Jun 19, 2013, 9:45 pm
Last edit by: fti
People, please edit/use the wiki so same questions are not always asked.
The current CTA decision on the Yangon deal is only for tickets canceled by SWISS Airlines for the seven merged complaints/companions and tickets canceled by Jet Airways for one complainant and companions
- It's not about other carriers because each carrier submits different tariffs.
- If you are not one of the complainants or their companions above who were mentioned in the respective cases, you need to submit a case yourself for hearing.
- There's currently one person who is on Iberia for CTA decision, one can either wait for results or submit a complaint to CTA.
Result of the current case for LX in brief is:
- CTA found 5(F) in the tariff used to be unclear for canceling tickets on erroneously quoted fares.
- 5(F) is unjust and unreasonable and must be revised or taken down by July 9, 2013 (or SWISS can appeal by then)
- SWISS did not use its tariff correctly to cancel the tickets.
- SWISS must compensate one complainant's First Class ticket and any related expenses by July 18, 2013 provided with evidence.
- SWISS must transport other complainants (and their companions) in the original price charged with same booking class and routing by June 18, 2014.
Result of the current case for 9W in brief is:
- Tariff on file had no clauses for "erroneous fares" and was updated subsequently, which means it is not relevant to this event
- Therefore, 9W is to reinstate the tickets with a 1-year validity for transport between the same points and the same booking class.
CTA official news can be read here for general overview of the case.
Actual CTA case review can be found here for reference should you wish to file a complaint.
If you have a similar case that's with SWISS, you need to file with CTA to get a result through informal process first before it gets to formal process. The entire procedure can take up to 3 months for each and the result may not be same cause it's case-by-base and the reviewer of the case can be different.
To file an informal complaint with CTA, see here. Click through all of the pages to get to the online form for the informal complaint. Or click here.
To file a formal complaint after informal complaint has been closed, see here. Continue on to the next page to see the address or email address for the formal complaint.
The July 17th and 18th responses from LX can be found here:
Other Letters:
Feel free to add dates, flights, etc., in order to plan DOs, etc.
Aug 4: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 5: ICN-SFO (UA892)
Jason8612
Aug 7: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 11: ICN-NRT-ORD (UA78, UA882)
Jason8612
Aug 14: BOS-IAD-NRT-ICN (UA285, UA803, UA79)
Deltspygt
Aug 19: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA352)
Deltspygt
Oct 1: UA433-UA893
JeredF +1
Oct 8: UA892-UA242
JeredF +1
Oct 9: BOS-SFO-ICN (UA433, UA893)
BigJC
Oct 13: ICN-NRT-ORD-BOS (UA78, UA882, UA744)
BigJC
Oct 21: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
Sterndogg +1
flyerdude88 (SFO - ICN portion only)
Oct 23: ICN - SFO UA 892
flyerdude88
Oct 27: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-BOS UA286
Sterndogg +1
Nov 05: BOS-ORD UA521, ORD-NRT UA881
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 11: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-IAD UA727
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 26: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-NRT UA837, NRT-ICN UA79
thepla
Nov 27: BOS-ORD-NRT-ICN (UA501, UA881, UA196)
BigJC+1
Nov 29: Planning 2 days in TPE, been to ICN
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-ORD UA698, ORD-BOS UA961
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA822)
BigJC+1
Dec 15: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
songzm
Dec 25: BOS-IAD UA285, IAD-NRT UA803, NRT-ICN UA79
Dinoscool3 +2
Dec 30: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA444
songzm
Dec 31: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA770
Dinoscool3 +2
Jan 11: BOS-SFO UA1523, Jan 12: SFO-ICN UA893
margarita girl
Jan 12: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
Zebranz
14 Jan: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
ORDOGG
19 Jan: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-ORD UA698 to ORD-BOS UA961
ORDOGG
Jan 22: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA500
margarita girl
Feb 5: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA242
Zebranz
CMB-DFW EY F
FARE IS GONE
FARE RULES (thanks to SQ421)
FRTLK Fare Rules (RT)
FOWLK Fare Rules (OW)
WHEN ARE YOU FLYING?
