech whiners" on any BBS.

Moderation - it's a tough job, but somebody's got to do it.... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I think it is sad that anyone who very politely expreses a difference of opionion, whether that opinion be that they prefer very rigid moderation or that they prefer very relaxed moderation, be pejoratively referred to as a whiner. I am sure that it is not Randy's intent that polite, reflective posters are personally attack for expressing their opinions.

If you have good ideas to add to the disussion, please do so, that will enliven and enrich the discussion. But the flinging of insults is not only uneccessary but also, IMHO, not in keeping with the spirit of FlyerTalk. Perhaps the Moderator of this forum can deal with that. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

It is obvious that there are many folk on FlyerTalk (including acting moderators) on both ends of the spectrum, and that is a very good thing. It is through that combination of perspectives that it will be possible to eventually come close to a workable, consistent moderation polilcy, somewhere in the middle of the two extremes.

Polite and reflective? Perhaps you'd better check the title of this thread again. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

It's not so much the discussion that annoys me, it's the fact that we seem to have to hold one of them every 2 weeks. Hasn't enough already been said about moderation? It's always the same people that come and complain about them so it's also the same arguement over and over again...

Good post, Punki. ("Whiner" is not a new word, of course, but only recently do you hear people use it with such frequency; it must be one of the words which has entered the common vocabulary due to its use on some sitcom, like "show me the money" did, or "d'uh" or "Hello????" - it's a word clearly employed to pejoratively describe those individuals who express ideas which dissent from the accuser's position.)

EDIT: Not that anyone participating HERE was doing that, but I just wanted to try to shed a little light on one way in which words can be unintentionally hurtful.

[This message has been edited by anonplz (edited 09-17-2003).]