L-1011

Can't do that with your hands on your head.

RSSrsvp

It's interesting that they had 3 air marshalls on that flight. Probably 1 in F and 2 in Y. If this is an indication of the security that flights to SLC are being given for the Olympics, what type of protection are we getting on flights to other destinations?

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Doppy

The interesting part is that you guys are all playing the violin for this guy who broke the rules. If he had a problem with the rule, he should have taken it up with the proper authority, not just disregarded it.

d

highgamma

The violins are not for him. They are for us. The problem with "unusual" punishment is that it extends the power of the state well beyond a safe limit. We all lose when that happens.

If there is a need to punish this man for not wetting himself, so be it. But a twenty year prison sentence is for someone who actually tries to take down an aircraft, not for someone who may be confused for such a person.

wigstheone

Bear in mind that while he was arrested, he has not convicted of any crime, and the odds that he actually receives anything close to a twenty-year sentence, if convicted at all, borders on zero.

highgamma

But that's the whole point! Why would we ever have such a penalty associated with that "crime" if it were never to be used? The answer is so that it could be used. How many shoplifters have to serve life sentences in CA before we realize that a poorly designed law will be poorly applied?

MatthewClement

I've decided this much. If I'm flying into DCA and really need to go, I'll make sure I do it on the serving cart, not the lav. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

wigstheone

The "crime" for which the gentleman in question was arrested was interferring with a flight crew, not going to the bathroom. Personally, I would prefer to see a wide range of potential sentences for such a crime, precisely because the facts and circumstances are likely to vary broadly from one incident to another. If one does not believe the judicial system is capable of delivering a sentence that reflects the severity of a crime (regardless of its nature), then the answer is to change the judiciary.

fly co to see the yanks

i think he shouldn't have gotten up.

UA*AA

FAR 125.217 - Passenger information.
(c) Each passenger required by Sec. 125.211(b) to occupy a seat or berth
shall fasten his or her safety belt about him or her and keep it fastened
while any "Fasten Seat Belt" sign is lighted.
(d) Each passenger shall comply with instructions given him or her by
crewmembers regarding compliance with paragraphs (b) and (c) of this section
FAR 125.328 - Prohibition on crew interference.

No person may assault, threaten, intimidate, or interfere with a crewmember
in the performance of the crewmember's duties aboard an aircraft being
operated under this part.

I pretty much agree with most of you, but there is a reason why the airlines say "Federal Law requires all pax to comply with all lighted signs, placards and crewmember instructions."

FWAAA

If you refused to hold your hands over your head for the rest of the flight, would you be guilty of interferring with a flight crew or simply ignoring a lawful instruction of the flight crew? Huh? "Lawful Instruction"?? I'm not so sure.

No such published federal regulation exists, at least not one we are allowed to look at.

Can't be guilty of a law you're not allowed to view beforehand: That'd certainly be unconstitutional.

Nice that we now have rules that cause armed people on planes to incorrectly assume that anyone who breaks the silly rule is a terrorist threat and needs controlled - as well as all the people who DIDN'T break the rule.

Hope they institute the DCA/SLC rule everywhere once the thousands and thousands of sky marshals are hired and trained. THAT would definitely cause yields to increase, leading to profitability for all airlines.

In fact, I hope our federal government creates more rules like these: That's the way to show Osama bin Laden that we won't be pushed around. While we're at it, maybe TV and movies and music should be banned, and maybe women should have to quit school and wear... uh oh. Maybe a totalitarian attitude isn't the best approach. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

SpuddBrother

The use of the restroom is irrelevant here. The man disobeyed a directive from the Captain, which was relayed twice, and should be pushished severely for it. I highly doubt the first person charged with this crime will get off lightly. The attorney general will make an example of this case.

AS Flyer

Procedure for this 30 minute rule is that 60 minutes prior to landing there is to be an announcement made that tells everyone they have 30 minutes to use the facilities or be out of their seat. They are told that, due to the new security regulations, no passenger may leave their seat for the last 30 minutes of the flight. At 30 minutes prior they are told to remain seated for the remainder of the flight. I think the rule is absolutely ludicrous. If a terrorist is on board then the chance they are going to be concerned about breaking THIS rule is pretty minimal. At any rate, it is a rule - not one that we Flight Attendants have any say in. Folks, we can look the other way when your bag is not properly stowed, if you're using your palm pilot on take off we can choose not to see you. Nobody EVER respects the seat belt sign and yet we rarely say anything. There are things we have a choice in. When we have 2, 3 or more air marshalls on board to answer to later, you bet we are going to make sure that you respect this rule. When a passenger gets up we are to tell them, in no uncertain terms, that they are to return to their seat and remain there. This is apparently what the DL Flight Attendant did, which is when the passenger stared at them defiantly and when, in his own time, he decided he wanted to go back to his seat, he did. I don't feel sorry for him at all. I do feel sorry for the general public that is being tried on a daily basis with these stupid, nonsense rules. That being said, everyone is aware of what's happening at the airports and on board airplanes these days. If you don't think you can follow rules then flying is probably not a good idea. Most adults can hold themselves for 30 minutes if they have to go the bathroom. If it's an absolute emergency all he needed do was ring the F/A call button and let one of them escort him. It's stupid, it's juvenile, it's rather humiliating, but it's air travel in this day and age. Not fun.

Spiff

I think we ought to just rename the FAA "Dumb and Dumber". It was dumb today, wait 'till tomorrow when it gets even dumber. This guy broke the rules, but look at the rules he broke. THEY ARE STUPID RULES. STUPID! Because of this exceedingly heavy-handed overreaction to this situation, I hope this guy beats the rap.

What will we have to do to show the FAA how insane they are? Salt Lake City Pee Party??

http://www.wpi.edu/Academics/Depts/M...bs_bostea.html


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"Those who would sacrifice liberty for safety deserve neither." - Ben Franklin

duxfan

if that were always the case, we'd all be paying high taxes on tea and signing "God save the queen". we have a right and a responsibility to challenge authority when authority is abused. even if i was not the one going to the bathroom, i sure as h*** wouldn't have sat there with my hands over my head for the last 25 minutes. we woulda diverted first.