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Old Aug 16, 2011 | 7:23 pm
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Traveloguy
Firstly the legislation in place in the US still prevents this from happening, although retaining EU-US open skies depends on this changing soon.
The legislation isn't going to change in this Congress, no matter how badly investment bankers want it. It took sixteen years to allow Mexican trucks into the U.S. after NAFTA authorized it and appeals confirmed it, and that's trivial compared to the issue of majority foreign ownership of a U.S. carrier. It is simply politically impossible in this climate.
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Old Aug 17, 2011 | 12:18 am
  #17  
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Originally Posted by 3Cforme
The legislation isn't going to change in this Congress, no matter how badly investment bankers want it. It took sixteen years to allow Mexican trucks into the U.S. after NAFTA authorized it and appeals confirmed it, and that's trivial compared to the issue of majority foreign ownership of a U.S. carrier. It is simply politically impossible in this climate.
Members of Congress, like most all politicians, vote according to who stuffs their wallets. So if the industry puts up enough cash, it will happen. They will just spin it as a good thing for consumers, blah, blah, blah.

OTOH, if enough competing airlines (other than United which wants to merge with LH) manage to bribe enough politicians to prevent legislation, then...
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Old Aug 17, 2011 | 7:14 am
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Originally Posted by stimpy
Members of Congress, like most all politicians, vote according to who stuffs their wallets. So if the industry puts up enough cash, it will happen. They will just spin it as a good thing for consumers, blah, blah, blah.

OTOH, if enough competing airlines (other than United which wants to merge with LH) manage to bribe enough politicians to prevent legislation, then...
Completely agree.

I suspect AF/KL might be interested in doing something with DL too, so in theory we might have three transatlantic marriages should congress be willing. Many are keen to keep open skies so whilst I could see is being temporarily delayed, I suspect it will happen.
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Old Aug 18, 2011 | 10:46 pm
  #19  
 
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Cool

Originally Posted by stimpy
Members of Congress, like most all politicians, vote according to who stuffs their wallets. So if the industry puts up enough cash, it will happen. They will just spin it as a good thing for consumers, blah, blah, blah.

OTOH, if enough competing airlines (other than United which wants to merge with LH) manage to bribe enough politicians to prevent legislation, then...
On this issue, I don't think corruption will be enough to change the foreign ownership laws. This country is at such a low point that that idea of selling off part of our national transportation system won't pass congress. All the opponents need to do is raise the possibility of some chinese company owning an American airline, and the issue dies. Noone in congress wants to look like a traitor by approving selling out to china.

I know I will be calling my congressional representative when the issue comes up. As the recent airline profits prove, we don't need foreign ownership of our airlines.
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Old Aug 19, 2011 | 3:18 am
  #20  
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Originally Posted by ByrdluvsAWACO
On this issue, I don't think corruption will be enough to change the foreign ownership laws. This country is at such a low point that that idea of selling off part of our national transportation system won't pass congress. All the opponents need to do is raise the possibility of some chinese company owning an American airline, and the issue dies. Noone in congress wants to look like a traitor by approving selling out to china.

I know I will be calling my congressional representative when the issue comes up. As the recent airline profits prove, we don't need foreign ownership of our airlines.
Not to go all political (major airline mergers are inevitably political), but if politicians can trick the voters into believing they are sending our sons and daughters to die in Afghanistan and Iraq to keep our nation safe, then they can easily convince the voters that a UA-LH or IAG-AA "merger of equals" is good for all the nations involved.

And as this relates to US-EU Open Skies, the legislation could be easily written to exclude China.
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Old Aug 19, 2011 | 3:36 am
  #21  
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You guys are making me depressed about western politics and democratic...lol
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Old Aug 19, 2011 | 2:29 pm
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by stimpy
Not to go all political (major airline mergers are inevitably political), but if politicians can trick the voters into believing they are sending our sons and daughters to die in Afghanistan and Iraq to keep our nation safe, then they can easily convince the voters that a UA-LH or IAG-AA "merger of equals" is good for all the nations involved.
You're talking about two different states of emotion. Immediately after 9/11 it didn't take much to convince an angry, terrorized nation that attacking the taliban was needed.

Fast forward to a time when people are worried about their jobs, the economy, and the viability of the nation as a whole. I doubt any politician will be able to spin "the selling of America" to people facing such economic distress

Originally Posted by stimpy
And as this relates to US-EU Open Skies, the legislation could be easily written to exclude China.
It's just one step towards other foreign ownership. Politicians would obviously restrict china initially, but eventually that would be their goal as well.

I realize we are all airline enthusiasts here, but I fail to understand the enthusiasm for US carriers being absorbed into the IAG, LH Group, AF/KL triopoly? Many here argued that US carriers needed to be owned by foreign interests in order to reach profitability, but we now see that's not true.

We as consumers will not benefit from a lack of competition. Period
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Old Aug 19, 2011 | 3:20 pm
  #23  
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Originally Posted by ByrdluvsAWACO
We as consumers will not benefit from a lack of competition. Period
Oh I agree and I'm not at all in favor of mergers. But I think the market and financial forces will overcome, or rather twist the political forces against it.
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Old Aug 19, 2011 | 7:19 pm
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Originally Posted by stimpy
But I think the market and financial forces will overcome, or rather twist the political forces against it.
What financial forces? Don't underestimate the power of nationalism.
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