Mar 15, 2020, 10:29 am
Last edit by: Maestro Ramen
FARE RULES:
I pulled down the DL fare rules (these are BUD-SEA but they all appeared nearly identical). I posted them on a share. We can easily grab the AF and KL variants if others need those.
Q: This is a fully flexible fare with free changes. Does that mean I can change the flight dates as I want without paying anything extra?
A: No. The airline simply doesn't charge a change fee. But depending on the fare rules, you will still need to pay the difference to the new price.
Q: But I read that some people could change their flights for free...?
A: The rules for this fare (linked to above) specify that historical pricing shall be used if either at least one flight from the ticket has been taken or the outbound remains the same. In other words, in order to be able to change your flights for free, you must have flown at least one flight from your booking. Otherwise, you can only change the inbound. The outbound has to remain the same or you will be charged the fare difference.
Q: Can I change the rest of the itinerary after flying the first segment without any other charges or additional fare differences?
A: Yes this is possible according to the fare rules where after completing the first segment, you can change the rest of the flights for free (with the condition that the same fare class is available- I-class - in this case. According to the fare rules, after flying the FIRST segment (in the case here BUD-XXX) the historical fare is used. Possible to use the first stopover at AMS or CDG (see post #830).
Q: But some people could change their outbound flights for free!
A: They got lucky. It was probably a bug on the website/in the app. When no flight from the ticket has been flown, the fare rules do not allow changing the outbound without repricing.
Q: Ok, ok, so I can only change the inbound for free. How do I do that?
A: You search for availability for alternative flights on ITA Matrix using "F ..I2FFHU" in the extension codes. You must search for round trip flights as this is a round trip fare. Then you ignore the outbound result (as long as you haven't flown at least one flight from your ticket) and just try to rebook your inbound on the website/app.
Q: I have found availability on ITA Matrix, but the app/website doesn't show me those flights!
A: Keep trying. Sometimes you may have to serach in a different way (split up the searches, e.g. HNL-LAX and LAX-BUD), sometimes you just have to repeat the search several times. But that's no guarantee the desired results will turn up (and without repricing).
Q: It doesn't work. Can I just call the airline to make the changes?
A: Please don't unless you need to. Calling can increase the risk for all of us that they'll change their mind and disallow all further changes, or simply cancel everyone's tickets. However, as this fare has now been running for months and has seen many calls made about it, it is reasonable to expect that calling will not cause issues at this stage. As best practice, avoid attracting attention on the low price paid, and avoid making additional demands or tempting your luck. Remember you get to fly a J ticket for the cost of a Y fare.
Q: How many times can I make changes?
A: In theory, as often as you like, but you can't make more than two changes online/in the app. After that, you'd have to call, which we are trying to avoid.
Q: I've changed my mind. Can I get a refund?
A: Yes, the fare was fully refundable. Just contact the airline or fill out a refund form online.
Q: Due to Coronavirus, I need to extend my travel plan beyond the original expiry date. What can I do?
A: For Delta tickets (starting with 006) you can travel at any point until December 2022. Changes to flights within a 10 month window can be done at any point on the app, following the rules above. If you want to fly later than 10 months from now, you can call Delta and ask them to "park" your ticket. You will receive a ticket number that ties to an eCredit which can be used later to buy tickets. As long as you keep the original itinerary, or if you have flown at least a segment, you will not be charged a fare difference. Bear in mind that the eCredit may only be refundable if your original flight was cancelled (which is very likely in those day and times). Note that only Delta in the US are able to do this so do not call the EU numbers (use Skype to save money on international calls). According to user feedback: iMessage agents seem to also be able to do this, but twitter agents not.
I pulled down the DL fare rules (these are BUD-SEA but they all appeared nearly identical). I posted them on a share. We can easily grab the AF and KL variants if others need those.
Q: This is a fully flexible fare with free changes. Does that mean I can change the flight dates as I want without paying anything extra?
A: No. The airline simply doesn't charge a change fee. But depending on the fare rules, you will still need to pay the difference to the new price.
Q: But I read that some people could change their flights for free...?
