Wells Fargo Fiasco
Sep 13, 2016, 11:47 am
#16
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Colorado
Programs: Alaska, Shell VC, Wyndham VC, Starwood, RCI, II--I bought it on eBay!
Posts: 159
"We are eliminating product sales goals because we want to make certain our customers have full confidence that our retail bankers are always focused on the best interests of customers...."
I know this because I am very closely related to someone who was indeed harassed and hounded by upper-level management to sell, sell, sell, even to the point of relatives and close friends opening accounts they did not need or would not use much, just to keep this person from being fired. The job loss would have hurt this person immensely.
Sep 13, 2016, 7:28 pm
#17
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 827
More like, "We are going to stop threatening our employees with the loss of job, if they don't open new accounts and continually hound customers who aren't interested in our various products."
I know this because I am very closely related to someone who was indeed harassed and hounded by upper-level management to sell, sell, sell, even to the point of relatives and close friends opening accounts they did not need or would not use much, just to keep this person from being fired. The job loss would have hurt this person immensely.
I know this because I am very closely related to someone who was indeed harassed and hounded by upper-level management to sell, sell, sell, even to the point of relatives and close friends opening accounts they did not need or would not use much, just to keep this person from being fired. The job loss would have hurt this person immensely.
Sep 14, 2016, 4:41 pm
#18
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,173
re
See my earlier comment. AMEX is denying spending without receiving the level of sales detail to determine what was bought. If I were to buy a $500 Barnes and Noble gift card for my kiddo in college to use in his bookstore that is absolutely playing by AMEX identified rules. But if AMEX denies the spending because it assumes the purchase was for a $500 prepaid debit card, then I say put the management in stocks and fire away with the rotten cabbages and tomatoes. How dare banksters give the stink eye in such a situation when they incentivize fraud by employees and give fraud the blind eye. Or have we forgotten AMEX's past fines for money laundering and violation of consumer protection laws? As I recall Chase and BoA were both fined for money laundering and TD for a Ponzi scheme. If you put these institutions on a pedestal the mob will only have an easier target to hit with those rotten veggies.
BTW Harleyn , would you happen to know the size of the bonus top Well Fargo management received during the time this fiasco was going on? That $155M in performance pay to John Stumpf would buy quite a few trainloads of rotten cabbages for my trebuchet.
BTW Harleyn , would you happen to know the size of the bonus top Well Fargo management received during the time this fiasco was going on? That $155M in performance pay to John Stumpf would buy quite a few trainloads of rotten cabbages for my trebuchet.
Sep 14, 2016, 9:14 pm
#19
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 814
Ahhhh..... but it was the employee's fault, not the top level Executives. 
I wonder how the typical WF employee feels hearing the Big Boss blame the employees?
Have the Executives considered that the products being offered may not be considered a good value by the customers?
Instead we have high cost products offered to customers who don't want them, by employees under huge pressure to Sell! Sell! Sell!!!! or face grim consequences.
What could possibly go wrong?
I wonder how the typical WF employee feels hearing the Big Boss blame the employees?
Have the Executives considered that the products being offered may not be considered a good value by the customers?
Instead we have high cost products offered to customers who don't want them, by employees under huge pressure to Sell! Sell! Sell!!!! or face grim consequences.
What could possibly go wrong?
Last edited by MrTemporal; Sep 14, 2016 at 9:21 pm
Sep 14, 2016, 9:25 pm
#20
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: All of them
Posts: 1,664
That is quite ridiculous. Blackmailing employees to sell useless products to unwilling consumers, then fire them en masse for using tricky tactics to meet the pressure. I hope those who got fired join in for a massive lawsuit.
Sep 14, 2016, 9:31 pm
#21
Join Date: Jan 2012
Programs: Marriott/SPG Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 887
All the mortgage-backed securities guys in 2007-2008 KNEW what a house of cards it was, but just wanted to get rich quick before it burst.
We need to bring back old-timers like William K. Black (S&L crisis), empowered to put some of these jackasses in jail. Only idiots and bankers believe in financial deregulation.
Sep 15, 2016, 12:12 am
#22
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Land of the parrots and parrotheads
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Posts: 4,820
Lest we forget in 2012, the U.S. Attorney in the Southern District of New York brought a case against Wells Fargo seeking 'hundreds of millions of dollars' in damages for what it says is a decade of mortgage market fraud.
