Finally flew out of LAX yesterday, got back home Friday evening. LAX was a zoo at 4:30 AM, over a 100 people in the DL Medallion/1st class line. Shuttle buses from hotels, car rentals, etc., allowed to drop people off at terminal, private vehicles directed to offsite lots. Went directly to gate as did not have luggage to check - security let me through with a picture ID matched to an e-ticket receipt. My safety type razor (Sensor) was taken away, and others had small scissors and nail cutters taken away (upside here is not having your row partner cutting nails while you're trying to eat a meal ).

Checked in at the CRC w/o any problems. Plane left about 30 minutes late - ground staff did security check on plane, and flight crew did one as well. Flight crew was not allowed on plane until 1st check was complete. Breakfast served with plastic knives with serrated edges - probably more dangerous than metal butter knife. Flight crew was a bit edgy, understandably so.

Arrived at ORF after a connection in CVG. ORF still allows people to pull up to the terminal and drop off departing passengers.

All in all, thankful for getting back home, but did not feel that the new measures really make that much of a difference. Your thoughts?

Nail clippers? Sheesh....

Get a grip. Were they afraid you'd give 'em a hangnail?

I left SAT yesterday on Delta. Long line (no elite line).One and one half hour to agent. I was randomly selected to be one that had their checked bags searched.Almost another hour. At security I was asked to open my carryon and take computer out and turn it on. I barely made my flight. More than 2 1/2 hrs. would be recommended.
There was a collection of plastic forks&knives, tweezers, nail clippers, loose batteries, etc. all confiscated and left behind at the security line I was in.

This is just too much. Does anyone know what Israel does at their airport, which is supposed to be with the tightest security measures in the world?

There have been other threads you can refer to about Israel's security (and the security on ALL flights in and out of Israel, administered in foreign airports too), but the one main difference I would give is that they practically do a psychological profile on every passenger. You are questioned as to your motives for travel, why so much or little baggage, who do you work for, where were you born, who are you going to meet, where are you staying, do you have reservations, etc. THAT is the kind of thing that will stop a hijacking, not taking away peoples' nail clippers. And that is the way we are headed, I suspect (actually, that's what I hope, as I think it will make flying safer, as it does to and from Israel). The thing is, that Americans, we are used to a different standard of freedom, and the questions I state above and the actions taken based on the answers to those questions probably violate current laws. So we cannot take that kind of jump lightly. The other thing is that each profiler has to be pretty highly trained (and that means highly paid). Not $6/hr people who stand around security checkpoints waiting for beeps to go off.

(by the way: I have flown to and from Israel several times with a small swiss army knife in my carry-on)

In Israel:

They will open all your luggage (carry on and checked). You will be taken into a small booth with 2 or three security agents. They will ask you a variety of questions, watching closely your reactions. They may then have some of these questions asked again by a different agent. You will be searched; you may well be strip searched.

At Frankfurt, El Al aircraft are proteced by an armored car of the Border Police.

I flew out of Israel only once and it was not on El Al. First they ask a series of questions. I guess I didn't answer the questions correctly. They determined that I was traveling alone and met up with other travelers from various countries.

I had only carry on luggage and they brought me into a room with several (at least 4) security agents. They spent the next hour searching through my bag and my purse. The agents were wearing gloves and they were as detailed as to open up my face powder and sift through it with a finger. Nothing went unopened or unsearched.

I only have the one experience. I don�t know how often one is selected or how.

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The world is a book, and for those who do not travel, read only a page.
-Saint Augustine

Have you actually had this happen to you? I have flown to and from Israel about 6 times and have never had my carryon or checked luggage searched, except on one occasion. One time, on a BA flight from LHR to TLV, they set up tables to enter the departure gate area and searched everyone's carryon bags. Not based on profile, just EVERYONE. Then, on that same flight, before we took off, one of my two suitcases was one of 3 bags randomly picked to be opened and searched in the gate area.

From my observations of the checkin areas in Tel Aviv, opening suitcases is the exception, not the rule. Asking everyone a series of directed questions that WORK is the rule. Of course, based on the answers, I do not doubt that they take you into a booth and search everything and question you more seriously. But they can't do this to everyone, and they are pretty smart about who they pinpoint.

