Why do people leave FT and/or "demote" themselves to lurkers?
Nov 6, 2000, 11:43 am
#1
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
Why do people leave FT and/or "demote" themselves to lurkers?
IMHO, based upon MY anecdotal assessment, the primary reason is due to being subjected to a tasteless barrage of unwarranted, unsolicited, foul, ill mannered and manifestly nonproductive personal public criticism.
If you don't post, then you're "safe!"
If you don't visit FT, you are even safer!
And, of course, there are SOME who conceivably, actually like this kind of nonsense!
While there are too many examples, some ongoing, see:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum20/HTML/001517.html
The take home message SEEMS to be to reduce the level of participation! Perhaps to zero! I'm thinking about it!
What do we get out of posting?
If you don't post, then you're "safe!"
If you don't visit FT, you are even safer!
And, of course, there are SOME who conceivably, actually like this kind of nonsense!
While there are too many examples, some ongoing, see:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum20/HTML/001517.html
The take home message SEEMS to be to reduce the level of participation!
Perhaps to zero! I'm thinking about it! What do we get out of posting?
Nov 6, 2000, 12:20 pm
#2
Original Member, Ambassador: External Miles and Points Resources
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Digital Nomad Wandering the Earth - Currently in LIMA, PERU
Posts: 58,611
Doc: If there was any doubt left, it has now been eliminated. You ARE an "old boys club" member. You've just completed the final initiation requirement: threatening to (or talking about threatening to or actually following through on a threat to) quit the board.
WELCOME!
WELCOME!
Nov 6, 2000, 12:39 pm
#3
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
Join Date: May 1999
Posts: 46,817
Koko- Thanks! Yet what I apparently may have failed to make clear was that I feel VERY strongly that there a fewer posts and that there are more absent FT'ers due to a proliferation of threads that are kind of "venemous" for lack of a better term!
I'm pretty thick skinned and NEVER give up as any one who knows me can tell you! Yet is THICK SKIN now a requirement for posting on FT?
BTW_ The only CLUB that I know that I'm in is the Frequent Flamer Victim Club!
My concern is to never allow myself to take the gloves off and get down in the gutter to fight the "good" fight effectively!
Tolerance and Travel Talk make FT what it is! I hope we do NOT have to amend this to say "MADE" in the future!
Yet what I apparently may have failed to make clear was that I feel VERY strongly that there a fewer posts and that there are more absent FT'ers due to a proliferation of threads that are kind of "venemous" for lack of a better term! I'm pretty thick skinned and NEVER give up as any one who knows me can tell you! Yet is THICK SKIN now a requirement for posting on FT?
BTW_ The only CLUB that I know that I'm in is the Frequent Flamer Victim Club!
My concern is to never allow myself to take the gloves off and get down in the gutter to fight the "good" fight effectively!
Tolerance and Travel Talk make FT what it is! I hope we do NOT have to amend this to say "MADE" in the future!
Nov 6, 2000, 12:48 pm
#4
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Munich, Germany
Programs: LH HON, DL FO/MM, Marriott Lifetime Platinum, Accor Lifetime Platinum, Sixt Diamond
Posts: 6,174
I belive that this forum is to help everybody. I'm pretty new, so FT meant for me getting lots of information I did not have before.
And that's just possible witha community in which everybody voices his/her opinion.
If I do not agree with someone (or believe that he/she is writing crap), then it's still his/her opinion.
So doc, please stay - there might always be someone who values your opinion.
And if others criticize you: it's their right (although it does not have to be rude) - it's up to you whether you think about their posts or not.
And that's just possible witha community in which everybody voices his/her opinion.
If I do not agree with someone (or believe that he/she is writing crap), then it's still his/her opinion.
So doc, please stay - there might always be someone who values your opinion.
And if others criticize you: it's their right (although it does not have to be rude)
- it's up to you whether you think about their posts or not.
Nov 6, 2000, 12:59 pm
#5
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Arlington, VA, USA
Posts: 858
I'm one of those people who might well be called a member of the "old boy club" or former regular poster who has become a "lurker."
