Is Marriott the worst points program or is it me?
#46
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 2
who to contact
This is the email i received
Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi received your emails regarding your concerns with Marriott Vacation Club. Attorney General Bondi asked that I respond.
At the state level, the Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation (DBPR) regulates timeshare plans in this state, pursuant to chapter 721, Florida Statutes (see www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes). We are forwarding your correspondence to the DBPR for review. Please contact the agency directly to follow up at:
Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation
Division of Florida Condominiums, Timeshares, and Mobile Homes
2601 Blair Stone Road
Tallahassee, Florida 32399
Telephone: (850) 488-1122
Website: http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr/lsc/timeshare.html
FAQs: http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr...shareFAQs.html
You can also find helpful information and consumer tips about timeshare and vacation plans online at:
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles...vacation-plans
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/topics/...sumer-problems
The Florida Bar offers a Lawyer Referral Service toll-free at (800) 342-8060 or online at http://www.floridabar.org/lawyerreferral. If you need help locating an attorney in your area, you may call the California Bar at (866) 442-2529 or visit http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Public/Lawy...rvicesLRS.aspx.
Thank you for contacting Attorney General Bondi's office. I hope this proves helpful.
Also you can contact Richard at Dept of business and professional regulation, timeshare sector at 407-650-4076 or write hi at the address 400 west Robinson, suite N908, Orlando , Florida 32801
Florida Attorney General Pam Bondi received your emails regarding your concerns with Marriott Vacation Club. Attorney General Bondi asked that I respond.
At the state level, the Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation (DBPR) regulates timeshare plans in this state, pursuant to chapter 721, Florida Statutes (see www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes). We are forwarding your correspondence to the DBPR for review. Please contact the agency directly to follow up at:
Florida Department of Business and Professional Regulation
Division of Florida Condominiums, Timeshares, and Mobile Homes
2601 Blair Stone Road
Tallahassee, Florida 32399
Telephone: (850) 488-1122
Website: http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr/lsc/timeshare.html
FAQs: http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr...shareFAQs.html
You can also find helpful information and consumer tips about timeshare and vacation plans online at:
http://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles...vacation-plans
https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/topics/...sumer-problems
The Florida Bar offers a Lawyer Referral Service toll-free at (800) 342-8060 or online at http://www.floridabar.org/lawyerreferral. If you need help locating an attorney in your area, you may call the California Bar at (866) 442-2529 or visit http://www.calbar.ca.gov/Public/Lawy...rvicesLRS.aspx.
Thank you for contacting Attorney General Bondi's office. I hope this proves helpful.
Also you can contact Richard at Dept of business and professional regulation, timeshare sector at 407-650-4076 or write hi at the address 400 west Robinson, suite N908, Orlando , Florida 32801
#47
In memoriam
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: MAN
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, IHG Spire, UA Silver, Dennis The Menace Fan Club
Posts: 1,457
It's a mistake to compare hotel cards on the basis of earning 1 point/dollar. Hilton points certainly are worth less apiece than SPG and Hyatt points, but Hilton makes its credit cards competitive by always paying MORE than 1 point/dollar. HH Surpass (Amex) pays 6 points/dollar on restaurants, gas, and grocery stores-- which together are a significant portion of my non-travel expenditure. I've made it my primary card for these categories.
For non-North American residents this can be a pretty binary discussion as hotel loyalty credit cards are few and far between and not very rewarding. As a result each scheme can be looked at against points per $ on stays and elite bonuses. As an EU resident my North American road trip last year that mixed staying in capital cities (Ottawa & DC), big cities (Montreal, Toronto and NYC), tourist (Niagara) and small towns, Marriott was marginally the best earn and burn with IHG/SPG fighting for close second and Hilton a clear last.
#48
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,785
Even with that admission you've still got more facts wrong. The RC card only gives Gold one year:
https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...arlton-rewards
On top of that, it's got a quite high annual fee of $395.
By contrast, the Hilton Amex Surpass card gives you HH Gold for $75 a year, every year you hold it, and the Hilton Citi Reserve card gives you HH Gold for $95 a year, every year you hold it.
So I don't see how a $395 annual fee + $10000 spend requirement a year (after the first year) is "giving status away".
https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...arlton-rewards
Automatic Gold Elite Status your first account year
As a new Cardmember, enjoy complimentary Gold Elite status in The Ritz-Carlton Rewards® program for your first account year. To continue to enjoy Gold Elite Status benefits, simply spend $10,000 your first year and each subsequent year to maintain your Gold Elite status.
after that it needs substantial spend.As a new Cardmember, enjoy complimentary Gold Elite status in The Ritz-Carlton Rewards® program for your first account year. To continue to enjoy Gold Elite Status benefits, simply spend $10,000 your first year and each subsequent year to maintain your Gold Elite status.
