LHW leaders club updates and comments
#106
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Korea, USA
Programs: IC Dia RA / Marriott LT Plat / WOH Globalist / Hilton Diamond / OZ Diamond Plus
Posts: 340
This I didn't know. Thanks for the info.
We don't get Amex Plat or Centurion just for FHR but okay. But for Virtuoso or Signature Travel, many hotels offer ADV rate or Stay X Pay X promotional rate. Also many of LHW hotels offer only BAR rate too.
I understand your point and I'm not trying to argue with you because I also enjoyed cheaper rate sometimes with LHW. But now they eliminated $100 benefit so it doesn't sound like cheap to me..
Whatever the fact, we're on the same boat
In theory bookings with Virtuoso and credit card programms aren't free either: you do pay an annual fee for your credit card, Virtuoso comes typically at a slightly higher room rate and in some cases with an extra reservation fee.
I am not trying to defend these changes, au contraire, but we should have our facts straight.
I am not trying to defend these changes, au contraire, but we should have our facts straight.
I understand your point and I'm not trying to argue with you because I also enjoyed cheaper rate sometimes with LHW. But now they eliminated $100 benefit so it doesn't sound like cheap to me..
Whatever the fact, we're on the same boat
#107
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney
Programs: AA Exp, UA PP, IC Diamond, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Centurion
Posts: 477
The points guy thinks the changes are great. He is particularly excited about the one pre-upgrade per year that could be worth thousands of dollars. Haha, I wonder what they paid him.
Here is the LHW perspective:
"To create the new Leaders Club, LHW incorporated feedback from focus groups, individual interviews and quantitative analytical research, Knapp said. Members expressed a desire for recognition during stays and personalization of their experiences, but also for benefits that would be more exclusive and differentiated from elite or credit card benefits offered by the major hotel chains. Leaders Club also looked for a way to enhance the rewards available to its most loyal customers, i.e. their highest spenders."
I don't see how the new program meets these desires in any way?
Here is the LHW perspective:
"To create the new Leaders Club, LHW incorporated feedback from focus groups, individual interviews and quantitative analytical research, Knapp said. Members expressed a desire for recognition during stays and personalization of their experiences, but also for benefits that would be more exclusive and differentiated from elite or credit card benefits offered by the major hotel chains. Leaders Club also looked for a way to enhance the rewards available to its most loyal customers, i.e. their highest spenders."
I don't see how the new program meets these desires in any way?
#108
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
2012 article (no idea re currently) >
re upgrades, ive never understood limiting at checkin, rather than encouraging higher spend
According to Caterer and Hotelkeeper, currently, 55% of LHW's income comes from membership fees, adjusted according to the number of hotel bedrooms, with the remaining 45% accounted for by the 10% fee charged on all transactions
president and chief executive of LHW, has decided that, in order to become more competitive and create greater co-operation between members, the transaction fee should be abolished and replaced by each hotel signing up three regular guests per room to the Leaders loyalty programme.
currently been trialled at 50 hotels worldwide, with a view to introducing it across the entire portfolio of hotels in 2013.
revenue for the company grew from $546m (350m) in 2010 to $613m (392m) in 2011.
president and chief executive of LHW, has decided that, in order to become more competitive and create greater co-operation between members, the transaction fee should be abolished and replaced by each hotel signing up three regular guests per room to the Leaders loyalty programme.
currently been trialled at 50 hotels worldwide, with a view to introducing it across the entire portfolio of hotels in 2013.
revenue for the company grew from $546m (350m) in 2010 to $613m (392m) in 2011.
Last edited by Kagehitokiri; Sep 30, 2018 at 8:39 am
#109
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: En Route
Programs: Many
Posts: 6,798
it sounds like this has been bad for unlimited members, but will there be any blowback for regular leaders club members? I usually get an upgrade. I have upcoming LHW stays in Helsinki, Dublin, London and Madrid. Want to know what to expect.
#110
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney
Programs: AA Exp, UA PP, IC Diamond, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Centurion
Posts: 477
FYI: LC will send out an e-mail this weekend to Unlimited members. I don't know what will be anounced exactly but it was my understanding that LC would offer something. I strongly suggested to at least consider proactively offering a free cancellation of previously bought memberships and a refund (full or partial depending on each individual case of course). Pacta sunt servanda and LHW should obviously respect this. We are not talking about a free loyalty programm where you can just mess around during the course of a membership year.
#111
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Korea, USA
Programs: IC Dia RA / Marriott LT Plat / WOH Globalist / Hilton Diamond / OZ Diamond Plus
Posts: 340
#113
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney
Programs: AA Exp, UA PP, IC Diamond, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Centurion
Posts: 477
I just got an email "You’re Invited to the New Exclusive Leaders Club Aurelian", summarising my crappy new benefits. But no word about LC offering sth or proactively offering free cancellation.
