16+ Segment Ticket
Mar 5, 2003 | 11:59 am
#2
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 540
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by uncertaintraveler:
(1) does anyone have any experience with this 16 segment "rule"? (2) Do surface segments really matter in ticketing the itinerary?</font>
(1) does anyone have any experience with this 16 segment "rule"? (2) Do surface segments really matter in ticketing the itinerary?</font>
(2) Surface sectors does not matter, but I doubt the RTW desk will take them off. When I showed up at YYZ airport to get it ticketed, the ticket agent had no problem removing the surface sectors to reduce the total segments down to 16, but he wasn't the RTW desk and didn't look forward to spending an hour writting
[This message has been edited by hsi.chang (edited 03-05-2003).]
Mar 5, 2003 | 12:34 pm
#4
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Scotland
Programs: AA Exec PLT; BA Silver
Posts: 273
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by uncertaintraveler:
Thanks. I tried to ticket my itinerary with BA once, but was told the LHR-Cairo segment was against their rules because I was going back to Asia (?!?) after leaving there. </font>
Thanks. I tried to ticket my itinerary with BA once, but was told the LHR-Cairo segment was against their rules because I was going back to Asia (?!?) after leaving there. </font>
Also, from checking the CX website they don't fly to/from CAI, so hard to see how this would work other than from insude EUR
[This message has been edited by DP-UK (edited 03-05-2003).]
Mar 5, 2003 | 12:51 pm
#7
In Memoriam
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Boca Raton, FL DL FO/MM AA EXP SPG PLT
Posts: 968
BTW, there is no reason to fear a handwritten ticket. I travelled through most of the cities you are going to and a bunch more, with a handwritten RTW last year, without any problems. The ticket is just a bunch of the standard, old, four segment tickets cross referenced and stapled together. I think I had about 30 total segments including a couple of "surface" connections.
Mar 5, 2003 | 1:09 pm
#8
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 46,126
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by ExMo:
BA RTW desk can be reached at 1-800-828-7797. Don't let them redefine the world's geography!</font>
BA RTW desk can be reached at 1-800-828-7797. Don't let them redefine the world's geography!</font>
Dave
Mar 5, 2003 | 4:13 pm
#9
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Edinburgh
Programs: Lowly BA Blue. One of the original easyJet Flight Club members and still am.
Posts: 4,319
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Dave Noble:
Other than the redefinition already in place of Cairo being in Europe rather than Africa ?
Dave</font>
Other than the redefinition already in place of Cairo being in Europe rather than Africa ?
Dave</font>
Mar 5, 2003 | 6:08 pm
#10
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Circle City
Posts: 3,568
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> (1) 16 segment rule is a SABRE limitation, and since you're booking through AA RTW Desk, you face this limitation. I believe if you book through BA you wouldn't have this issue, and they have more offices throughout your destinations making possible changes easier.
</font>
</font>
Mar 5, 2003 | 6:22 pm
#11
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Little dot in Asia
Programs: AA-PP, HL-DM, MR-LTP, HY-LTG
Posts: 26,017
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Darren:
That's an AA Sabre limit, not a Sabre limit. Sabre can book up to 24 or something.</font>
That's an AA Sabre limit, not a Sabre limit. Sabre can book up to 24 or something.</font>
HOWEVER, that said, all the taxes must still fit into the "fare calculation" box and if it exceeds, it must be handwritten. There is no way around that.
FYI - BA's computers, AMADEUS, can handle only something like 12 segments before it has to be handwritten. Only CX's system can handle more than the 24 segments but it requires creative ticketing in that they split the fare calculation and taxes into two seperate tickets. Not exactly kosher and if encountered with a reissue by another Oneworld airline, it will face problems.
FYI 2 - Hand written tickets are VALID forms of travel documentation as long as they are done correctly. Since AA is issuing the ticket, I would say they'd probably have more experience than the average travel agency with hardly any ticketing experience. Most agencies these days don't even know the difference between a NUC from an MCO!
[This message has been edited by Guy Betsy (edited 03-05-2003).]
Mar 5, 2003 | 6:42 pm
#12
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Seat 1A
Programs: Non-status paid F/J (best value for $$$)
Posts: 4,141
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Guy Betsy:
FYI - BA's computers, AMADEUS, can handle only something like 12 segments before it has to be handwritten. Only CX's system can handle more than the 24 segments but it requires creative ticketing in that they split the fare calculation and taxes into two seperate tickets. Not exactly kosher and if encountered with a reissue by another Oneworld airline, it will face problems.
[This message has been edited by Guy Betsy (edited 03-05-2003).]</font>
FYI - BA's computers, AMADEUS, can handle only something like 12 segments before it has to be handwritten. Only CX's system can handle more than the 24 segments but it requires creative ticketing in that they split the fare calculation and taxes into two seperate tickets. Not exactly kosher and if encountered with a reissue by another Oneworld airline, it will face problems.
