AY to BOM, cancels SIN and KUL
Jan 22, 2007 | 11:07 pm
#16
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It's also a boon for economy class travellers who were previously crediting BA flights to AA's program -- particularly because AY, unlike BA, gives 100% miles on cheaper economy cabin fares to AAdvantage members.
Jan 22, 2007 | 11:42 pm
#17
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: country Western Australia
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Posts: 2,857
Recent AY BKK-HKG flight was cancelled for tech reasons and all moved to CX flight. There were 4 AY pax in business...
The fares exBKK (SIN and HKG) were low enough to probably irritate CX.
exSIN a bit higher.
I will miss the AY flights.
Happy wandering
Fred
The fares exBKK (SIN and HKG) were low enough to probably irritate CX.
exSIN a bit higher.
I will miss the AY flights.
Happy wandering
Fred
Jan 23, 2007 | 3:44 am
#18
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: LON
Programs: BA GFL, GGL, Amex Centurion, Bonvoy Platinum
Posts: 105
Wow... oneworld is finally paying some more attention to BOM, over DEL ^
Finnair should give some good relief from the regular hassles with BA, while taking flights to Europe / USA and still getting mileage...
By the way, I've always wondered - what exactly is a 5th freedom route? And while I'm at the FT glossary, what's a metal flight?
^ Finnair should give some good relief from the regular hassles with BA, while taking flights to Europe / USA and still getting mileage...
By the way, I've always wondered - what exactly is a 5th freedom route? And while I'm at the FT glossary, what's a metal flight?
Jan 23, 2007 | 6:50 am
#19
Moderator: LGBTQ+ Travel, India-based Airlines and India; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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And a counter example: BA between GIG-GRU does not have 5th-freedom rights. i.e. they cannot sell tickets between those two points. Only can sell GRU to/from LHR and GIG to/from LHR, but not between GRU and GIG.
Airline metal: BA flight operated on BA metal would be a BA flight operated by BA aircraft and crew. BA flight on QF metal would be a BA flight number (codeshare) but operated by QF on QF aircraft with QF crew.
Jan 23, 2007 | 10:30 am
#20
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Location: Portland OR Double Emerald (QF and AA), DL PM/MM, Starwood Plat
Posts: 19,593
That is a 6th or 7th freedom right (I forget which, they are rarely provided). Fifth freedom is far more limited: it is the right to sell tickets between 2 foreign airports on flights that originate or terminate in the home country. So BA can sell BKK-SYD only for flights that orginate and terminate in the UK; BA cannot operate FRA-BKK-SYD even if it had the rights for FRA-BKK. BA also couldn't open a base at BKK, station planes there, and have flights that just run BKK-SYD-BKK and not have the same plane and flight number go to/from LHR.
Jan 23, 2007 | 12:37 pm
#21
Moderator: LGBTQ+ Travel, India-based Airlines and India; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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That is a 6th or 7th freedom right (I forget which, they are rarely provided). Fifth freedom is far more limited: it is the right to sell tickets between 2 foreign airports on flights that originate or terminate in the home country. So BA can sell BKK-SYD only for flights that orginate and terminate in the UK; BA cannot operate FRA-BKK-SYD even if it had the rights for FRA-BKK. BA also couldn't open a base at BKK, station planes there, and have flights that just run BKK-SYD-BKK and not have the same plane and flight number go to/from LHR.
Jan 23, 2007 | 12:39 pm
#22
Moderator: LGBTQ+ Travel, India-based Airlines and India; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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FREEDOMS OF THE AIR
First Freedom of the Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State or States to fly across its territory without landing (also known as a First Freedom Right).
Second Freedom of the Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State or States to land in its territory for non-traffic purposes (also known as a Second Freedom Right).
Third Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to put down, in the territory of the first State, traffic coming from the home State of the carrier (also known as a Third Freedom Right).
Fourth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to take on, in the territory of the first State, traffic destined for the home State of the carrier (also known as a Fourth Freedom Right).
Fifth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to put down and to take on, in the territory of the first State, traffic coming from or destined to a third State (also known as a Fifth Freedom Right).
ICAO characterizes all "freedoms" beyond the Fifth as "so-called" because only the first five "freedoms" have been officially recognized as such by international treaty.
Sixth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, of transporting, via the home State of the carrier, traffic moving between two other States (also known as a Sixth Freedom Right). The so-called Sixth Freedom of the Air, unlike the first five freedoms, is not incorporated as such into any widely recognized air service agreements such as the "Five Freedoms Agreement".
Seventh Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State, of transporting traffic between the territory of the granting State and any third State with no requirement to include on such operation any point in the territory of the recipient State, i.e the service need not connect to or be an extension of any service to/from the home State of the carrier.
