Aloha! Can�t help you with your question, but welcome to FT!

I�ve decided that we will end up going clockwise effectively between of ryokan availability. Satoyama Jujo took my fancy so end up going tokyo, Niigata, up the western coast, then back around Akita towards morioka and then down via Sendai / Yamagata. Just need to select a second ryokan based on some of those recommendations and research some more!

We�re traveling to Japan for the first time in early February, and we�re going with another couple. We only have 10 days, and we�re aiming to have a day in a ryokan between our hotel in Tokyo and our hotel in Kyoto.

Could you recommend a ryokan anywhere roughly between Tokyo and Kyoto that:
1. Provides in-room onsen
2. Incredible kaiseki experience
3. Can accommodate a shellfish allergy
4. Luxe accommodations
5. Would be a good experience for the 4 of us together, this is the confounding factor that I�m struggling with.

Welcome to Flyertalk, Joshua! I hope one of the ryokan experts has a suggestion, but I'd like to recommend that you consider spending that night in the Hakone area. It's a simple destination to get to from Tokyo (direct private rail express trains from Shinjuju station) and then straightforward to connect the next day to the shinkansen to Kyoto. There are a lot of lodging options, including ryokan, to chose from.

What the Hakone area offers is not just superb closeup views of Mt Fuji, but a variety of different types of transport which are all fun to ride -- old trains, cable cars, ships, ropeways. Check it out:

https://www.odakyu.jp/english/passes/hakone/

Note that since you will be only going one way from Tokyo, you would buy the pass at Odawara or Hakone Yumoto and get a regular ticket from Shinjuku to Hakone Yumoto.

It's a very different experience from Kyoto/Nara but one rhat is well worthwhile.

Thanks RichardInSF ! Hakone is definitely something that has come up and seems to have more ryokan options, we�re not too dogmatic about the location piece - just invested in the best experience. I�ve been thinking of the Fufu Nara as that seems conveniently located and like an excellent property. Additionally, spending the time in Nara would mean we wouldn�t have to use one of our Kyoto days day tripping back to see it.

I�m really hoping someone has traveled with another couple before and had some incredible experience with friends. Please don�t hesitate to offer ANY advice that may be salient though - I�m responsible for the whole trip for all 4 of us and Japan is overwhelming!

Welcome to FT, JoshuaLHamby!

I visited Wanosato with a group of close friends last year when one of them discovered your post while researching ryokans. I'm no stranger to Japan having visited almost semi-annually in my childhood but only now have been able to afford luxury accomodations like staying at ryokans (weak yen really helped too). In a really rough year I'm glad I got some memories in the tail end of sitting at breakfast watching the beautiful mountain stream and drinking tea. It was absolutely lovely and convinced me to look and book another ryokan for my next visit.

I'm visiting Japan in October with my partner and was very nervous about choosing a ryokan but managed to find a room at Hakone Suishoen that worked for our schedule. Really looking forward to Suishoen now with how it was included in this post.

Again thank you KI-NRT for making such an amazingly detailed post. For someone like me who's a complete stranger to the world of luxury this was invaluable in building a mental model of what to look for or expect when deciding which ryokan to book. Your post really does as advertised! "A Primer + Impressions!"

Welcome to Flyertalk!

Welcome peakshaving!

Thank you! This is an incredible post, aligned perfectly with what we love about Ryokan/Onsen. I've used this to plan our November trip--have stays booked at Wanosanto, looking at Honjin Hiranoya Kachoan or Shogetsu, + Sanso Amanasato.

We stayed at Sankara back in 2016 & would second your opinion + undeveloped tidal onsen on Yakushima are magical (plus easy to rent a car on Yakushima since there is no traffic--the staff at the rental car agency would wave at us every time we drove by during our stay). In Kagoshima, we stayed at Wasure no sato GAJOEN. It may have declined in the past 9 years, but was amazing when we went.

Thank you so much for this fantastic thread KI-NRT. I�ve read the entire post and most of the replies at this point.

My girlfriend and I will be in Japan in late December and have one free day/night during which we would like to stay at a wonderful ryokan. Based on our tastes, trip routing, and room availability we have narrowed it down to Beniya Muyaku or Hanamurasaki.

KI-NRT I read your review of Beniya Muyaku. I don�t see a review for Hanamurasaki in the post, but it sounds like you have been there. Do you have a preference between the two? If I had to prioritize two things that we value the most, it would be food and general �luxuriousness�. In case this impacts your answer, Hanamurasaki is completing a renovation of several of their rooms which will be complete in October. This is what the room at Hanamurasaki that we would book (Art Suite [Natsu-5] with private open-air bath and sauna) looks like post-renovation:





Whereas, at Beniya Muyaku, the two most premium rooms (Wakamurasaki Suite and Byakuroku Terrace Suite) are unavailable on our date - all the other room types are available. Of the available room type, the Zen Style Executive Suite appears to be the most premium option that we would book:








If anybody has stayed at both (or even either) and can offer some insight, it would be greatly appreciated. Pricing is relatively comparable, so I am not factoring that into my decision. Who knew this could be such a difficult decision!