Wells Fargo is an institution that you taxpayers bailed out to the tune of tens of million of dollars in the 2000's financial crisis.
For that kind of money taxpayers are entitled to see some heads in a basket. Pay the golden parachute money out to the screwed customers after the public beheadings are done. Anyone know if Amazon has a sale on pikes so we can parade those heads around Wall Street?
Wells Fargo is an institution that you taxpayers bailed out to the tune of tens of million of dollars in the 2000's financial crisis.
For that kind of money taxpayers are entitled to see some heads in a basket. Pay the golden parachute money out to the screwed customers after the public beheadings are done. Anyone know if Amazon has a sale on pikes so we can parade those heads around Wall Street?
Sep 15, 2016, 12:58 am
#23
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SFO
Programs: HH Gold, CC Gold
Posts: 292
This was in my email last night:
To our valued customers,
You may have seen news recently that some Wells Fargo customers received products and services that they did not want or need.
Every day we strive to get things right. In this instance we did not – and that is simply not acceptable.
So we are making it right.
The first step we've taken is to fully reimburse any customers who were affected by these actions.
We have been making some changes to how we do business over the last several years to ensure we are always aligned with our customers' interests. To that end, the second change is to ensure Team Members in our Retail Bank are compensated on what matters most: delivering great experiences and ensuring positive outcomes – not on product sales. For more details on this, go to wellsfargo.com/commitment.
Last week's news did not reflect Wells Fargo at its best. Your trust and confidence in us is something we hold near and dear. I know I speak for our 268,000 dedicated Team Members when I thank you for giving us the opportunity to continue serving you and supporting your financial future.
Sincerely,
John Stumpf
Chairman and CEO, Wells Fargo Bank
You may have seen news recently that some Wells Fargo customers received products and services that they did not want or need.
Every day we strive to get things right. In this instance we did not – and that is simply not acceptable.
So we are making it right.
The first step we've taken is to fully reimburse any customers who were affected by these actions.
We have been making some changes to how we do business over the last several years to ensure we are always aligned with our customers' interests. To that end, the second change is to ensure Team Members in our Retail Bank are compensated on what matters most: delivering great experiences and ensuring positive outcomes – not on product sales. For more details on this, go to wellsfargo.com/commitment.
Last week's news did not reflect Wells Fargo at its best. Your trust and confidence in us is something we hold near and dear. I know I speak for our 268,000 dedicated Team Members when I thank you for giving us the opportunity to continue serving you and supporting your financial future.
Sincerely,
John Stumpf
Chairman and CEO, Wells Fargo Bank
Sep 15, 2016, 11:08 am
#24
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: IAD
Programs: All of them to one degree or another
Posts: 447
Sep 15, 2016, 11:22 am
#25
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Land of the parrots and parrotheads
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Sep 15, 2016, 1:15 pm
#26
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 814
Another sad thing is the climate of fear that the employees must work in.
That does not say much for top management.
Perhaps the top Execs should at least watch the movie "The Paths of Glory". Or better yet, the WF employees should watch the movie.
That does not say much for top management.
Perhaps the top Execs should at least watch the movie "The Paths of Glory". Or better yet, the WF employees should watch the movie.
the ambitious General Mireau (George Macready), to send his division on a suicide mission to take a well-defended German position called the "Anthill." Mireau initially refuses, citing the impossibility of success and the danger to his beloved soldiers, but when Broulard mentions a potential promotion, Mireau quickly convinces himself the attack will succeed.
<snip>
Dax leads the first wave of soldiers over the top into no man's land under heavy fire, but the attack is a failure. None of the men reach the German trenches,
<snip>
To deflect blame for the failure, Mireau decides to court martial 100 of the soldiers for cowardice.
<snip>
Dax leads the first wave of soldiers over the top into no man's land under heavy fire, but the attack is a failure. None of the men reach the German trenches,
<snip>
To deflect blame for the failure, Mireau decides to court martial 100 of the soldiers for cowardice.
Last edited by MrTemporal; Sep 15, 2016 at 9:14 pm
Sep 15, 2016, 7:09 pm
#27
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: IAD
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Sep 21, 2016, 7:39 am
#28
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Location: Land of the parrots and parrotheads
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It gets even better - an ethics hot line created so the bank could flag those who blow the whistle on fraud and fire them?
From CNN:
Now CNNMoney is hearing from former Wells Fargo (WFC) workers around the country who tried to put a stop to these illegal tactics. Almost half a dozen workers who spoke with us say they paid dearly for trying to do the right thing: they were fired.