A: The rules for this fare (linked to above) specify that historical pricing shall be used if either at least one flight from the ticket has been taken or the outbound remains the same. In other words, in order to be able to change your flights for free, you must have flown at least one flight from your booking. Otherwise, you can only change the inbound. The outbound has to remain the same or you will be charged the fare difference.
Q: Can I change the rest of the itinerary after flying the first segment without any other charges or additional fare differences?
A: Yes this is possible according to the fare rules where after completing the first segment, you can change the rest of the flights for free (with the condition that the same fare class is available- I-class - in this case. According to the fare rules, after flying the FIRST segment (in the case here BUD-XXX) the historical fare is used. Possible to use the first stopover at AMS or CDG (see post #830).
Q: But some people could change their outbound flights for free!
A: They got lucky. It was probably a bug on the website/in the app. When no flight from the ticket has been flown, the fare rules do not allow changing the outbound without repricing.
Q: Ok, ok, so I can only change the inbound for free. How do I do that?
A: You search for availability for alternative flights on ITA Matrix using "F ..I2FFHU" in the extension codes. You must search for round trip flights as this is a round trip fare. Then you ignore the outbound result (as long as you haven't flown at least one flight from your ticket) and just try to rebook your inbound on the website/app.
Q: I have found availability on ITA Matrix, but the app/website doesn't show me those flights!
A: Keep trying. Sometimes you may have to serach in a different way (split up the searches, e.g. HNL-LAX and LAX-BUD), sometimes you just have to repeat the search several times. But that's no guarantee the desired results will turn up (and without repricing).
Q: It doesn't work. Can I just call the airline to make the changes?
A: Please don't unless you need to. Calling can increase the risk for all of us that they'll change their mind and disallow all further changes, or simply cancel everyone's tickets. However, as this fare has now been running for months and has seen many calls made about it, it is reasonable to expect that calling will not cause issues at this stage. As best practice, avoid attracting attention on the low price paid, and avoid making additional demands or tempting your luck. Remember you get to fly a J ticket for the cost of a Y fare.
Q: How many times can I make changes?
A: In theory, as often as you like, but you can't make more than two changes online/in the app. After that, you'd have to call, which we are trying to avoid.
Q: I've changed my mind. Can I get a refund?
A: Yes, the fare was fully refundable. Just contact the airline or fill out a refund form online.
Q: Due to Coronavirus, I need to extend my travel plan beyond the original expiry date. What can I do?
A: For Delta tickets (starting with 006) you can travel at any point until December 2022. Changes to flights within a 10 month window can be done at any point on the app, following the rules above. If you want to fly later than 10 months from now, you can call Delta and ask them to "park" your ticket. You will receive a ticket number that ties to an eCredit which can be used later to buy tickets. As long as you keep the original itinerary, or if you have flown at least a segment, you will not be charged a fare difference. Bear in mind that the eCredit may only be refundable if your original flight was cancelled (which is very likely in those day and times). Note that only Delta in the US are able to do this so do not call the EU numbers (use Skype to save money on international calls). According to user feedback: iMessage agents seem to also be able to do this, but twitter agents not.
{prem fare gone}: AF/KL/DL/VS: BUD-US from $750 R/T
Dec 9, 2021, 3:10 am
#2896
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 2,481
Can anyone advise on what my options will be at this point?
Delta 006 flight, parked 12 months ago after a series of flight cancellations
Was reinstated earlier this year, for end December, had a series of flight cancellations again but they've rebooked me on alternatives
Due to travel restrictions i think it's going to be too difficult for me, so need to look at alternative options. At this point will me only options be to move +/- 2 days or full refund?
Delta 006 flight, parked 12 months ago after a series of flight cancellations
Was reinstated earlier this year, for end December, had a series of flight cancellations again but they've rebooked me on alternatives
Due to travel restrictions i think it's going to be too difficult for me, so need to look at alternative options. At this point will me only options be to move +/- 2 days or full refund?