[This message has been edited by Guy Betsy (edited 03-05-2003).]</font>
The following quoted from Worldspan Assistant:
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">"Guidelines for PNRs with More Than 16 Segments
If you need to Manually Price an itinerary that exceeds 16 segments, including ARNKs, the itinerary needs to be broken and two sets of tickets issued. The following guidelines should be used:
1. The customer or airline determines which segments should be issued on the first ticket.
2. Create a Manually Priced Multiple Ticketing Record using segment select (e.g., 4/R-S1-9#TR) to indicate the segments to be issued on the first ticket. When entering the fare calculation information, the fare calculation for the entire itinerary should be shown. The base, tax, and total fare should reflect the cost of the entire itinerary. My Note:--> This is probably the problem! (But can they somehow "condense" the fare calculation or maybe omit a "space" here and there to get it to fit ticket?, or have only a portion of the fare calculation for segments that are NOT on the set of ticket?)
My note: What about using part of the "endorsement" box to squeeze in some tax info? My RTW ticket issued by CX had some creative things like "2XQ4" instead of "Q4.00 Q4.00" in their fare calculation to get it to fit.
3. The remaining segments should be Manually Priced using the same guidelines shown in step 2 above (e.g., 4/R-S10-16#TR), creating a second ticketing record.
4. Issue the first set of tickets using TR1.
5. Issue the second set of tickets using TR2. If the form of payment is credit card, the approval code from the first set of tickets must be used to prevent debiting the credit card a second time.
6. The second ticket should be voided from the DDL/DDP immediately since ARC downloads ticket images to credit card companies nightly. This also prevents the amount from being doubled on the ARC report.
"</font>
If you need to Manually Price an itinerary that exceeds 16 segments, including ARNKs, the itinerary needs to be broken and two sets of tickets issued. The following guidelines should be used:
1. The customer or airline determines which segments should be issued on the first ticket.
2. Create a Manually Priced Multiple Ticketing Record using segment select (e.g., 4/R-S1-9#TR) to indicate the segments to be issued on the first ticket. When entering the fare calculation information, the fare calculation for the entire itinerary should be shown. The base, tax, and total fare should reflect the cost of the entire itinerary. My Note:--> This is probably the problem! (But can they somehow "condense" the fare calculation or maybe omit a "space" here and there to get it to fit ticket?, or have only a portion of the fare calculation for segments that are NOT on the set of ticket?)
My note: What about using part of the "endorsement" box to squeeze in some tax info? My RTW ticket issued by CX had some creative things like "2XQ4" instead of "Q4.00 Q4.00" in their fare calculation to get it to fit.
3. The remaining segments should be Manually Priced using the same guidelines shown in step 2 above (e.g., 4/R-S10-16#TR), creating a second ticketing record.
4. Issue the first set of tickets using TR1.
5. Issue the second set of tickets using TR2. If the form of payment is credit card, the approval code from the first set of tickets must be used to prevent debiting the credit card a second time.
6. The second ticket should be voided from the DDL/DDP immediately since ARC downloads ticket images to credit card companies nightly. This also prevents the amount from being doubled on the ARC report.
"</font>
Also, it says that "A Maxumum of 255 Ticket Records" can exist on one PNR" (thats 4080 segments, with 16 per ticket record)
http://globallearningcenter.wspan.co...m#introduction
[This message has been edited by daniellam (edited 03-05-2003).]
Mar 5, 2003 | 10:43 pm
#13
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: LAX
Posts: 3,641
If you dumped BA because their agent gave you an inane answer about CAI, the bad news is that it seems that all the airlines' once-unimpeachable rtw desks seem to have made a home for the occasional twit. It's an unfortunate fact of life in the new millennium. (Caveat: I haven't had any bad experiences with Cathay.)
A machine-printed ticket might be more legible, should you encounter an agent somewhere along the way who wants to check the details to make sure you were charged properly for taxes and fees for leaving his domain. With airlines that don't have mechanical limits, it depends on the agent's skill in stringing together the text that goes in the additional-fees box. Get a recommendation for a TA who's willing to ticket you on CX or QF stock and you'll have no problem.
A machine-printed ticket might be more legible, should you encounter an agent somewhere along the way who wants to check the details to make sure you were charged properly for taxes and fees for leaving his domain. With airlines that don't have mechanical limits, it depends on the agent's skill in stringing together the text that goes in the additional-fees box. Get a recommendation for a TA who's willing to ticket you on CX or QF stock and you'll have no problem.
Mar 6, 2003 | 10:40 am
#14
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 540
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Guy Betsy:
I concur. AA's CRS cannot issue more than 16 segments. But SABRE (ironically part of AA) can. All you need to do is to have a SABRE accessed agency take over your booking. (They can just 'takeover' electronically over their CRS) and issue your ticket if it is less than 24 segments.
</font>
I concur. AA's CRS cannot issue more than 16 segments. But SABRE (ironically part of AA) can. All you need to do is to have a SABRE accessed agency take over your booking. (They can just 'takeover' electronically over their CRS) and issue your ticket if it is less than 24 segments.
</font>