"They ruined my life," Bill Bado, a former Wells Fargo banker in Pennsylvania, told CNNMoney.
Bado not only refused orders to open phony bank and credit accounts. The New Jersey man called an ethics hotline and sent an email to human resources in September 2013, flagging unethical sales activities he was being instructed to do.
Eight days after that email, a copy of which CNNMoney obtained, Bado was terminated. The stated reason? Tardiness.
This old auditor and fraud examiner wants to know where the hell were Wells Fargo's internal auditors while this fiasco was going on? Did their management get a fat bonus, too?
From CNN:
Now CNNMoney is hearing from former Wells Fargo (WFC) workers around the country who tried to put a stop to these illegal tactics. Almost half a dozen workers who spoke with us say they paid dearly for trying to do the right thing: they were fired.
"They ruined my life," Bill Bado, a former Wells Fargo banker in Pennsylvania, told CNNMoney.
Bado not only refused orders to open phony bank and credit accounts. The New Jersey man called an ethics hotline and sent an email to human resources in September 2013, flagging unethical sales activities he was being instructed to do.
Eight days after that email, a copy of which CNNMoney obtained, Bado was terminated. The stated reason? Tardiness.
This old auditor and fraud examiner wants to know where the hell were Wells Fargo's internal auditors while this fiasco was going on? Did their management get a fat bonus, too?
Sep 21, 2016, 10:46 am
#29
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,322
There is very likely more to this guy's story than what's being presented. Firing someone who has made a report to an internal ethics hotline likely takes many layers of approval and probably couldn't/wouldn't be done in eight days. CNN has no idea if the alleged email/call was actually sent/made, and also has no idea what the guy's file looks like. However --
If this guy feels like he was illegally retaliated against, he can certainly file a lawsuit to try & recover damages.
If this guy feels like he was illegally retaliated against, he can certainly file a lawsuit to try & recover damages.
It gets even better - an ethics hot line created so the bank could flag those who blow the whistle on fraud and fire them?
From CNN:
Now CNNMoney is hearing from former Wells Fargo (WFC) workers around the country who tried to put a stop to these illegal tactics. Almost half a dozen workers who spoke with us say they paid dearly for trying to do the right thing: they were fired.
"They ruined my life," Bill Bado, a former Wells Fargo banker in Pennsylvania, told CNNMoney.
Bado not only refused orders to open phony bank and credit accounts. The New Jersey man called an ethics hotline and sent an email to human resources in September 2013, flagging unethical sales activities he was being instructed to do.
Eight days after that email, a copy of which CNNMoney obtained, Bado was terminated. The stated reason? Tardiness.
This old auditor and fraud examiner wants to know where the hell were Wells Fargo's internal auditors while this fiasco was going on? Did their management get a fat bonus, too?
From CNN:
Now CNNMoney is hearing from former Wells Fargo (WFC) workers around the country who tried to put a stop to these illegal tactics. Almost half a dozen workers who spoke with us say they paid dearly for trying to do the right thing: they were fired.
"They ruined my life," Bill Bado, a former Wells Fargo banker in Pennsylvania, told CNNMoney.
Bado not only refused orders to open phony bank and credit accounts. The New Jersey man called an ethics hotline and sent an email to human resources in September 2013, flagging unethical sales activities he was being instructed to do.
Eight days after that email, a copy of which CNNMoney obtained, Bado was terminated. The stated reason? Tardiness.
This old auditor and fraud examiner wants to know where the hell were Wells Fargo's internal auditors while this fiasco was going on? Did their management get a fat bonus, too?
Sep 21, 2016, 10:55 am
#30
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,322
Don't forget that no unauthorized account would have been opened had not an employee violated numerous internal rules (and perhaps laws) to effectuate the opening.
I think WFC be faulted mainly for lack of internal controls & risk management to prevent unauthorized accounts from being opened. They also seem to have been slow to address the problem, starting first with a remedial program in So Cal before expanding nationwide.
No employee likes unrealistic demands from their boss, but that doesn't give you carte blanche to break the rules.
I think WFC be faulted mainly for lack of internal controls & risk management to prevent unauthorized accounts from being opened. They also seem to have been slow to address the problem, starting first with a remedial program in So Cal before expanding nationwide.
No employee likes unrealistic demands from their boss, but that doesn't give you carte blanche to break the rules.