Feel free to add any additional cities you're leaving from!
Please slot yourselves in!!!
ex-CMB
Feb
Mar
8 - Darmajaya
12 - Thaidai
22 - Deadinabsentia
Apr
21 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
26 - tahsir21
May
28 - Upperdeck744
29 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
Jun
12 - lelee
Jul
7 - HansGolden +6
8 - arcticbull + 1
11 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: SIN-CMB, DFW-MCI)
25 - Tycosiao
30 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: MCI-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Aug
17 - DC777Fan
26 - Yi Yang
31 - dcas
Sep
Oct
Nov
8 - harryhv
29 - stephem+4
Dec
6 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. roastpuff , JFKEZE (UL Code-share)
7 - DWFI
10 - jlisi984 + dad (CMB-AUH-DFW)
21 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
ex-AUH
Jan
Feb
Mar
Apr
27 - RICHKLHS
May
Jun
29 - yerffej201
Jul
9 - HansGolden +6
27 - Tycosiao
Aug
Sep
Oct
Nov
30 - stephem+4 (to JFK)
Dec
7 - JFKEZE, DWFI [EY161 nonstop]
9 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. Roastpuff
ex-DFW
Jan
Feb
Mar
14 - Thaidai
15 - zainman +1
Apr
25 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
May
Jun
Jul
Aug
22 - arcticbull + 1
Sep
22 - bonsaisai (positioning flights ORD-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Oct
Nov
19 - harryhv->Paris
Dec
19 - Yi Yang, jona970318
24 - DWFI (EY160 nonstop)
26 - HansGolden +6 (CDG), LwoodY2K (AUH)
The current CTA decision on the Yangon deal is only for tickets canceled by SWISS Airlines for the seven merged complaints/companions and tickets canceled by Jet Airways for one complainant and companions
- It's not about other carriers because each carrier submits different tariffs.
- If you are not one of the complainants or their companions above who were mentioned in the respective cases, you need to submit a case yourself for hearing.
- There's currently one person who is on Iberia for CTA decision, one can either wait for results or submit a complaint to CTA.
Result of the current case for LX in brief is:
- CTA found 5(F) in the tariff used to be unclear for canceling tickets on erroneously quoted fares.
- 5(F) is unjust and unreasonable and must be revised or taken down by July 9, 2013 (or SWISS can appeal by then)
- SWISS did not use its tariff correctly to cancel the tickets.
- SWISS must compensate one complainant's First Class ticket and any related expenses by July 18, 2013 provided with evidence.
- SWISS must transport other complainants (and their companions) in the original price charged with same booking class and routing by June 18, 2014.
Result of the current case for 9W in brief is:
- Tariff on file had no clauses for "erroneous fares" and was updated subsequently, which means it is not relevant to this event
- Therefore, 9W is to reinstate the tickets with a 1-year validity for transport between the same points and the same booking class.
CTA official news can be read here for general overview of the case.
Actual CTA case review can be found here for reference should you wish to file a complaint.
If you have a similar case that's with SWISS, you need to file with CTA to get a result through informal process first before it gets to formal process. The entire procedure can take up to 3 months for each and the result may not be same cause it's case-by-base and the reviewer of the case can be different.
To file an informal complaint with CTA, see here. Click through all of the pages to get to the online form for the informal complaint. Or click here.
To file a formal complaint after informal complaint has been closed, see here. Continue on to the next page to see the address or email address for the formal complaint.
The July 17th and 18th responses from LX can be found here:
Other Letters:
Feel free to add dates, flights, etc., in order to plan DOs, etc.