I don't like that term, "lurker, especially as it applies to me."
I don't post as often as I once did, for two reasons: (1) I don't have as much time as I once did, and (2) There are a lot more posts from a lot more people than there used to be.
I look on that first reason as negative; the second as extremely positive. The more opinions we get from the more people, the better off all of us are (assuming we're willing to consider those opinions and not just reject them).
I don't think any opinion anyone expresses here is toally negative, even if it's stated in negative terms. I learn from every one of them that I have time to read. I only regret that I don't have enought time.
BTW: This is the first time in quite some time that I've had time to spend any time on the site, and I haven't been able to get very far yet. Maybe I need to reorganize my priorities.
[This message has been edited by philforest (edited 11-06-2000).]
I don't like that term, "lurker, especially as it applies to me."
I don't post as often as I once did, for two reasons: (1) I don't have as much time as I once did, and (2) There are a lot more posts from a lot more people than there used to be.
I look on that first reason as negative; the second as extremely positive. The more opinions we get from the more people, the better off all of us are (assuming we're willing to consider those opinions and not just reject them).
I don't think any opinion anyone expresses here is toally negative, even if it's stated in negative terms. I learn from every one of them that I have time to read. I only regret that I don't have enought time.
BTW: This is the first time in quite some time that I've had time to spend any time on the site, and I haven't been able to get very far yet. Maybe I need to reorganize my priorities.
[This message has been edited by philforest (edited 11-06-2000).]
Nov 6, 2000, 1:18 pm
#6
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: SFO
Programs: UA Million Miler (mostly earned on CO)
Posts: 2,599
I took a two month vacation from FlyerTalk (but continued to participate in community events) this summer because I was tired of all the incivility between members that was going on on the board around that time.
I came back feeling rested, as well as a little more proactive about requesting that people take their off-topic discussions and disagreements off-line to private e-mail.
I don't think anyone on FlyerTalk deserves to be treated impolitely, but I also think that our our primary medium for opinion exchange, in which we don't see one another face-to-face when we're talking to one another, makes it all too easy for some to forget that there is a human being "on the other side of the screen" reading what you just wrote. When people remember that fact, and treat one another humanely, FlyerTalk is a joy. When they don't, it's a drag.
My $.02 worth.
I came back feeling rested, as well as a little more proactive about requesting that people take their off-topic discussions and disagreements off-line to private e-mail.
I don't think anyone on FlyerTalk deserves to be treated impolitely, but I also think that our our primary medium for opinion exchange, in which we don't see one another face-to-face when we're talking to one another, makes it all too easy for some to forget that there is a human being "on the other side of the screen" reading what you just wrote. When people remember that fact, and treat one another humanely, FlyerTalk is a joy. When they don't, it's a drag.
My $.02 worth.
Nov 6, 2000, 2:23 pm
#7
Commander Catcop
Join Date: May 1998
Posts: 10,259
Maybe the object is if Flyertalk is getting to you and the flames are getting to you do what I did (and Dgolds did) is take a break from the boards and come back later.
It was refreshing when I left to look back as a lurker and see flames eventually die out and see the board will go on with or without me.
On the advice of so many good friends here, I have decided I have a place here so I will stay until Randy and Randy alone tells me to leave.
Also people get busy, there are a LOT of posts and it's tough for anyone to read them all with family, work, commitments, F-T events to attend!
In addition, as some friends have explained to me, over time we all become so Frequent Flyer savy that we can fly on our own (coming back on occassion to see the latest news on issues: the CO upgrade controversy, the going's on at UA.)
Flyertalk though has a LOT to offer us and everyone here has a role to play and to help others.
That's what Flyertalk means to me.
It was refreshing when I left to look back as a lurker and see flames eventually die out and see the board will go on with or without me.
On the advice of so many good friends here, I have decided I have a place here so I will stay until Randy and Randy alone tells me to leave.
Also people get busy, there are a LOT of posts and it's tough for anyone to read them all with family, work, commitments, F-T events to attend!
