Misuse of Corporate\Discounted Rate Codes
#31
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,614
[QUOTE=hunter69] If I spend 150+ nights during a year on a corporate rate legitimately, what is the impact of me using that same rate for a few weekend getaways?
None at all!! You are not making any misrepresentations. You have ID & there are no limitations about when you can use the rate.
On the other hand, the publicly available weekend rate might be < than your corporate rate.
None at all!! You are not making any misrepresentations. You have ID & there are no limitations about when you can use the rate.
On the other hand, the publicly available weekend rate might be < than your corporate rate.
#32
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: MUC
Programs: LH Sen // HH Dia; Bonvoy LTTE
Posts: 3,205
Originally Posted by DJ_Iceman
My comment for Marriott_Guy is very simple: please enforce the rates at check-in. You'll solve the problem for all of us. If the front desk staff are going to let people abuse things like negotiated rate codes then they are meaningless. As you stated, legitimate users of the codes will be punished while the "sneaks" will benefit. If a rate code requires an ID or some other form of proof of eligibility, then please CHECK IT! The legitimate user won't have any problem with that at all, I assure you.
#33
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,188
Many legitimate travelers (e.g., salesman, consultants, employees from affiliated companies) wouldn't have any verifiable ID so the suggested TSA, "check everybody" approach is problematic. Also, what constitutes a valid ID?
I'd rather the hotel focus on a friendly welcome than training the night clerk on all of the valid IDs of all of the hotel's corporate clients.
My personal suggestion is to consider checking IDs if the hotel is full that night.
I'd rather the hotel focus on a friendly welcome than training the night clerk on all of the valid IDs of all of the hotel's corporate clients.
My personal suggestion is to consider checking IDs if the hotel is full that night.
#34
Moderator, Marriott Bonvoy & FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: McKinney, TX, USA
Programs: United Silver; AA Plat/2MM; Marriott LT Titanium; Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,727
Originally Posted by drtdk
Many legitimate travelers (e.g., salesman, consultants, employees from affiliated companies) wouldn't have any verifiable ID so the suggested TSA, "check everybody" approach is problematic. Also, what constitutes a valid ID?
#35
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Rio Rancho, NM
Programs: US Chairman 150+, AA EXP, United 1K, Marriott PP, Hertz PC
Posts: 222
Originally Posted by drtdk
Many legitimate travelers (e.g., salesman, consultants, employees from affiliated companies) wouldn't have any verifiable ID so the suggested TSA, "check everybody" approach is problematic. Also, what constitutes a valid ID?
As I've mentioned before, I have had clerks ask me that question during check in. I think it's fine for them to do so.
#36
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Programs: UALifetimePremierGold, Marriott LifetimeTitanium
Posts: 71,113
I do consulting for different companies. Some have corp rates; some don't. The ones that have corp rates tell me to use it as then my expenses are less than if I stayed at a non-corp rate and it also helps them to fulfill their room obligation w/ the chain to get the corp rate.
I'm not normally asked for id, & I wouldn't have it given I'm an independent consultant. If asked for a letter I'd contact my client & get them to send it over (well, hopefully - some of the people I report to travel as well), although wouldn't do it unless asked as it's an additional hassle.
When I worked for corp America (F50 & F500 firms) we were told we could use the corp rate for personal travel as well. I'm assuming it's because they wanted to hit their room #s for the discount. Actually when I worked for corp America I was never asked for id.
About the only time I'm asked for it now is w/ the AAA rate & even that's spotty.
Cheers.
I'm not normally asked for id, & I wouldn't have it given I'm an independent consultant. If asked for a letter I'd contact my client & get them to send it over (well, hopefully - some of the people I report to travel as well), although wouldn't do it unless asked as it's an additional hassle.
When I worked for corp America (F50 & F500 firms) we were told we could use the corp rate for personal travel as well. I'm assuming it's because they wanted to hit their room #s for the discount. Actually when I worked for corp America I was never asked for id.
About the only time I'm asked for it now is w/ the AAA rate & even that's spotty.
Cheers.
#37
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boston, MA
Programs: AA EXP, UA Global Services , Marriott Platinum
Posts: 301
When spending time onsite at certain customers, they suggest we use their rate, as others have mentioned here.
Marriott_Guy, what is your take on that? If a customer tells me to use their negotiated rate when I am specifically visiting them, am I eligible to use it?
Thanks.
Marriott_Guy, what is your take on that? If a customer tells me to use their negotiated rate when I am specifically visiting them, am I eligible to use it?
Thanks.