Aug 4: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 5: ICN-SFO (UA892)
Jason8612
Aug 7: SFO-ICN (UA893)
Jason8612
Aug 11: ICN-NRT-ORD (UA78, UA882)
Jason8612
Aug 14: BOS-IAD-NRT-ICN (UA285, UA803, UA79)
Deltspygt
Aug 19: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA352)
Deltspygt
Oct 1: UA433-UA893
JeredF +1
Oct 8: UA892-UA242
JeredF +1
Oct 9: BOS-SFO-ICN (UA433, UA893)
BigJC
Oct 13: ICN-NRT-ORD-BOS (UA78, UA882, UA744)
BigJC
Oct 21: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
Sterndogg +1
flyerdude88 (SFO - ICN portion only)
Oct 23: ICN - SFO UA 892
flyerdude88
Oct 27: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-BOS UA286
Sterndogg +1
Nov 05: BOS-ORD UA521, ORD-NRT UA881
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 11: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-IAD UA727
kokonutz, I012609, BingoSF +1
Nov 26: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-NRT UA837, NRT-ICN UA79
thepla
Nov 27: BOS-ORD-NRT-ICN (UA501, UA881, UA196)
BigJC+1
Nov 29: Planning 2 days in TPE, been to ICN
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-ORD UA698, ORD-BOS UA961
thepla
Dec 1: ICN-NRT-IAD-BOS (UA78, UA804, UA822)
BigJC+1
Dec 15: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
songzm
Dec 25: BOS-IAD UA285, IAD-NRT UA803, NRT-ICN UA79
Dinoscool3 +2
Dec 30: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA444
songzm
Dec 31: ICN-SFO UA892, SFO-BOS UA770
Dinoscool3 +2
Jan 11: BOS-SFO UA1523, Jan 12: SFO-ICN UA893
margarita girl
Jan 12: BOS-SFO UA433, SFO-ICN UA893
Zebranz
14 Jan: BOS-SFO UA433 to SFO-ICN UA893
ORDOGG
19 Jan: ICN-SFO UA892 to SFO-ORD UA698 to ORD-BOS UA961
ORDOGG
Jan 22: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA500
margarita girl
Feb 5: ICN-SFO UA892 SFO-BOS UA242
Zebranz
CMB-DFW EY F
FARE IS GONE
FARE RULES (thanks to SQ421)
FRTLK Fare Rules (RT)
FOWLK Fare Rules (OW)
WHEN ARE YOU FLYING?
Feel free to add any additional cities you're leaving from!
Please slot yourselves in!!!
ex-CMB
Feb
Mar
8 - Darmajaya
12 - Thaidai
22 - Deadinabsentia
Apr
21 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
26 - tahsir21
May
28 - Upperdeck744
29 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
Jun
12 - lelee
Jul
7 - HansGolden +6
8 - arcticbull + 1
11 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: SIN-CMB, DFW-MCI)
25 - Tycosiao
30 - bonsaisai's friend (positioning flights: MCI-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Aug
17 - DC777Fan
26 - Yi Yang
31 - dcas
Sep
Oct
Nov
8 - harryhv
29 - stephem+4
Dec
6 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. roastpuff , JFKEZE (UL Code-share)
7 - DWFI
10 - jlisi984 + dad (CMB-AUH-DFW)
21 - bonsaisai (positioning flights SIN-CMB, DFW-ORD)
ex-AUH
Jan
Feb
Mar
Apr
27 - RICHKLHS
May
Jun
29 - yerffej201
Jul
9 - HansGolden +6
27 - Tycosiao
Aug
Sep
Oct
Nov
30 - stephem+4 (to JFK)
Dec
7 - JFKEZE, DWFI [EY161 nonstop]
9 - roastpuff and (soon) Mrs. Roastpuff
ex-DFW
Jan
Feb
Mar
14 - Thaidai
15 - zainman +1
Apr
25 - SQ421, penegal, jozdemir
May
Jun
Jul
Aug
22 - arcticbull + 1
Sep
22 - bonsaisai (positioning flights ORD-DFW, CMB-SIN)
Oct
Nov
19 - harryhv->Paris
Dec
19 - Yi Yang, jona970318
24 - DWFI (EY160 nonstop)
26 - HansGolden +6 (CDG), LwoodY2K (AUH)
[PREM FARE GONE] RGN First class comes back again!!!!