Dec 9, 2021, 5:59 am
#2897
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 110
Are you in the US? I've been able to change my ineraries after having flown the first leg - just as the fare rules state. If you can't manage to fly your first leg, then I think the only thing you have to argue is the EC261 language about reaccommodation at "time of customer's choosing". Might be worth looking in the BA coronavirus rebooking thread for people who've successfully argued that one, but of course that may have jurisdictional divergence from these due to Brexit.
Dec 9, 2021, 7:16 am
#2898
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 2,481
Dec 13, 2021, 3:50 am
#2901
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 29
Hi, please let me know how it went. I will fly on 4.1.VIE-CDG-LAX-HNL. Did you made PCR or antigen test to US? I think I will need ESTA, PCR test, Hawai Safe Travels registration... Thanks
Dec 13, 2021, 8:47 am
#2903
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 110
Can anyone advise on what my options will be at this point?
Delta 006 flight, parked 12 months ago after a series of flight cancellations
Was reinstated earlier this year, for end December, had a series of flight cancellations again but they've rebooked me on alternatives
Due to travel restrictions i think it's going to be too difficult for me, so need to look at alternative options. At this point will me only options be to move +/- 2 days or full refund?
Delta 006 flight, parked 12 months ago after a series of flight cancellations
Was reinstated earlier this year, for end December, had a series of flight cancellations again but they've rebooked me on alternatives
Due to travel restrictions i think it's going to be too difficult for me, so need to look at alternative options. At this point will me only options be to move +/- 2 days or full refund?
Again seeking advice from those more knowledgeable but what do you think i could reasonably negotiate here? I know i can tweak the flights within +/- 2 days but i'm trying to ascertain if i have any further negotiating power for a more sweeping change to my dates?
Dec 13, 2021, 2:06 pm
#2904
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 2,481
Rebooked our other trip today. As I suspected, agents aren't particularly familiar with Bulletin 6 any more, so I got a couple of spurious pushbacks. One agent tried to claim that ecredit had to be used by July to be rebooked without fare difference, but linking to B6 seemed to squelch that objection. Then said "only applies if there's I space". This is correct, but I hadn't given her the flights yet... Gave my itin and proceeded when she confirmed the I space was there. She couldn't get the waiver to apply though, so I got passed off to ticketing support [which I had thought she had been, tbh].
Took a couple of hours of waiting [iMessage] before the support agent picked it up. She tried to claim I wasn't eligible for class-to-class because the dates didn't fit. Once I pointed out actual original dates she just ticketed with no issue - nor explanation of why she'd initially said no. I eventually realised that was because the previous agent had built the itinerary before passing me off, so the support agent had assumed that the new future travel was the original. Did get the "this ticket is non-refundable/non-changeable" spiel, but I suspect that's just autopilot.
For anyone still to reactivate: doing my research on Matrix worked to get me I space. I have stopovers in AMS, so I just ran the searches as a AMS-US round trip and did the BUD-AMS-BUD legs separately. Wasn't a huge selection of I space even far out in the calendar, but I might finesse these before the long-haul legs roll around.
Took a couple of hours of waiting [iMessage] before the support agent picked it up. She tried to claim I wasn't eligible for class-to-class because the dates didn't fit. Once I pointed out actual original dates she just ticketed with no issue - nor explanation of why she'd initially said no. I eventually realised that was because the previous agent had built the itinerary before passing me off, so the support agent had assumed that the new future travel was the original. Did get the "this ticket is non-refundable/non-changeable" spiel, but I suspect that's just autopilot.
For anyone still to reactivate: doing my research on Matrix worked to get me I space. I have stopovers in AMS, so I just ran the searches as a AMS-US round trip and did the BUD-AMS-BUD legs separately. Wasn't a huge selection of I space even far out in the calendar, but I might finesse these before the long-haul legs roll around.
Dec 15, 2021, 9:50 am
#2905
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Somewhere between BHX and HUY
Programs: Flying Blue Plat, Eurobonus Silver, ALL Gold
Posts: 1,674
Budapest still okay to enter with only NHS covid passport.
US okay to enter with antigen (lateral flow) test taken within 24 hours of flight departure (so, at Budapest airport).
Okay to return to the UK with a pre-departure test in the US, and a day2 PCR when coming back.