#38
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Programs: Marriott/Hilton GM for 20+ years, but not an offical spokeperson
Posts: 72
Originally Posted by KimmyAA
...If a customer tells me to use their negotiated rate when I am specifically visiting them, am I eligible to use it?
Thanks.
Thanks.
Most of the time the negotiated rate is extended for contractors or visiting vendors/suppliers for the company, as well as is available for use on personal use for the it's associates on non-company related travel. Of course, there are a few exceptions to this, but generally this is true. My opinion - by all means use their negotiated rate. Some bigger companies even offer their vendors/suppliers 'Vendor' cards to be shown at c/i to receive the neg rate.
Thanks and hope this helps.
#39
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR/SPG LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus
Posts: 31,009
Originally Posted by rothrob
While a discussion on the ethics surrounding the use of corporate codes may be valid, let's not forget the economics here either.
Remember, hotel rates aren't set in stone. They flux...
Remember, hotel rates aren't set in stone. They flux...
If "economics" influence your "ethics", then in reality you have none. IMHO.
#40
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: SFO
Programs: UAL 1P, SPG Gold, Marriott Gold, Hertz PC
Posts: 58
Seriously? Perhaps someone with an indefatigable moral compass would interpret my post that way. I prefer to think that my post was suggesting that economics influence one's choice of hotels, not one's ethics. Furthermore, I stand by my statement that a hotel operator may very well prefer to have someone pay for a room at a corporate rate that they may not qualify for rather than have an empty room. What’s unreasonable about that?
The supposition that ethics don't change, however, is unreasonable.
The supposition that ethics don't change, however, is unreasonable.
#41
Guest
Posts: n/a
with the advent of the internet, brokers, low cost travel agencies, you can almost always match or better the corporate rate.
I get a load of total BS from my company about using Amex Corporate card so they can "negotiate" with service providers.
Guess what, 95% of the time, my own individual searching and negotiation gets me a better rate and benefits.
ie: If I hire a car with Hertz, my "company" rate is quite cheap and I do not have to prepay, but I get no insurance and a limit of 180 free miles. If I do it myself and use wow rate code, I get unlimited miles, insurance and its costs no more.
With hotel, often I find the corporate rate is higher than the plethora of leisure rates.
When mentioned to said travel dept, they sigh and say they "need to know where I am" in case of worldwide disaster or "people like you weaken our cr*p negotiators hand".
Well, in my 20 years of being on the road, the travel dept has never once pre-empted any cancellation or disaster. I ring up, they ask me where I am, and then we go from there.
I know the vast majority of travellers don't bother with stuff like I do but I would close with the following summary:
Corporate discounts today are not what they used to be and most non-company TA's shold be able to find you a similar if not better rate (maybe not for Govt employees). Whilst lots of company negotiators think they are doing a great job will all the company data and the discounts that they can secure with it, no one actually looks to see how much it saves against real rates V's the rack rates from which the discounts are secured. In other words, some times you win and sometimes you lose so net net, forcing you to use particular services or chains is counter productive and not in the best interests of the traveller.
(the only counter to the last point possibly being reciprocal spend which is a moot point as well)
I get a load of total BS from my company about using Amex Corporate card so they can "negotiate" with service providers.
Guess what, 95% of the time, my own individual searching and negotiation gets me a better rate and benefits.
ie: If I hire a car with Hertz, my "company" rate is quite cheap and I do not have to prepay, but I get no insurance and a limit of 180 free miles. If I do it myself and use wow rate code, I get unlimited miles, insurance and its costs no more.
With hotel, often I find the corporate rate is higher than the plethora of leisure rates.
When mentioned to said travel dept, they sigh and say they "need to know where I am" in case of worldwide disaster or "people like you weaken our cr*p negotiators hand".
Well, in my 20 years of being on the road, the travel dept has never once pre-empted any cancellation or disaster. I ring up, they ask me where I am, and then we go from there.
I know the vast majority of travellers don't bother with stuff like I do but I would close with the following summary:
Corporate discounts today are not what they used to be and most non-company TA's shold be able to find you a similar if not better rate (maybe not for Govt employees). Whilst lots of company negotiators think they are doing a great job will all the company data and the discounts that they can secure with it, no one actually looks to see how much it saves against real rates V's the rack rates from which the discounts are secured. In other words, some times you win and sometimes you lose so net net, forcing you to use particular services or chains is counter productive and not in the best interests of the traveller.