In addition, as some friends have explained to me, over time we all become so Frequent Flyer savy that we can fly on our own (coming back on occassion to see the latest news on issues: the CO upgrade controversy, the going's on at UA.)
Flyertalk though has a LOT to offer us and everyone here has a role to play and to help others.
That's what Flyertalk means to me.
Nov 6, 2000, 2:34 pm
#8
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 685
Having participated in bulletin boards of one form or another for about the last 16 years, believe me, this is pretty standard stuff. There will always be people who resort to personal attacks when they don't like the message that you give, and there will always be the tendency to retort with an equally nasty attack.
My personal rule of thumb for any kind of public posting is that 2 out of every 3 public posts should end with a "quit" instead of a "submit". That way, you can get it out of your system without actually posted something potentially nasty. I feel that it cleanses me and allows me to move on to the next topic.
My personal rule of thumb for any kind of public posting is that 2 out of every 3 public posts should end with a "quit" instead of a "submit". That way, you can get it out of your system without actually posted something potentially nasty. I feel that it cleanses me and allows me to move on to the next topic
.
Nov 6, 2000, 3:03 pm
#9
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: New York
Posts: 2,115
Originally posted by usoftie:
My personal rule of thumb for any kind of public posting is that 2 out of every 3 public posts should end with a "quit" instead of a "submit".
My personal rule of thumb for any kind of public posting is that 2 out of every 3 public posts should end with a "quit" instead of a "submit".
As for the original question, I think the answer is the noise:signal ratio has gone down on FT.
In the old days(i'll leave others to debate if they were good or not) we had fewer useless posts.
Today I see people posting what seems to be simply "posting for the sake of posting".
I even see posts that have nothing more than a smiley.
It seems like a few people think that having lots of posts makes them special or something.
Nov 6, 2000, 3:44 pm
#10
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Boston
Programs: UA 1K, 2MM
Posts: 956
Greetings.
As someone who has posted nothing but a smiley face on occasion, I guess the onus is on me to explain. I found this board a few months ago, and enjoyed the posts. I learnt a lot but I still had some questions to ask, so I registered. Most of the time, I don’t regret getting involved.
On occasion, something I have posted has prompted what I consider to be ill-considered or rude response. Rather than get into a fight, I’ll acknowledge the “input” with a smile. There actually is content in the smile, even if it’s a terse form of communication.
More often, if I read a post that is humorous in nature, I am more than happy to acknowledge the wit with a simple smile. Again, terse, but not content-free.
So, apologies if a simple smile icon is viewed as an inferior quality post. I’ll restrain myself.
Next time.
As someone who has posted nothing but a smiley face on occasion, I guess the onus is on me to explain. I found this board a few months ago, and enjoyed the posts. I learnt a lot but I still had some questions to ask, so I registered. Most of the time, I don’t regret getting involved.
On occasion, something I have posted has prompted what I consider to be ill-considered or rude response. Rather than get into a fight, I’ll acknowledge the “input” with a smile. There actually is content in the smile, even if it’s a terse form of communication.
More often, if I read a post that is humorous in nature, I am more than happy to acknowledge the wit with a simple smile. Again, terse, but not content-free.
So, apologies if a simple smile icon is viewed as an inferior quality post. I’ll restrain myself.
Next time.
Nov 6, 2000, 3:49 pm
#11
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: HKG/SFO
Programs: CX GR; AA Life GLD, EXP; SPG Life GLD, PLT
Posts: 1,050
Personally I am so green here such that I never been a victim of what mentioned. I think FTer-talk is a place that Real Frequent Flyers, people Interested to fly or other new flyers can gather and discuss issues RELATED to flyering/travels. I think the OMNI Section is a good place to put our non-travel related issue that what to express or seek advice.
I think everybody have a say to express their own ideas, we can disagree but we can place a personal attack! My approach is just say what I think and simply ingore any personal attact or "rude" posts.