May 20, 2013, 7:11 pm
#8161
Join Date: Apr 2007
Programs: QF, VA, AC, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 3,784
I agree with you about being stubborn and sticking with the "i bought the fare as presented" argument.
That's what I did. It took months of calls and emails back and forth. Finally I got a new ticket from IB via my OTA in Economy. I emailed my OTA and pointed out the mistake and a few days later they sent a new ticket in Business. So everything is now back to the way it was, except I have a new ticket number, and a CX flight replacing an NZ flight, HKG-LHR.
That's what I did. It took months of calls and emails back and forth. Finally I got a new ticket from IB via my OTA in Economy. I emailed my OTA and pointed out the mistake and a few days later they sent a new ticket in Business. So everything is now back to the way it was, except I have a new ticket number, and a CX flight replacing an NZ flight, HKG-LHR.
May 20, 2013, 8:11 pm
#8162
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LAT/LONG
Programs: UA 1k; Hyatt Plat; SPG Gold; Avis PC Preferred; Priority Pass Select; AMEX Platinum
Posts: 442
Is the currency devaluation relevant to r3 tickets?
A few data points:
While SWISS is trying to make this all about a third party mistake, that is simply not true.
IATA is an organization where both the LX and LH CEO are board members.
APTCO is a company partially owned by LX.
LX has access to all levels of information, strategies, stats, facts regarding ALL aspects of the fare publishing protocol.
LX had the opportunity numerous times to not participate in YY fares and also check the fares and correct them. They failed.
The MMK (Kyat) underwent a substantial currency devaluation on 4/12/2012. All SWISS had to do is add two "0" to the fare and there would have been no problem.
There was no misfiling, the issue is a non-filing or non adjustment.
There is no technical error here, there is no 3rd party error here. Swiss missed the currency devaluation. And we are guilty!!!
I don't think so
While SWISS is trying to make this all about a third party mistake, that is simply not true.
IATA is an organization where both the LX and LH CEO are board members.
APTCO is a company partially owned by LX.
LX has access to all levels of information, strategies, stats, facts regarding ALL aspects of the fare publishing protocol.
LX had the opportunity numerous times to not participate in YY fares and also check the fares and correct them. They failed.
The MMK (Kyat) underwent a substantial currency devaluation on 4/12/2012. All SWISS had to do is add two "0" to the fare and there would have been no problem.
There was no misfiling, the issue is a non-filing or non adjustment.
There is no technical error here, there is no 3rd party error here. Swiss missed the currency devaluation. And we are guilty!!!
I don't think so
May 20, 2013, 9:14 pm
#8163
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVPG 75K
Posts: 2,574
They claim no, but here's an excerpt from one of my responses to CTA:
SWISS also claims that there was no “connection to the spring 2012 devaluation of the Myanmar currency.” I find this claim dubious. Before the devaluation of the Myanmar Kyat it was pegged to the U.S. Dollar at a rate of MMK6.41:USD1.00. At purchase, Swiss converted the base fare (the fare excluding taxes and airline surcharges) as published in Myanmar Kyat (MMK103930) to USD at a rate of MMK873.36:USD1.00. If this foreign currency fare was converted at the old rate of 6.41:1 we see a base fare of approximately USD16,000, quite similar to the USD15,000 SWISS maintains was the “correct fare.”
May 20, 2013, 9:35 pm
#8164
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: LAT/LONG
Programs: UA 1k; Hyatt Plat; SPG Gold; Avis PC Preferred; Priority Pass Select; AMEX Platinum
Posts: 442
Perfect! The individual handling your case was spot on in terms of FX conversions - this is by far not a mistake, but rather a business error in dealing with floating, and in this case volatile exchange rates.
shame on LX and the other carriers trying to weasel out of their business error
shame on LX and the other carriers trying to weasel out of their business error
May 20, 2013, 9:43 pm
#8165
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVPG 75K
Posts: 2,574
would anybody be willing to share with me their CTA letter (scanned with personal information redacted) that shows that the CoC did NOT have rule 005F in them?