(the only counter to the last point possibly being reciprocal spend which is a moot point as well)
#42
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Mesilla, NM
Programs: DL DM 4.7 MM MQM Marriott Ambassador Lifetime Titanium AA CK
Posts: 2,714
Marriott_Guy's is correct
I try to live my life by thinking about the following statement. Do the right thing for the right reasons. Sad very sadly the world does not work that way. Marriott_Guy is 100% correct you should never use rates other than what you are entitled to, but by the same token Marriott should follow the same policy in some of its rate structure. I travel often on USG business and Marriott often has two rates one for USG employees and one for contractors (have contractor badges). Since the USG will often only reimburse without prior approval USG rates only and Marriott must know that these kinds of things are going to happen. As I said everyone ought to do the right thing for the right reasons. Marriott includes. Thanks Marriott_Guy for starting this thread. ^ and this discussion.
#43
Original Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Programs: Marriott/Hilton GM for 20+ years, but not an offical spokeperson
Posts: 72
Thanks hnewman.
Regarding the separate rates for employees and vendors/contractors, this is a negotiated item. Sometimes it is dictated by the respective company (the two separate rates). This can happen due to a number of reasons. One, the company may negotiate a better rate for itself and a different one for it's vendors since it has shareholders to report to and do not have to report to the shareholders of their vendors. Sounds cold, but that is reality. It also depends on their negotiating power (volume for either a given market or on a more global basis). I am not speaking for Marriott on a whole, just my perspective as a GM. yes, I am aware that this does happen (reimbursement policy stipulations), however obviously I am not part of the decision process with the respective company. However, the bigger companies that do negotiate rates do so on behalf of their contractor's as well, usually regardless of size. Since at times a number of smaller companies do not necessarily have the volume to be able to negotiate a rate on their own, the 'company' can and does offer do so on their behalf. Yes, they do so to keep their costs lower as well, but trust me on this - they are looking out for their suppliers. It ultimately helps their bottom line.
Hope this helps out.
Regarding the separate rates for employees and vendors/contractors, this is a negotiated item. Sometimes it is dictated by the respective company (the two separate rates). This can happen due to a number of reasons. One, the company may negotiate a better rate for itself and a different one for it's vendors since it has shareholders to report to and do not have to report to the shareholders of their vendors. Sounds cold, but that is reality. It also depends on their negotiating power (volume for either a given market or on a more global basis). I am not speaking for Marriott on a whole, just my perspective as a GM. yes, I am aware that this does happen (reimbursement policy stipulations), however obviously I am not part of the decision process with the respective company. However, the bigger companies that do negotiate rates do so on behalf of their contractor's as well, usually regardless of size. Since at times a number of smaller companies do not necessarily have the volume to be able to negotiate a rate on their own, the 'company' can and does offer do so on their behalf. Yes, they do so to keep their costs lower as well, but trust me on this - they are looking out for their suppliers. It ultimately helps their bottom line.
Hope this helps out.
#44
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Programs: UALifetimePremierGold, Marriott LifetimeTitanium
Posts: 71,113
BTW marriott_guy, since you're relatively new to FT, this topic (ok to use rates or not) crops up on a somewhat regular basis each year. You could do a search & all the old threads would probably be listed, although really no need to do so.
The responses mainly fall into 3-4 areas:
1) I would never do it & the rest of you who do are unethical schmoes who should have a good time in hades w/ the devil;
2) heck yes I'll use any code I can to get a discount (at any hotel chain, not just Marriott);
3) Most of the time I don't use a code I'm not entitled to but occasionally I'll look for something cheaper if the trip is on my dime;
4) I'm not going to post whether I do or not; I'm just going to grab the popcorn & soda & watch you all have at it.
I doubt if those who are on the I'll never do it & you all are going to h*ll & those who use them a lot will change their minds based on this thread (or the previous ones).
Cheers.
The responses mainly fall into 3-4 areas:
1) I would never do it & the rest of you who do are unethical schmoes who should have a good time in hades w/ the devil;
2) heck yes I'll use any code I can to get a discount (at any hotel chain, not just Marriott);
3) Most of the time I don't use a code I'm not entitled to but occasionally I'll look for something cheaper if the trip is on my dime;
4) I'm not going to post whether I do or not; I'm just going to grab the popcorn & soda & watch you all have at it.
I doubt if those who are on the I'll never do it & you all are going to h*ll & those who use them a lot will change their minds based on this thread (or the previous ones).
Cheers.
#45
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Redondo Beach, CA USA
Programs: UA 1KMM, Bonvoy LTE+A, HH D, Nat'l EE, Hertz Plat, Avis PC
Posts: 3,713
Originally Posted by rothrob
What hotel operator would rather see a room sit empty then to have it be occupied, even at a discounted rate?