On top of that, it's got a quite high annual fee of $395.
By contrast, the Hilton Amex Surpass card gives you HH Gold for $75 a year, every year you hold it, and the Hilton Citi Reserve card gives you HH Gold for $95 a year, every year you hold it.
So I don't see how a $395 annual fee + $10000 spend requirement a year (after the first year) is "giving status away".
#49
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: SJC/SFO
Programs: WN A+ CP, UA 1MM/*A Gold, Mar LT Tit, IHG Plat, HH Dia
Posts: 6,284
It's awfully hard to buy top-tier MR status with credit card spend. After the initial 15 nights from carrying the MR Visa card you'd need to spend $180,000 on the card to earn the other 60 nights required to reach Platinum. Comping status for $180k spend is not a giveaway.
#50
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Florida
Posts: 686
It's awfully hard to buy top-tier MR status with credit card spend. After the initial 15 nights from carrying the MR Visa card you'd need to spend $180,000 on the card to earn the other 60 nights required to reach Platinum. Comping status for $180k spend is not a giveaway.
#51
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
It's a mistake to compare hotel cards on the basis of earning 1 point/dollar. Hilton points certainly are worth less apiece than SPG and Hyatt points, but Hilton makes its credit cards competitive by always paying MORE than 1 point/dollar. HH Surpass (Amex) pays 6 points/dollar on restaurants, gas, and grocery stores-- which together are a significant portion of my non-travel expenditure. I've made it my primary card for these categories.
Unfortunately, Hilton has so few upscale or luxury hotels that I enjoy that it's just not of much interest to me, personally. The Conrads and few Waldorfs just can't get me excited about Hilton...as if the ridiculous redemption rates don't make it less worthwhile for me compared to the top tier properties in Starwood, Hyatt, etc.
#52
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,785
It's awfully hard to buy top-tier MR status with credit card spend. After the initial 15 nights from carrying the MR Visa card you'd need to spend $180,000 on the card to earn the other 60 nights required to reach Platinum. Comping status for $180k spend is not a giveaway.
I never travel for work so there is no way I could have gotten any status with anything travel related if not for credit cards.
#53
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Programs: UALifetimePremierGold, Marriott LifetimeTitanium
Posts: 71,107
BTW - I think we've all answered the OP's question - it's him/her
Cheers.
Cheers.
#54
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP MM, HHonors Lifetime Diamond, Marriott Lifetime Ti, UA Silver
Posts: 5,036
Consider that over 3/4 of Marriott's portfolio has been less than upscale...while almost 90% of Starwood's portfolio is upscale or better. Hilton has an even greater proportion of less than upscale properties, and IHG is even greater. If you're looking for cheaper hotels, those chains serve you well...but not for nicer hotels. Marriott will remedy that with the addition of Starwood, of course...but that won't really make a difference until 2018 when the programs merge.
As to definitions of what constitutes "upscale", the STR Global Chain Scales say one thing, and our personal experiences tell us another. Based on the STR scales all of the SPG brands, and all but Fairfield Inn, MOXY, and TownePlace Suites are considered "upscale" or better (those 3 MR brands constitute about 25% of MR's properties BTW). The STR grading is apparently based on average room rates rather than overall quality, so they don't actually say very much about what matters to us IMO.
We all have our own personal definitions of "upscale" and "aspirational". I'm sure others will come along and provide their own personal examples...
View of the adjacent area from my room at the ITC Maurya:
Last edited by PHLGovFlyer; Aug 13, 2016 at 10:51 am
#55
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Southern California, USA
Programs: Marriott Ambassador and LTT, UA Plat/LT Gold, AA Gold
Posts: 8,764
Actually, in the "Luxury" segment of the STR Global Chain Scales for 2016 there are 38 St. Regis, 102 Luxury Collection, and 49 W properties currently open worldwide. This compares to 99 Ritz Carlton, 84 JW Marriott, 5 Edition, and 4 Bulgari properties currently open worldwide in the Marriott family. So there are more Marriott branded properties currently operating under that definition of Luxury segment than SPG branded properties (192 Marriott, 189 SPG).
Insofar as using points go, the SPG luxury properties require far fewer points or comparable spend to achieve those points compared with Marriott or Hilton or IHG. Of course, that becomes moot once Marriott merges programs with Starwood.
