CozumelJen

I get checked when with my hispanic (Mexican) boyfriend. He flies on his valid Texas ID, not foreign passport. He says he is ALWAYS hassled whether I am there or not andhas come to expect it and does not get upset, though I am getting a little tired of it. I have not been checked without him. We do jump up for elite boarding and lurk around waiting for upgrades. I do think that there is racial profiling going on. On another note, I did not realize how racist people out here where I live are, until I tried to help him find a job. They would have openings as long as I was the one asking. When I stepped aside saying "no, he is the one looking for work", you would see the smiles fall off their faces and all of a sudden there mysteriously are no openings. I told an african-american friend about it and she said, you are finally seeing what I see every day of my life ... so sad!!!!!! Mexicans are the nicest people!

PS I am all for profiling and checking as long as the people checked match the description of suspected terrorists. but mexicans!?!! can't these screeners tell the difference between osama bin laden and my BF?

[This message has been edited by CozumelJen (edited 02-14-2002).]

duxfan

c'mon jen, you already know the answer to this question... of course they can't!

SameerUCLA

I'm not sure about the profiling. I've flown many a time after 9/11 and have never been stopped for search.

I'm a young, single, Indian male with dark skin who could easily be mistaken for Middle Eastern. A couple of my trips were one-ways, but none were purchased with cash. Sometimes I had luggage, sometimes I didn't.

Sometimes I used my military ID, sometimes I didn't. I have a Florida drivers' license with a California address on it, which theoretically should trigger some suspicion.


In any case, from now on I will be flashing the letter from the military which exempts all active duty U.S. personnel from the dreaded "special screening".

- Sameer

P.S. B747-400 (or any other Indian/Pakistani/Middle-Eastern FTers, your thoughts on this?

DerikG

I had a similar experience a month back when traveling with my wife. We each had 1 roller bag with us and a backpack.

We were on our way from BUF - ORD on UA and I was selected for the "random" search prior to boarding. No big deal.

He asks what I am carrying on, and without even thinking i give my roller and backpack to my wife and she continues down the jetway - he said "no problem - it will make things quicker"

I was in the wrong - but for him to let it go seems crazy in light of recent events.

HKG_Flyer1

I already mentioned this in another post, but I had an experience about a month ago where they actually just asked for a "volunteer" to go through the search.

I quickly accepted, because all my stuff was organized and I wanted to see what kind of process was being used.

travelnick

After Sept. 11th, I was wondering how it would affect me, if at all, cause I'm Hispanic. I have seen several situations where they have picked the Hispanics or the foreign looking people, even once where they picked the whole group and not just one person. In the cases I've seen so far, not always, they seem to pick the shady looking ones. In my case, I dress well and look clean cut, which should completely make them look over me, but I haven't been selected yet. I would have no problem getting selected, but I would not want them to pick me just because I was Hispanic.

On a related note, I recently was on a flight from MSP to LAX. I had the middle seat and was trying to sleep. The guy next to me kept bumping into me everything he got up and came back. I was frustrated. I didn't say much during the whole flight. Towards the end of the flight, I finally stayed awake and this guy wanted to chit-chat, but I tried to keep busy by reading a magazine article. At one point he wanted to wish me well on my trip and wanted to shake hands. I felt uncomfortable shaking his had, just because I was PO'd at him, so I didn't. He then proceeded to question my nationality, cause he said I wasn't from MSP, cause everyone from MSP is nice. Cause I have a tan, he implied I was a foreigner, and that I looked kind of shady, which just started my juices flowing. I told the guy I was born in Mpls, just like he was. This guy then went off the deep-end end when he implied I was a terrorist, cause I was saying weird things and I looked like a foreigner. (Remember, I was trying to sleep the whole flight.) He then proceeded to say out loud that "everyone wants to live, no one wants to die today", and ask passengers around us it I looked strange, told me he was going to report me to the captain as soon as we de-planed. What a friken freak. If I wasn't strapped down by that seat belt of my, I would put this guy straight through the floor and into the cargo area. All of this because I didn't shake this guys hand I and looked foreign.

TransWorldOne

While I'm not usually an apologist for security, I feel compelled to point out... Many people screened at the gate are preselected and this preselection is far from random. If the party of four is booked on one record, they all must be searched if that PNR is preselected for additional screening.

