s777bg

Not understanding why Expedia agent would rebook you when the flights are not actually cancelled, only the tickets are . Unless they wanna cash in not giving you the refund in addition to the price difference to the new ticket plus thei commission?’v

kokonutz

Sad but not unexpected. This *is* TAP we are talking about, after all.

Sigh.

bangkokiscool

Spoke with Chase travel agent, who called TAP. TAP conceded on a recorded line that they will process a full refund, not just a credit. Refund has to be started from the commercial desk, which was closed. Chase will call back tomorrow and let me know within 72 hours when the refund has started.

skylane

This Tap Air Portugal Twitter Ad clears says:

"Until March 2nd, book your medium or long-haul flight in our Executive Class from 299€ roundtrip"



TAP Twitter Ad: \\"Until March 2nd, book your medium or long-haul flight in our Executive Class from 299€ roundtrip"

Basanez

when I called Chase they were unable to get a hold of TAP so I’m glad to hear this. I’ll call them tomorrow.

jfkeze

Let's play a game...

I'm not a lawyer nor did I stay at a holiday Inn Express yesterday. 😉😂

99.9% of flyertalkers will not go through with this but if you have some spare dollars and want to learn more about the legal system and how airlines respond to them it might be worth an investment.
Let's look at some options TAP is not in bankruptcy unlike airlines such as Aeromexico so Small Claims might be a valid route.

They don't seem to have a office in New York City, my usual place but they have an office in New Jersey specifically in Newark so you might be able to initiate a New Jersey Small Claims Court filing.


From the attached link it seems that you can sue for up to 3,000 and did cost $42 to file a lawsuit.

Where do we start? There are several posts in this thread with Instagram Twitter advertisements announcing a sale starting at $299 for medium and long distance business class travel.

TAP has historically priced a variety of airfares at very low rates in both economy and business class there are a variety of posts on FlyerTalk, social media and blogs indicating airfares in the sub $100 for one way economy class travel as well as sub 700 dollars for Boston to Lisbon/Ponta Delgada on several occasions as well as sub 1500 from Chicago to Bilbao and Seville.

So there goes the argument that business class tickets must cost over x amount of dollars.

Now the next point is you are a Savvy frequent flyer who is interested in a personal level on airfares and actively seek Fair deals for travel for yourself or for others.

Over the course of your searches and by reading publicly available information you came across an airfare for sale to Europe before September 30th.

As we are in a pandemic of public knowledge and borders to Europe are closed right now for non citizens/ residents and there are many additional restrictions for entry into particular countries together with a massive decline in business travel, with frequent media stories of only dozens of passengers being transported on routes such as New York to London a well informed traveler could be led to the conclusion that transatlantic travel is extremely depressed.

It is also publicly known that TAP has financial difficulties has received bailouts from local governments and is actively seeking to sell tickets during this pandemic to stay afloat.

As such it is understandable that the airline initiated a short-term sale between the US and different points within the European Union in order to foment travel in their premium cabins which have been depressed by the implosion in business travel by selling these tickets at a cost that is marginal to the airline.

Based upon other airfares that are publicly available both posted by this airline and other airlines a savvy traveler who is knowledgeable about airfare sales from a personal level of interest could assume together with the advertisements that TAP was having a promotional sale.

Leave it to the defendant to prove that this was not a promotional sale that they have not sold airfares in the past at values of sub $600 for travel across the Atlantic and provide all information related to this airfare.

Prior to submitting this for small claims I would suggest filing a DOT response with some verbiage similar to the above paragraphs to see if TAP decides to comply.

Once again this is not legal advice just how I would approach it if I were involved in this deal.

giggity32

Orbitz is saying I have a credit too...... get ready for a chargeback. They are not helping at all and are telling me to deal with the airline

flyjfk

Expedia sent the airline an email asking to refund the money. Let's see if it helps.

Basanez

Chase Travel which is the same thing, was telling me they usually have to call TAP through a travel agent phone number and that it's disconnected. So they have to send an email and wait. We'll see. I'm used to charge backs with TAP at this point.

