freakflyer

It gets worse. Just read my Wells Fargo statement. In addition to the $5 ATM fee they will also charge 3% on all non-US point of sale purchases. Ouch.

Vip4me

try going to google and typing site:flyertalk.com then follow that with your search term you would normally look up on here.

hope that helps!

Very interesting on the exchange rates vs. fees I may use my AMEX overseas now that I know this!

lin821

^
How come I forgot to mention Google for searching threads? Dah!

Meanwhile, I agree with the earlier posts that more bank are jumping on the bandwagon adding 3% foreigh transactoion fee. If not now, soon. I recalled my US Bank visa (NWA) used not to have add-on fee originally. I decided to stop using it when visiting home when I noticed they started charging the extra fee maybe 3 years ago.

clacko

i have been informed by mc/visa that starting 1 apr 05, any foriegn currency charges will incur a 3% FINANCE CHARGE... i couldn't find any mention of dropping the current 3% [irrc] fee...i.m planning on using a debit card in the future, miles aren't worth 6% to me...

acf573

My understanding of the increase from 2% to 3% is simply a result of the way Visa/MC account for the currency conversion. In the past, the rate that Visa/MC used was wholesale + 1%. Then Citi or whoever would add on an extra 2% for an effective 3% rate.

The new method is that Visa/MC rate is wholesale, and they bill the bank for their share of the conversion charge in bulk at the end of the month. Then the bank charges a 3% conversion, pockets most of it except for whatever percent they have to kickback to Visa/MC.

You can see this might be true from the language on the cardholder agreement. Old language:
New language:
Note that in the new language, there is no mention of Visa/MC increasing the rate by 1%. We'll see what actually happens. I'm especially curious as to what will happen with MBNA because I haven't seen any new T&C from them. Are they going to go down to 0%?

pgary

MBNA still wins. I test this occasionally when I travel outside the U.S. My MBNA Amtrak card is the only card I use regularly for foreign currency transactions. The net charge over the interbank rate ranges from 0.5% to 1.5%, which represents what Mastercard charges the bank over the rate their currency traders get. But occasionally I get a rate significantly better than the interbank rate. Mastercard probably has some very good curency traders.

The Amtrak card gives points transferrable to miles on Continental and Midwest Airlines. The latter has American Airlines as a partner. But you can transfer only 25,000 points per year. Since Amtrak dropped United Airlines as a transfer partner (or visa versa), I plan to apply for the Fidelity 1.5% cash back card from MBNA to replace my Amtrak card.

For your other 75,000, check out MBNA's credit card page. For travel awards, be sure to click on the Find More button in that section. The Gold Points card may be of interest (I write about it on my Free Cards page), as may be the foreign airlines cards, especially Lufthansa, part of the Star Alliance network. (Caution: I believe Lufthansa miles expire, and have some other not ver nice limitations on their use. I don't know much about that program, but there is probably a forum dedicated to it on Flyertalk.)

Also, with the amount you charge, why not one of the two points type cards with dedicated bank points? Sometimes these give you more bang for the buck. I have not looked at these types of cards for MBNA. I have a list of things to think about when considering this type of card, on the Bank and Other Travel Cards page of the credit card section of my website, Free Frequent Flyer Miles. Be sure to check out any maximum points earned per year limitations, expiration of points, types of tickets you can get, and how you get them (dollar limit?). All is explained on my website.

Mountain Trader

I'd like to see a real comparison of actual charges to support this contention since I think it is just wrong. My target for charges on MBNA cards, including very recent ones, have been the international currency exchange rates (which are the best), plus 1%, and MBNA is at or less than that target on each charge. My experience is that AMEX currency rates (before the 2% mark-up) are the same or even higher.

Even if MBNA and Amex started with the same currency rates, MBNA is still the winner for me. With the Fidelity card I get 1.5% back in cash, so compared to Amex plus another 1% (to get to their 2%), I am giving up the 1.5% cash rebate, and the extra 1% to Amex for a total of 2.5%. Would you pay 2.5% IN CASH for frequent flyer miles? Well, I don't, and I wouldn't pay the annual AMEX fee for the right to do so.

If you like AMEX, or you don't charge much in foreign currency, then go ahead and use Amex. But like PGary, I don't think it's the best priced move and like him, I go with MBNA.

mahasamatman

Sounds like yet another reason to switch banks.

saimike

citibank ATM's have not let me down the vast majority of the time. their exchange rates r usually competitive, and if u hv a citibank acct, u can withdraw at any citibank ATM worldwide with no extra fees.

martino

in the past fed farm credit had the best rate.is this still true?

hoangb

I can also vouch for the fact that my MBNA card typically yielded the best foreign exchange rate whenever I was outside the us. I typically did a comparision between my MBNA, Amex, Diners, and another Visa/MC, and as always, MBNA came out on top in terms of giving the best exchange rate.

I don't know where a previous poster got the research to back up the fact that MBNA gave the worst rates. As you could see from various previous posters, MBNA is the card to go with when overseas.

coachflyer

Last December at Singapore, I used both the Visa and MBNA cards to pay for my custom made suits. The amount I was billed on my Visa was $207.60. Two days later, I paid the remaining 50% with the MBNA card and the amount came up to $203.49, which was about 2% lower than the Visa. The exchange rates didn't vary much during those days.

mahasamatman

I made comparisons in Israel and Spain in December, and came to the conclusion that my ATM card gave the best rate, followed very closely by MBNA.

wrightbrother

Absolutely, if you can get an ATM without fees. For foreign purchases billed to USD either MBNA (mastercard) or National City (visa) don't charge over the 1% default fee. The exception is MBNA Canada, which charges 2.5% in addition, so be careful! Any suggestions out there for CDN credit?

I also recommend having an account with a global ATM alliance member: Scotiabank (Canada), Bank of America, Barclays (UK/Africa/Everywhere else), BNP Paribas (France), Deutsche Bank, Westpac (Austr.). These banks offer no-fee access via ATMs to one another's accounts. So, for example, I can withdraw Cedis at Barclays in Africa from Scotiabank in Canada at the best exchange rate with no fees! The only trouble I've can see is that Bank of America stinks.

AZ_MISMAN

No miles, but Farm Bureau Bank (http://www.farmbureaubank.com) Visa pays 1% cash back. There are NO foreign conversion fees from FBB, and they absorb the fee that Visa passes on.

Bob