Tough call. Aesthetics and room wise, that's a personal decision. Looking at the post-renovation photos, it does seem like the Natsu Suite - while humongous - has a lot of empty, unusable space. Note that we stayed at Hanamurasaki in 2018, so it's been a while.

Neither property offers meals in one's own room; however, at least in Hanamurasaki it's not a completely open and exposed dining room - there are semi dividers for some amount of privacy, although it doesn't offer much in the way of noise insulation (although probably a bit better than Beniya Mukayu.)

The key thing to note about Hanamurasaki is its a-la-cart kaiseki dinner system... to me, it's weird. Basically, they give you a base amount of "points" which can be used to order from a massive menu, with each dish costing a certain amount of "points." Exceed the allotted points and you have to pay extra. The problem with this system is that it's hard to know what is worth getting and what is not (and there are no photos of the dishes.) And, who knows whether the dishes you ordered is too much or too little food. I just wish the executive chef would just serve what he/she recommends, rather than putting the onus on the guest. However, for people with numerous allergies or unique preferences, the system might be preferred.

Thanks for the feedback. The thought of figuring out what to order on a menu with no pictures and unfamiliar dishes stresses me out. We went ahead and booked Beniya Mukayu. Very much looking forward to it. I'll certainly report back here after.

This is such a wonderful thread. Thank you for all the reviews.

Has anyone tried Fufu Hakone?

I was looking at it and it seems like the onsen are indoor/outdoor which could be good to keep the mosquitoes away from those of us who are allergic. But it also looks like it's a bit far from everything else in Hakone. I would really appreciate it if anyone who has stayed there could share their thoughts.

Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen inside entrance area

Kyoto City proper isn't known for Onsen; in fact, there are very few - if any - luxury hotels or ryokans in the city that offer in-room free-flowing, straight-from-the-source, never recirculated hot springs baths. When they say "Onsen" in Kyoto, it usually means the Onsen is trucked in from somewhere and recirculated.

To get a real Onsen ryokan experience anywhere near Kyoto, Arima Onsen near Kobe comes to mind. Problem is, via public transportation it's well over an hour to get there from Kyoto Station, and at least 75 minutes by car. There is a more convenient alternative, one that is far lesser known but much easier to get to - Yunohana Onsen. The area is in Kameoka, a city on the outskirts of Kyoto and just 30 minutes away by direct train via JR. Suisen is 15 minutes by courtesy shuttle from Kameoka Station, making it about as accessible for those looking for an authentic Onsen ryokan experience not far from Kyoto city. Kameoka is valley that is known to be perpetually foggy, making it ideal for growing a wide variety of produce. In fact, it is one of the important food production areas in the Kansai region, along with Tamba and Kyo-Tango.


Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen lounge area


Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen lounge area

Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen is well regarded for its authentic Onsen and gourmet Kaiseki cuisine, and we've always wanted to stay here. We had our chance last week, and brought Mrs. KI-NRT's mother along for an evening of peace, relaxation and fine dining.

First off, Suisen is an excellent value given what you get. Every single one of the 13 rooms have open-air Onsen baths on the balcony, and base room rates are less than 40,000 yen per person per night, half board. In addition, the entry-level rooms are not at all constricting; they're over 50 square meters in size.


View of the garden from the Suisen Suite (3F)

The property is relatively compact, but they make good use of the comparatively limited space - the property grounds are thin and long, but there is a small creek running through the grounds, with a dry rock garden on one side and an embankment with a forested garden on the other side - it also houses the one private rental Onsen bath. Speaking of the rental bath, it's available only to paid guests and costs a whopping 3500 yen per hour. Is it worth it, especially when every room already has its own Onsen? That depends - the walk across the creek and up the stairs to the rental bath structure is an enchanting one, and the Onsen itself is a pretty rock bath. If you're looking to maximize your Onsen experience, why not? That's what we did, anyway.


Walk to the private rental open-air Onsen bath


Private rental open-air Onsen bath

In addition to the in-room Onsen and the rental bath, there is also a communal, gender-segregated Onsen as well. Since there are only 13 rooms at Suisen, and each room has an open-air bath, I wouldn't expect too many guests to make use of the public bath. I visited just before dinner, and I had the place all to myself. Pure bliss. There is both an indoor and outdoor bath.