Yeah that is some bit of extra hassle and cost, but what is your concern exactly?
Dec 16, 2021, 10:08 am
#2906
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Somewhere between BHX and HUY
Programs: Flying Blue Plat, Eurobonus Silver, ALL Gold
Posts: 1,674
Ok now things are getting a bit more hairy...
Travellers from the UK not allowed in France. BUT transit for less than 24 hours still allowed. It's unclear whether the test requirements applies or not. Might need to get one just to be safe, so that will be one antigen in BHX and one more in BUD to ensure I comply with both 24hr regulations...
Travellers from the UK not allowed in France. BUT transit for less than 24 hours still allowed. It's unclear whether the test requirements applies or not. Might need to get one just to be safe, so that will be one antigen in BHX and one more in BUD to ensure I comply with both 24hr regulations...
Dec 17, 2021, 3:36 pm
#2907
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 114
For anyone still to reactivate: doing my research on Matrix worked to get me I space. I have stopovers in AMS, so I just ran the searches as a AMS-US round trip and did the BUD-AMS-BUD legs separately. Wasn't a huge selection of I space even far out in the calendar, but I might finesse these before the long-haul legs roll around.
Etienne, can you share your share criteria on matrix? I did not find anything last time I searched on matrix a couple of months ago (and even chatted twice with Delta agents who could not find anything either.) I am looking for something in late Apr/early May. Hope the Covid situation is better then. My original itinerary was BUD-CDG-SEA-SJC-SLC-AMS-BUD and had a 7 nights halt in CDG.
Edit: I see no availability from CDG or AMS to anywhere within 1000 miles of SEA. See the graphic.
Thx
Last edited by sarpotd; Dec 17, 2021 at 4:40 pm Reason: added graphic
Dec 18, 2021, 2:44 am
#2908
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: BAEC Silver, Flying Blue Gold, TK M&S Nobody
Posts: 2,481
Etiene, can you share your share criteria on matrix? I did not find anything last time I searched on matrix a couple of months ago (and even chatted twice with Delta agents who could not find anything either.) I am looking for something in late Apr/early May. Hope the Covid situation is better then. My original itinerary was BUD-CDG-SEA-SJC-SLC-AMS-BUD and had a 7 nights halt in CDG.
Edit: I see no availability from CDG or AMS to anywhere within 1000 miles of SEA. See the graphic.
Thx
Edit: I see no availability from CDG or AMS to anywhere within 1000 miles of SEA. See the graphic.
Thx
Add a random return/search return window with whatever trip length.
Edit: quick attempt below.
Spoiler
Last edited by etiene; Dec 18, 2021 at 9:39 am
Dec 21, 2021, 5:57 pm
#2909
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 114
I was able to get them to reissue the ticket for next year (Jul and Sep.) Lets hope the virus has subsided in the summer months.
I was not able to work with the chat agents at all. They refused to read anything on the bulletin 4. Finally I called and talked to a supervisor who went through it and then manually helped me get the ticket.
Here is bulletin 4:
https://pro.delta.com/content/agency...ulletin-4.html
The internal European business class seats were all showing up in J class so I did not get the dates I wanted but I will just work around what they gave me.
Thanks to Etienne for all the guidance and help provided.
1) I assume I can still make changes to the ticket once have flown the first leg (or do I lose that flexibility after getting the ticket reissued?)
2) What FF program are you guys putting the miles in? I had VS @ 200%
I was not able to work with the chat agents at all. They refused to read anything on the bulletin 4. Finally I called and talked to a supervisor who went through it and then manually helped me get the ticket.
Here is bulletin 4:
https://pro.delta.com/content/agency...ulletin-4.html
The internal European business class seats were all showing up in J class so I did not get the dates I wanted but I will just work around what they gave me.
Thanks to Etienne for all the guidance and help provided.
1) I assume I can still make changes to the ticket once have flown the first leg (or do I lose that flexibility after getting the ticket reissued?)
2) What FF program are you guys putting the miles in? I had VS @ 200%
Last edited by sarpotd; Dec 21, 2021 at 5:58 pm Reason: questions