"Aspirational" is very much in the eye of the beholder. It also IMO doesn't depend on being assigned a particular brand by a hotel chain. Earlier this year I stayed at the ITC Maurya (a Luxury Collection Property). The property is quite nice, but you can see the view from my window at the bottom of this post. Even though it's a Luxury Collection property I personally don't consider it "aspirational". I also don't consider the Ritz Carlton Kapalua to be aspirational. YMMV!
Again, it depends entirely on how you define "upscale". Based on your assessment that almost 90% of the SPG portfolio is upscale or better, there must be a great many of what you consider "upscale" 4 Points and Aloft properties since those brands constitute over 23% of the currently operating SPG properties.
As to definitions of what constitutes "upscale", the STR Global Chain Scales say one thing, and our personal experiences tell us another. Based on the STR scales all of the SPG brands, and all but Fairfield Inn, MOXY, and TownePlace Suites are considered "upscale" or better (those 3 MR brands constitute about 25% of MR's properties BTW). The STR grading is apparently based on average room rates rather than overall quality, so they don't actually say very much about what matters to us IMO.
We all have our own personal definitions of "upscale" and "aspirational". I'm sure others will come along and provide their own personal examples.
Again, it depends entirely on how you define "upscale". Based on your assessment that almost 90% of the SPG portfolio is upscale or better, there must be a great many of what you consider "upscale" 4 Points and Aloft properties since those brands constitute over 23% of the currently operating SPG properties.
As to definitions of what constitutes "upscale", the STR Global Chain Scales say one thing, and our personal experiences tell us another. Based on the STR scales all of the SPG brands, and all but Fairfield Inn, MOXY, and TownePlace Suites are considered "upscale" or better (those 3 MR brands constitute about 25% of MR's properties BTW). The STR grading is apparently based on average room rates rather than overall quality, so they don't actually say very much about what matters to us IMO.
We all have our own personal definitions of "upscale" and "aspirational". I'm sure others will come along and provide their own personal examples.
As I said, Marriott is not the worst, but it isn't the best. It probably will get better after merging programs with Starwood--but that remains to be seen until 2018.
#56
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHL
Programs: AA EXP MM, HHonors Lifetime Diamond, Marriott Lifetime Ti, UA Silver
Posts: 5,036
That is incorrect. The only MR brands that are below "Upscale" on the STR rankings are Fairfield Inn, MOXY, Protea, and TownePlace Suites (I missed Protea in my earlier post). Those four MR brands constitute less than 27% of MR's properties.
Last edited by PHLGovFlyer; Aug 14, 2016 at 7:30 am
#57
Join Date: Aug 2017
Programs: Marriott, United, national
Posts: 1
Garbage... Actually
Last year I transferred 35k chase points to MR so that we could spend a night at Atlantis, but that trip didn't happen. Now I have been trying to use the Marriott points before they expire but they are worthless. I just looked up a Marriott in Pompano beach. It is $153 per night but it cost 35k points. How is that even possible that is less then 1/2 cent per point. Where as if they were chase points I could get 3 times that. Man this just really irks me, and I wanted to know if others feel the same.
#58
Suspended
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: HH-D; MR-P/LTP; SPG-P
Posts: 849
Or on the flip side, as a MR Plat I can spend $1250 at a Marriott property and along with my Visa card earn 25,000 points and redeem these points at the JW Phu Quoc where nightly rates are $400-$600 which is a very nice return on spend/redemption
#59
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: DCA, EGE, IAD
Programs: MR LTT, BA Gold, AA LTP, UA Silver
Posts: 6,077
For $10,000 spent at Marriott properties I would earn 200,000 MR points. 10 pts/$ + 50% Plat bonus + 5 pts/$ for using MR Visa.
200K points yields 5 nights at a Cat 9 hotel (180K points) total value $1800-2700 and 20K points left over.
It's always best to use points/miles in the program from which they were accrued. The only exception would be MR Hotel + Air Travel Packages combined with airline bonus offers, but that's another discussion.
While Chase/Chase Sapphire is good for the infrequent traveler, those of us that travel frequently use affinity cards associated with the programs we use and are most beneficial to us. I'm sure there are a lot better things for which to use Chase points than converting to Marriott points.
So to answer the OP's question, to a great extent it is you because converting Chase points to Marriott points is a bad deal, not that Marriott itself is bad deal. Actually Marriott has one of the best earn to burn ratios out there; but that's within its program.
#60
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,452
In fact, for Marriott stays, the CSP gives essentially the same return as the Chase Marriott, at around 4.5%.