Antarius

Brilliant. I'm going to fight this.

As someone who does enterprise IT, the customer isn't responsible for your stupidity. Don't suck, or if you do, deal with the consequences.

Repooc17

Ok, but your ticket was less than €299 per. No?

The tweet states "from €299", which is advertising 101 to get you in the door, and can be interpreted as its medium haul offerings. Also, the corresponding URL indicates 1,499 USD between North America and Europe; not sure if the page had mentioned a different amount earlier in the week.

I have no skin in the game, but I hope TP would provide timely refund, and make everyone whole. Beyond that, I couldn't see myself spending any more time, but that's just me lah.

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/3916384-post524.html



Ok...refunds have not been issued, but we have made it to 7b now...good luck everyone!

denkigroove

This is so poor. Everyone who booked this had realized that it was a mistake price and the cancellation was expected. A simple error fare game.

IAN-UK

But what would you hope to gain from the court action, other than to be made whole? And whole-making is what TAP is offering.

A case I'm aware of that got more than that (admittedly on this side of theAtlantic) involved a claimant who purchased a new ticket and sued the airline for the difference between the refunded fare and what he paid for its replacement.

Courts are generally reluctant to impose "performance" in a case like this, seeing it as simpler and more equitable to restore the parties to their pre-contract position. But that's here, and New Jersey in likely different ....

But there seems little appetite among regulators, including DOT, to side with those taking advantage of mistake fares where the airline rectifies the mistake quickly and promptly returns the money paid. LATAM did just that to this opportunist a few months back : I was disappointed of course, but life's too short to indulge in pointless outrage and the pursuit of unicorns.



Just a note to put things in perspective: the frenzy this deal provoked here, and on sites specialising in promoting deals of this nature, suggests that these fares were pretty far from being in the range of any carrier's promotional offers.

WingedWorldExplorer

I do think you have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express. However there is more to it.

Since the trip originated in USA and ended in USA, any US Court with competent Jurisdiction should be able to adjudicate. You have several options ( i.e you do not have to file in New Jersey): The following is copied directly from my state's Judicial website.

If you are an Individual Plaintiff, you may file in the court handling small claims matters for the city or town: (a) where you live, (b) where the defendant lives or where the defendant’s business is located, or (c) where the transaction or injury occurred.

My guess is that you must be a US Citizen or US Legal Resident ( Green Card).

Many foreign corporations conducting business in US have a local Agent for Service of Process where legal papers can be served.

Call your State's Secretary of State for information.

By design, and my own personal experience, the Small Claims Process is rather user friendly requiring less stringent standards than those which apply in higher courts, allowing you to represent yourself ( pro se ), with you using ONLY respectful, true factual and relevant language in front of Judge or Magistrate. No need for use of complex legal language. In general, the Defendant or his lawyer must appear in person or risk losing the case. Some states have much higher limits than New Jersey. California is $ 10,000 for Individuals.

That is not what Make Whole is. The standard for this kind of Damages is: Status Quo Ante i.e what amount of $$$ will, if paid, bring the Plaintiff in exactly the same position as he was in before and if not for the Breach by the other Party ( i.e in possession of a valid ticket). No need to have actually purchased anything just what it reasonably would cost to Replace what was lost. You can not sue for specific Performance such as ticket re-issuance, future upgrades, mileage points etc. $$$ only .

Europeans are often surprised at US legal system and can simply not imagine what power an individual can exercice.

In my case in California a few years ago, the losing Defendants threatened to appeal ( which they really can not ) and waited almost to the end of the 30 day post-judgment period before issuing the checks. After 30 days, I could have called them in Default of Judgment allowing me to apply for Execution (seizure of assets or liens on bank accounts).
If TAP has not experienced the above before, they have a surprise coming. Even the language they use in the Notice of Cancellation exposes them to additional charges.

jfkeze

Go to TAP.com
Pick your original dates and flightsPrint/Screenshot the itinerary
Copy the new price as amount that you are suing for..

Wait... PreCovid it could take months in NYC Queens.

I have no horse in this particular race, just experience with other airlines and sales.