Men's communal indoor and open-air Onsen bath

For our stay, we booked the two highest category rooms at Suisen - the 113m� Suisen Suite and the 85m� Semi Suite. The Suisen Suite is definitely the more spacious of the two, with the main difference being the addition of a Japanese-style tatami living room. Other advantages of the Suisen Suite include dual sinks in the bathroom, a larger closet and storage room, and a bigger balcony. The Semi Suite, however, has been refurbished more recently (2021 vs. 2013) - while it does feel shinier and newer, in no way did the Suisen Suite feel in need of a refresh. Both rooms are still screaming bargains by Kansai standards (such as Arima Onsen and Kyoto) - the Suisen Suite was 65,000 yen per person, and the Semi Suite was just a tad less at 59,000 yen. Since the rates are quite negligible, I'd say go for the best available room on the dates you're looking to book, and you won't go wrong with the choice. The drinks in the minibar (including beer) are free of charge, and there are an array of Japanese treats that are also laid out on the table for guests to enjoy.


Suisen Suite, 113m�


Suisen Suite, 113m�


Suisen Suite, 113m�


Suisen Suite balcony with open-air Onsen bath

We were really looking forward to the highly regarded kaiseki cuisine, especially given that Fall (and Spring) is generally considered the best season for the best produce, seafood and wild vegetables in the country - Early Fall offering newly-harvested rice as well as numerous mountain vegetables like wild parsley, bracken, matsutake mushrooms, lotus roots and mustard greens,

Suisen did not disappoint. The kitchen staff artfully crafted some unique dishes that were unmistakenly kaiseki but had their own twists to the formula. The steamed Yuba (Tofu skin) with Tofu Mochi beneath it, with both in a simple yet sublime dashi broth was simple yet unique at the same time, and was wonderful in taste. The simmered vegetables in a semi-sweet broth was prepared to perfection, as was the Nagaimo (Japanese mountain yam) paste with Shrimp that was steamed and then deep-fried with thin somen noodles. Of all of the servings, the next-to-last one was a bit underwhelming - the Octopus cooked with rice in a clay pot was somewhat disappointing. It wasn't bad at all, but given that it's newly-harvested rice season, we would have preferred perfectly steamed rice with some excellent condiments to round out the savory part of the dinner.


Top left: Dash soup, Yuba (Tofu skin) with Tofu Mochi below it, topped with grated ginger. Bottom from left to right: Anago (Conger Eel) dressed with soy sauce, sake and Sanso peppers; Satsuma-imo (Japanese sweet potato) simmered with sweetened Lemon juice; Shimeji mushroom deep-fried with rice crackers; Kamasu (Barracuda) sushi.


From left to right: Simmered Shiitake, Carrots, Japanese Squash, Burdock Root, Daikon Radish, Frozen-dried Tofu and Daikon Radish Sprouts dressed in an incredible broth; Sliced chicken breast with tomato and Almonds on top; Nagaimo (Japanese mountain yam) paste with Shrimp that was steamed and then deep-fried with thin somen noodles, topped with Okura mixed with Tonburi, a "field caviar," and a Wolfberry; Cucumbers & Square-shaped baked wheat gluten flavored in vinegared and Yuzu-flavored Miso Soybean Paste

For breakfast, Suisen definitely did not mail it in - it was as delightful of an experience as the dinner, which is saying something. Sanma (Pacific Saury) is a very common fish in Japan, but they grilled and flavored it to perfection. And the various condiments to accompany the (thankfully) steamed white rice were all awesome. The corn dressing for the salad was homemade, and they even sell the dressing in their boutique - it was fabulous; we bought two bottles to take home with us.


Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen breakfast

Overall, we enjoyed our stay at Suisen. It's not a destination Onsen ryokan like some of the ones in my top ten, but given its proximity to Kyoto, legit Onsen, and succulent cuisine, this is a great option for people that want to try out a ryokan but don't have the time or energy to go farther afield for such an experience. It's a darned good value, too.

Since it's so accessible from/to Kyoto, I wouldn't advise non-veteran Japan travelers to spend too much time touring Kameoka. However - one of the fun things to do is taking the Hozu River boat from Kameoka down to Arashiyama (home of the Bamboo Grove.) It's a 20 minute cab ride to the boat dock, and it's a scenic, leisurely, 2-hour ride down Hozu River (which, by the way changes its name to the Katsura River at Arashiyama.) Other potential activities in the area include some historic temple visits (very uncrowded compared to the famous ones in Kyoto), Strawberry picking during the Winter months, and a very pretty Cosmos flower garden that is photogenic in the Fall.


Kyo Yunohana Resort Suisen's garden lit-up at night