Just let us keep this community up and wish everyone enjoy the stay here and more importantly:
Happy Travel!
From My Heart-- HK-Umich
I think everybody have a say to express their own ideas, we can disagree but we can place a personal attack! My approach is just say what I think and simply ingore any personal attact or "rude" posts.
Just let us keep this community up and wish everyone enjoy the stay here and more importantly:
Happy Travel!
From My Heart-- HK-Umich
Nov 6, 2000, 5:23 pm
#12
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Smoke filled room, TPA and FLL/MIA :UAL 1K and 2MM,AA EX PLAT and 2MM,Lifetime Plat Starwood
Posts: 4,318
Doc, ever wonder why it's always YOU?
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/003233.html
Maybe, just maybe, your not a "victim". Maybe its... YOU!
Nice move complaining about being picked on then posting a link (in this forum) to stir the pot even more. You have no concern solving the problem... this is about only one thing... Your EGO. You can dish it out by the truck load, but if anyone disagrees... LOOK out! your bruised ego goes NUTS! I guess Kklyn,Camera guy, and me are all engaged in "some sort of right wing conspericy against you?"
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum50/HTML/003233.html
Maybe, just maybe, your not a "victim". Maybe its... YOU!
Nice move complaining about being picked on then posting a link (in this forum) to stir the pot even more. You have no concern solving the problem... this is about only one thing... Your EGO. You can dish it out by the truck load, but if anyone disagrees... LOOK out! your bruised ego goes NUTS! I guess Kklyn,Camera guy, and me are all engaged in "some sort of right wing conspericy against you?"
Nov 6, 2000, 5:31 pm
#13
Flyertalk Evangelist and Moderator: Coupon Connection and Travel Products
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Milton, GA USA
Programs: Hilton Diamond, IHG Platinum Elite, Hyatt Discoverist, Radisson Elite
Posts: 19,040
Boomer,
I cannot agree with you more. I only wish that the system would not allow people to only post smiley, ditto or similar comments. It gets very old having to sift through those posts to get to the quality posts. Funny thing is, it is usually the same person doing all those "useless" posts. Of course, I guess I too could be rated a FT Evangelist if I did that enough.
I also find the "DO A SEARCH" comments another reason people stop posting. Some of us are new and do not know (and do not have the time to use the archaic (SP?) search engine). Plus, I personally believe that ideas on a thread can change and that there is nothing wrong with starting a new thread instead of searching for a two year old thread.
I still find this the most valuable travel site on the web. However, I have to admit that I have not recommended it to as many people in the past two months due to the perceived unfriendliness.
Just my two cents... and flame away!
William
I cannot agree with you more. I only wish that the system would not allow people to only post smiley, ditto or similar comments. It gets very old having to sift through those posts to get to the quality posts. Funny thing is, it is usually the same person doing all those "useless" posts. Of course, I guess I too could be rated a FT Evangelist if I did that enough.
I also find the "DO A SEARCH" comments another reason people stop posting. Some of us are new and do not know (and do not have the time to use the archaic (SP?) search engine). Plus, I personally believe that ideas on a thread can change and that there is nothing wrong with starting a new thread instead of searching for a two year old thread.
I still find this the most valuable travel site on the web. However, I have to admit that I have not recommended it to as many people in the past two months due to the perceived unfriendliness.
Just my two cents... and flame away!
William
Nov 6, 2000, 6:20 pm
#15
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Niceville, FL, USA
Posts: 2,793
Gotta agree with philforest, especially reason #2.
I think it is a very positive thing that I don't have much to add to this board any more. There is simply no need for my poor exspertise, usually; there are now far more knowledgeable posters here covering almost everything that has to do with the FF world. And, yes, this is a *good* thing.
As I said about 2 years ago,"You are ALL da best!"
I think it is a very positive thing that I don't have much to add to this board any more. There is simply no need for my poor exspertise, usually; there are now far more knowledgeable posters here covering almost everything that has to do with the FF world. And, yes, this is a *good* thing.
As I said about 2 years ago,"You are ALL da best!"