I know that the CTA said it does not matter to them, but I want to show the judge down here that the CoC were in effect at the time of purchase and I can already see their lawyers arguing... "prove it, prove it... "
I know that the CTA said it does not matter to them, but I want to show the judge down here that the CoC were in effect at the time of purchase and I can already see their lawyers arguing... "prove it, prove it... "
After my initial complaint (which Swiss ignored) they updated their website to include Rule 005F in the tariff. This fact is acknowledged in the reply I received:
/my bold
Dear Mr. Brewer:
This is with reference to your concerns about the validity of the Swiss
tariff that was posted on its web site when you were purchasing your
fares.
As previously noted, the Canadian Transportation Agency enforces the
carriers’ application of tariffs. Although all international carriers
selling flights through the Internet to and from Canada must post their
terms and conditions of carriage (tariffs) on their web sites, they are
also required to file their tariffs with the Agency. In the event an
international tariff posted on an air carrier’s web site is
inconsistent with its international tariff that is on file with the
Agency, the carrier’s tariff on file with the Agency prevails.
Due to complaints like yours about Swiss’ failure to display its
current tariff on its web site at time of ticket purchase, the matter
has been forwarded to the Agency’s Enforcement Division for
investigation and any action deemed necessary. The Agency’s
Enforcement Division conducts inspections and investigations across
Canada, and can issue warnings and fines, including administrative
monetary penalties when an air carrier fails to comply with a legal
requirement.
With reference to your position that Swiss has not provided any
evidence of a technical failure as referenced in the applicable term and
condition of carriage included in its international tariff on file with
the Agency (and now posted on its web site), it would appear that my
efforts to resolve your complaint with Swiss by way of the Agency's
informal complaint resolution process have been unsuccessful. Therefore,
I am closing your informal complaint file.
...
Yours truly,
Debbie Orr
Complaints Officer
Air Travel Complaints Directorate
Canadian Transportation Agency
Government of Canada
Attachment
c.c.: Swiss International Air Lines Ltd (under separate cover)
This is with reference to your concerns about the validity of the Swiss
tariff that was posted on its web site when you were purchasing your
fares.
As previously noted, the Canadian Transportation Agency enforces the
carriers’ application of tariffs. Although all international carriers
selling flights through the Internet to and from Canada must post their
terms and conditions of carriage (tariffs) on their web sites, they are
also required to file their tariffs with the Agency. In the event an
international tariff posted on an air carrier’s web site is
inconsistent with its international tariff that is on file with the
Agency, the carrier’s tariff on file with the Agency prevails.
Due to complaints like yours about Swiss’ failure to display its
current tariff on its web site at time of ticket purchase, the matter
has been forwarded to the Agency’s Enforcement Division for
investigation and any action deemed necessary. The Agency’s
Enforcement Division conducts inspections and investigations across
Canada, and can issue warnings and fines, including administrative
monetary penalties when an air carrier fails to comply with a legal
requirement.
With reference to your position that Swiss has not provided any
evidence of a technical failure as referenced in the applicable term and
condition of carriage included in its international tariff on file with
the Agency (and now posted on its web site), it would appear that my
efforts to resolve your complaint with Swiss by way of the Agency's
informal complaint resolution process have been unsuccessful. Therefore,
I am closing your informal complaint file.
...
Yours truly,
Debbie Orr
Complaints Officer
Air Travel Complaints Directorate
Canadian Transportation Agency
Government of Canada
Attachment
c.c.: Swiss International Air Lines Ltd (under separate cover)
Name
Swiss International Air Lines Ltd.