Aside from the questioning before checkin, leaving Tel-Aviv airport is much like any other International airport: boarding pass check to get through immigration (to leave - they want to catch draft dodgers among other things, so they have a checkpoint to exit), then normal X ray and security (everything goes through the X ray machine), and then you are in the concourse with duty free, restaurants, clubs, etc.

Precisely. I think that is a common misconception that the Israeli agents routinely open bags, and are draconian about carryon items. They do not, and they are not. As you point out, they are much wiser than that, and realize that it is the person, and not a potential weapon, that is the real threat.

Well, I suppose this is a good thread to tell of my experience yesterday & today. I'll put some background in so some of what happened is in context.

I started my first ever RTW in First yesterday. I live in SFO but bought the tix ex-Canada due to price. Had a oneway to YVR. I was to fly on AC last night but figured it was cancelled so I got a coach ticket on UA (First was sold out.)

I drove to SFO and parked in the Int'l term--that's what they had recommended. It was calm. Walked to domestic. The regular UA check-in line was very long. I went to the *Gold line but they moved me to *Silver--it was faster. Took about 15 in to reach the counter. Normal procedure, normal security questions.

Although only the central security checkpoint into the UA gate area was open, there was NO line. I went through. They handchecked one of my 2 carry-on very superficially. Looked at my laptop--no power on required. Wiped the outside and checked the pad in the machine. All seemed only slightly stricter. The terminal was calm as was the new RCC.

At the gate there was a slight delay since the plane came in late. Flight was at least half empty. All seemed normal.

THEN I got into Canada. No lines at the YVR immigration point. (Last time I waited 45 minutes in line). I've got a US passport. I was asked where I was born. "Germany" caused him to ask if I also had a German passport. I said yes since I had it with me. He wanted to know what I did. "Physisican". Why are you coming to Canada? I told him about the RTW and the cheaper price. All ok, routine I thought and understandable questions. Being German I always hate borders and now always dress up in suit and tie.

I had no checked luggage so went right to the exit to give my paperwork to the officers. They asked me to go another way to customs. I thught that's noe routine perhaps.

Well, there was no one there. None of the lines were open. I waited about 5 minutes until a woman called me over. Then the interrogation started and she went through everything.

I loved planning this trip. Made all of my hotel reservations online, had tons of paper with confirmations, cancellations, etc. Had made alternate reservations just in case due to the situation. She kept staring at the sheets, then asked questions about them.

At first, I didn't mind, then it became ridiculous. Why single me out? After all I'm an American. I'm a physician. I felt attacked. It is MY country that was attacked, not Canada. I was coming OFF an airplane.
Then I had to go to the immigration office. There was almost no one there. The gentleman there however was very nice, hardly asked anything except "oh, you've been to Calgary?" when he saw prior stamps in my passport.

That was it.

The terminal looked like mayhem. The line to security for the intl/non-us flights stretched way back.

This morning I checked into my SQ flight. I had made alternate reservations (YVR-SIN) and they just took my YVR-LAX-NRT-SIN (3) flight coupons. I was told no batteries were allowed. So I checked one of my carry-ons which had the clothes.

At security there was NO line. They handchecked all bags rather thoroughly. Had to power the laptop on. Not particularly friendly personnel. No passport check.

That's it. So here's 1.) some factual info for those interested and 2.) my personal reaction to Canada customs. I'm sure the second may cause some debate. I welcome this. Surely some will think I should be glad they take things seriously. It is also of interest how lax it was at SFO and how YVR was much stricter.

Thanks for listening!

Nobbi

this is totally outrageous! SPEAK UP AMERICA. Don't give the terrorists what they want -- our freedom!

Nobbi, thanks for the detailed report. It sounds that despite an over-reaction by Canadian customs, and SQ's (or was it an airport policy?) no-batteries deal, which are both probably transients, things are beginning to settle down a bit.

I commend you on getting back in the saddle. Best of luck on your RTW. Keep us informed.