JoeDoakes

What does the guy's weight have to do with it? I guess if I were doing security at an airport (personally I would rather hand out Happy Meals), I'd give relatively more scrutiny to the apparently overweight than to the apparently underweight, as the former could be hiding something within their apparent girth. But, it seems like you are saying they should NOT have selected this guy because he was extremely overweight. Can you clarify?

Joe

Doppy

Some of the info that goes into CAPPS comes from your frequent flyer profile. That's probably why you get cleared by CAPPS when flying UA, since they have more info about you and you have elite status, but get more scrutiny on the other airlines.

On AA it's pretty straightforward to tell if you're getting selected by the screeners at the gate or by the computer. If your name is on a printed list of names, or the electronic boarding pass reader (EGR) tells them to screen you, the computer made the decision. If not, it's likely they decided on the spot to screen you.

The other thing to remember is that the airlines don't keep track of who got secondary screenings. So if you got randomly picked out of line on your last flight, you could again get randomly picked out of line on the next flight. And you could continue to get screened over and over again each flight by chance. Of course, you could also look suspicious.

Most of the people I see get screened were chosen by the computer. I'd expect that it is pretty blind to how old or fat people are. Besides, looking old doesn't mean that you're not a terrorist. Nor does being a child. There are a lot of terrorist types in the Middle East who teach their children to hate the US and beat effigies of Bush with a stick when they can barely walk. I wouldn't be too suprised if a terrorist used his child to help him sneak stuff through security (and I seem to remember there being a case of a bomb hidden in someone's diaper bag at some point in the past).

d

Mats

I am firmly against random screening. Here's why:

1. Terrorism is not random.
2. Since the randomness is so casual, it's hard to imagine that it serves as much of a deterrent.
3. During the late 90s, US Customs conducted a study to see if random searches were effective. Nope. They found that there were no benefits--as a deterrent or as a screening tool.

I'm an epidemiologist, so I study screening from a disease perspective. The best way I can describe it is this: if I wanted to reduce deaths from colon cancer, I wouldn't randomly select patients to undergo a colonoscopy. Instead, I'd look for a "profile"--a positive or unknown family history, symptoms, dietary habits, etc.

I tend to agree with Gavin de Becker, author of "Fearless," who argues that most of the recent airport security measures are knee-jerk reactions.

The FAA does not publish information about the effectiveness of random screening for "security reasons." It makes me wonder if they actually collect any data, conduct research, or if they just don't have any idea.

ElvisNYC

After 9/11 I haven't had problems on my flights, as of yet. I usually travel to LA so I rarely fly domestic, except when I have to connect in MIA. I have seen (and experienced) more discrimination in NYC than on a plane.
It's sad to hear what happened to the group of latinos, but since we don't know why they were chosen we cannot say if this was discrimination.

travelnick,

Sorry to hear what happened ! If I was you, I would have waited for him outside and showed him how shady I can become. What an *******..Mejor no digo mas.. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

flowerchild

JoeDoakes- There were two reasons I mentioned his weight. He had difficulty walking, which would seem to rule out any fast movement if he were up to no good, and I wondered if security wanted to be sure he was not hiding something on his person due to his extreme size. He was one row up from us when he finally boarded, and had two seats as well as a seat belt extension. It appeared to me his selection was based more on race and weight than anything else.

pynchonesque

It's too bad the US is becoming more and more like the third world: thugs with quasi-governmental authority taking pleasure in harrassing innocent people.

OldTWAPlatGuy

I think that we give them too much credit in the intelligence area. I am a 60ish AA EXP and probably look it. I usually try to be one of the first 5 or 6 on to get the overhead space in FC for my rollerboard. Sometimes they profile #1, sometimes #2, etc. I usually get the extra attention in maybe 1 out of 4 flights.

xTWAnowAAer

If you really think these security checks are random I have a bridge for sale in Brooklyn. Seriously the security checks are profiled not random. The other week I was traveling on the same itinary with my wife.
On the out bound flight only my frequent flyer number was entered so I got a "CLR" (clear) on my boarding pass and my wife did not so she was subjected to a "random" security check. Before the return I called up and entered hers. When we got the boarding pass on the return we both had "CLR" on the boarding pass.
Also, as someone who travels every week I have never been selected for a "random" check.