Contraventions
Date of issuance: March 25, 2013
Results of a compliance verification indicate that Swiss International Air Lines Ltd. is in contravention of section 116.1 of the Air Transportation Regulations.
Display of Terms and Conditions on Internet Sites
116.1 An air carrier that sells or offers for sale an international service on its Internet site must also display on the site the terms and conditions of carriage applicable to that service and must post a notice to that effect in a prominent place on the site.
Penalty
Formal warning
Swiss International Air Lines Ltd.
Contraventions
Date of issuance: March 25, 2013
Results of a compliance verification indicate that Swiss International Air Lines Ltd. is in contravention of section 116.1 of the Air Transportation Regulations.
Display of Terms and Conditions on Internet Sites
116.1 An air carrier that sells or offers for sale an international service on its Internet site must also display on the site the terms and conditions of carriage applicable to that service and must post a notice to that effect in a prominent place on the site.
Penalty
Formal warning
May 21, 2013, 5:16 am
#8168
Join Date: Apr 2007
Programs: QF, VA, AC, Hyatt, Marriott
Posts: 3,784
Scroll down in this article.
May 21, 2013, 5:27 am
#8169
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: In the air
Programs: Occasional RTW club
Posts: 6,924
Scroll down in this article.
May 21, 2013, 11:46 am
#8170
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: NYC
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 124
The routing is RGN-KUL-HKG-LHR-YUL - Ib tkt. The first two segments on Malaysian Airlines, HkG-LHR on NZ, LHR-YUL on BA.
First the NZ part dropped because they stopped flyinging that route. Then BA cancelled LHR-YUL.
I had to keep calling and calling and getting nowhere for the longest before suddenly I got through to an agent who said it would cost me $50 if they contacted the airline to fix the problem. I agreed and they sent me a ticket in economy a few days later, which was replaced with Business class tkt when I pointed out my original booking was in Business.
Everything is now restored as it was originally with the exception of HKG-LHR which is now on CX. I did get a new ticket number and booking ref. On checkmytrip everything is there.
May 21, 2013, 2:52 pm
#8171
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: SAT
Programs: AA EXP BA Gold, TK Gold, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, AS 100K, QR PLT, SAS Gold, IHG Spire, AMR
Posts: 5,898
May 21, 2013, 3:07 pm
#8172
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 96
well, look what I came across. Got to love the internet. A live case from Texas
Many of you asked for some actual files and facts, and there it is
Fun read to better understand Swiss' myopic mindset
EDIT: Apparently I don't know how to attach files. If one of you can tell me how, I will post a pleading from LX. I tried google.docs, but was not successful
Many of you asked for some actual files and facts, and there it is
Fun read to better understand Swiss' myopic mindset
EDIT: Apparently I don't know how to attach files. If one of you can tell me how, I will post a pleading from LX. I tried google.docs, but was not successful
Last edited by BigFatConductor; May 21, 2013 at 3:12 pm
May 21, 2013, 3:20 pm
#8173
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Seattle
Programs: AS MVPG 75K
Posts: 2,574
well, look what I came across. Got to love the internet. A live case from Texas
Many of you asked for some actual files and facts, and there it is
Fun read to better understand Swiss' myopic mindset
EDIT: Apparently I don't know how to attach files. If one of you can tell me how, I will post a pleading from LX. I tried google.docs, but was not successful
Many of you asked for some actual files and facts, and there it is
Fun read to better understand Swiss' myopic mindset
EDIT: Apparently I don't know how to attach files. If one of you can tell me how, I will post a pleading from LX. I tried google.docs, but was not successful
May 21, 2013, 3:32 pm
#8174
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 96
See if you can see this.
https://mega.co.nz/#!RR1HRQ4A!cBPc7w...-ZXSMdQBaT3qC4
it's called swiss cheese because their arguments has as many holes as Swiss Cheese
https://mega.co.nz/#!RR1HRQ4A!cBPc7w...-ZXSMdQBaT3qC4
it's called swiss cheese because their arguments has as many holes as Swiss Cheese