Here are my experiences and thoughts from yesterday -

Had a flight at 6:21 am from SAN-SJC. I was told by AA (at PLT desk and by SAN AA personnel) that since the airport didn't open until 5 am to show up then.

Thought #1: Airports are going to have to rethink how early they open. (See thought #3 below.)

I attempted to leave my hotel (five minutes form the airport) at 4:40. Front desk staff
told me that the shuttle wouldn't run until 7 but to call as I was coming down and there would be a taxi waiting. Apparently the new early airport check-in caught the SAN taxi companies by suprise - the front desk had to call four companies before she got a cab for me. The cab driver was suprised too - didn't understand why he had dropped four people off at the airport already that morning.

Thought #2: Hotels, airport transport companies, and taxi operators are going to need to beef up to meet a new, more urgent need to access the airport at various hours.

Got to the airport at 5:01 am. There were only two AA flights going out before 10 am, yet there were about 200 people already in the regular check in line, and about 20 in front of me in the first class line. The regular line was actually moving faster than the first line. Many people got to the desk only to not have the documentation that AA told them they would need - ticket receipt, electronic confirmation of itinerary. Several people stood in the line who had cancelled flights and argued about accomodation on other flights.

Thought #3: AA should have opened separate lines for check-in and for reaccomodation/reservations. At the rate the line moved, several people most likely did miss our flight at 6:21.

Security had a line as well, but this was because security had not opened yet. One line was open for airport and airline staff, but all others were queued up. Regular passengers weren't processed until 5:25 but once security opened, it moved at a normal pace. I got there when the second line opened to passengers. Things appeared to be moving at the pace I was used to pre-Tuesday.

I walked right past the person who was checking ids/tickets for one line and went through the metal detector the first time without setting off the alarm (means it was still set very low). My bags were scanned and I was able to take them off the conveyor. This disturbed me and I asked for a supervisor.

I told her how disturbed I was that I just "brushed through" and THEN I had my ID/ticket examined, bag wiped and tested, and body both scanned and patted down. Of course, while I had THREE security officers attending to me, I saw the line continue to move at the previous fast pace.

The supervisor apologized and said they hadn't had adequate time to brief the staff fully before they showed up to work that day.

Thought #4: Security hasn't had time to be thoroughly re-trained on what they should be doing. They are going through the motions but probably don't fully understand the purpose of what they are doing.

Went to the Admirals Club to grab a cup of coffee. There were three agents at the desk and one other person in the club. They were suprised at how "non-busy" they were.

Thought #5: I would anticipate that club staffing will have to down if they no longer have a high volume of check-ins and if airport meeting attendees can no longer come through security to use the club. If this happens, I predict a combination of one or more of the following - more restricted club hours, fewer club amenities, increases in the price of club memberships, closure of some clubs where easy check-in was the main draw (such as the DEN AC).

... to be continued (want to save this - lighting storm outside my window!)...

I need a bit of help understanding this batteries thing. I have read here that they are not allowed yet poeople are allowed on with their laptops after powering them up. What exactly is it the agents doing the inspection think is powering the laptop?

Is this battery thing about cylindrical and 9V batteries only? I worry because I carry a DVD player powered by batteries which look very much like laptop computer batteries.

Any news?

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a FlyerTalk tradition continues in November 2001 in Cannes, France......

Check the PiP 2001 Website or the FT Topic for details and news.

I'm concerned about this no batteries policy. Does this mean loose regular consumer electronic batteries, or does it apply to laptops as well?
Laptop batteries are often very expensive and I'd hate to have one confiscated on a whim.
Hell, I'd hate to lose any of my stuff on a whim. I can't afford to replace any of it, not now at least.

Does this mean we geeks need to think about mailing our tools to our destination
ahead of time?
What are peoples experiences so far with things like laptops, PDAs, and the assorted bits that go with them like PCMCIA cards, power bricks, cables,portable CDROM drives and the like?

It's not possible for me to fly and leave these things at home. When I travel for work, I'm expected to show up with them and/or other things my client(s) need.

Thoughts, observations?

JD