Eighth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, of transporting cabotage traffic between two points in the territory of the granting State on a service which originates or terminates in the home country of the foreign carrier or (in connection with the so-called Seventh Freedom of the Air) outside the territory of the granting State (also known as a Eighth Freedom Right or "consecutive cabotage").
Ninth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege of transporting cabotage traffic of the granting State on a service performed entirely within the territory of the granting State (also known as a Ninth Freedom Right or "stand alone" cabotage).
First Freedom of the Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State or States to fly across its territory without landing (also known as a First Freedom Right).
Second Freedom of the Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State or States to land in its territory for non-traffic purposes (also known as a Second Freedom Right).
Third Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to put down, in the territory of the first State, traffic coming from the home State of the carrier (also known as a Third Freedom Right).
Fourth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to take on, in the territory of the first State, traffic destined for the home State of the carrier (also known as a Fourth Freedom Right).
Fifth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State to put down and to take on, in the territory of the first State, traffic coming from or destined to a third State (also known as a Fifth Freedom Right).
ICAO characterizes all "freedoms" beyond the Fifth as "so-called" because only the first five "freedoms" have been officially recognized as such by international treaty.
Sixth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, of transporting, via the home State of the carrier, traffic moving between two other States (also known as a Sixth Freedom Right). The so-called Sixth Freedom of the Air, unlike the first five freedoms, is not incorporated as such into any widely recognized air service agreements such as the "Five Freedoms Agreement".
Seventh Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, granted by one State to another State, of transporting traffic between the territory of the granting State and any third State with no requirement to include on such operation any point in the territory of the recipient State, i.e the service need not connect to or be an extension of any service to/from the home State of the carrier.
Eighth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege, in respect of scheduled international air services, of transporting cabotage traffic between two points in the territory of the granting State on a service which originates or terminates in the home country of the foreign carrier or (in connection with the so-called Seventh Freedom of the Air) outside the territory of the granting State (also known as a Eighth Freedom Right or "consecutive cabotage").
Ninth Freedom of The Air - the right or privilege of transporting cabotage traffic of the granting State on a service performed entirely within the territory of the granting State (also known as a Ninth Freedom Right or "stand alone" cabotage).
Jan 25, 2007 | 8:06 am
#23
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AY daily to Osaka
Press Release
24 Jan 2007
Finnair launches daily flights to Osaka
Finnair will begin flying between Helsinki and Osaka, Japan daily from the end of May. Finnair's Helsinki-Nagoya return flights will also increase by one when frequencies are upped to four times a week from mid-June.
"Thanks to the additional frequencies, Finnair becomes the third largest western airline operating between Europe and Japan. Next summer Finnair will have two daily flights to Japan, when the current number of weekly flights goes up from 11 to 15 weekly operations," says Finnair VP Network Strategies and Management Petteri Kostermaa.
The airline doubled its Tokyo flights from two to four a week already last December. Finnair is the only airline in northern Europe with routes to all three most important Japanese cities: Tokyo, Osaka and Nagoya.
Finnair's long-haul fleet is growing as two new wide-bodied Airbus A340s enter traffic towards the end of spring. Tokyo and Nagoya routes will be operated with the large Airbuses, Boeing MD-11s are used on flights to Osaka.
Finnair Plc
Communications
24.1.2007
24 Jan 2007
Finnair launches daily flights to Osaka
Finnair will begin flying between Helsinki and Osaka, Japan daily from the end of May. Finnair's Helsinki-Nagoya return flights will also increase by one when frequencies are upped to four times a week from mid-June.
"Thanks to the additional frequencies, Finnair becomes the third largest western airline operating between Europe and Japan. Next summer Finnair will have two daily flights to Japan, when the current number of weekly flights goes up from 11 to 15 weekly operations," says Finnair VP Network Strategies and Management Petteri Kostermaa.
The airline doubled its Tokyo flights from two to four a week already last December. Finnair is the only airline in northern Europe with routes to all three most important Japanese cities: Tokyo, Osaka and Nagoya.
Finnair's long-haul fleet is growing as two new wide-bodied Airbus A340s enter traffic towards the end of spring. Tokyo and Nagoya routes will be operated with the large Airbuses, Boeing MD-11s are used on flights to Osaka.
Finnair Plc
Communications
24.1.2007
Jan 25, 2007 | 2:09 pm
#24
Join Date: Jun 2002
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Jan 27, 2007 | 3:50 pm
#25
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Helsinki-Vantaa APT, Finland
Programs: AY Platinum
Posts: 6,322
No, A343 is not larger than MD-11 but in this case large means Airbus 340-300. Finnair's small Airbuses are A319-321.
It says large Airbuses not larger.
Btw, wing span is larger in A343 than it is in MD-11. 343 has 60,30m and M11 has 51,66 meters.
It says large Airbuses not larger.
Btw, wing span is larger in A343 than it is in MD-11. 343 has 60,30m and M11 has 51,66 meters.