#114
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney
Programs: AA Exp, UA PP, IC Diamond, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Centurion
Posts: 477
I had a look at consumer rights and unfair contracts here in Australia. I'm sure there will be something similar in the US.
Here is a good summary: https://www.choice.com.au/shopping/consumer-rights-and-advice/your-rights/buying-guides/unfair-contracts
Some relevant quotes:
This type of term must be balanced by allowing the consumer to get out of the contract or to give consent before the changes come into effect.
Here are the former LHW terms and conditions:
https://web.archive.org/web/20170706082509/https://www.lhw.com/terms-and-conditions
I would say that all the clauses that allow LHW to make unilateral changes are unfair and therefore void unless we give consent or they allow us to get out of the contract and to get a refund.
At least that's how it is in Australia. Can someone please have a look at how it is in the US (specifically in New York State)?
Here is a good summary: https://www.choice.com.au/shopping/consumer-rights-and-advice/your-rights/buying-guides/unfair-contracts
Some relevant quotes:
When is a contract term unfair?
A term of a standard form consumer contract will be unfair if:- it will cause a significant imbalance in the parties' rights, and
- it is not reasonably necessary to protect the business's rights, and
- it will cause detriment (financial or otherwise) to the consumer.
Examples of unfair terms
A term that allows one party to change the terms of the contract
A term that allows a business to change the terms without the consumer's consent is likely to be unfair. For example, a term that makes the consumer pay more or get less than originally agreed will probably be unfair.This type of term must be balanced by allowing the consumer to get out of the contract or to give consent before the changes come into effect.
Here are the former LHW terms and conditions:
https://web.archive.org/web/20170706082509/https://www.lhw.com/terms-and-conditions
I would say that all the clauses that allow LHW to make unilateral changes are unfair and therefore void unless we give consent or they allow us to get out of the contract and to get a refund.
At least that's how it is in Australia. Can someone please have a look at how it is in the US (specifically in New York State)?
#115
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: IAD/DCA
Posts: 31,797
uh, US paying with credit card can easily dispute, and if amex should be very easy. issue is more for EU especially outside UK (UK has strongest protections in world?) using debit/wire/etc, based on posts from EU members here
edit - ah, referring to LHW headquarters in NYC ?
lhw.com/Corporate/Fact-Sheet
The Leading Hotels of the World is a wholly owned by Hotel Representative AG and LHW Services GmbH
wikipedia for LHW says first is swiss
edit - NY/US law should be customer friendly on this, perhaps some lawyers here will comment
edit - best said by Epicura below
edit - ah, referring to LHW headquarters in NYC ?
lhw.com/Corporate/Fact-Sheet
The Leading Hotels of the World is a wholly owned by Hotel Representative AG and LHW Services GmbH
wikipedia for LHW says first is swiss
edit - NY/US law should be customer friendly on this, perhaps some lawyers here will comment
edit - best said by Epicura below
Last edited by Kagehitokiri; Oct 8, 2018 at 7:10 am
#117
Same in European Union. Not sure if this clause is void but even if it is not many will search court proceedings. Nevertheless if in Europe the courts of the country the consumer lives would be responsible.
#118
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2004
Programs: BA Gold, SPG Gold, IC Plat RA, Fairmont Plat...
Posts: 506
I made a new booking and requested a pre arrival upgrade but they are not that useful. Several days later it still says pending and if you check the faq's they can leave letting you know about the upgrade as late as three days before check in.
When will I receive a confirmation of my pre-arrival upgrade request?
Our reservation agents will be working on securing your pre-arrival upgrade from the time you request it upon booking your stay until three days before your date of arrival. You will receive an email regarding the status of your pre-arrival upgrade at least three days prior to the date of your arrival, based on 12:00 am Coordinated Universal Time (UTC).
When will I receive a confirmation of my pre-arrival upgrade request?
Our reservation agents will be working on securing your pre-arrival upgrade from the time you request it upon booking your stay until three days before your date of arrival. You will receive an email regarding the status of your pre-arrival upgrade at least three days prior to the date of your arrival, based on 12:00 am Coordinated Universal Time (UTC).
#119
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney
Programs: AA Exp, UA PP, IC Diamond, HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Globalist, Amex Centurion
Posts: 477
If LHW left the $100 benefit as it was (which you can also get via a number of other booking sources anyway) and replaced the pre-upgrades with suite upgrades then I think no one would complain.
#120
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: BCT. Formerly known as attorney28
Programs: LH HON,BA GGL GfL,Hyatt LT Glob,Mrtt LT P,Hilt LT D,IC Amb,Acc P,GHA Tit,LHW Strlg,Sixt/Av/Hz D/Pres
Posts: 6,827
The only way Unlimited (or whatever they call it now) would even remotely be attractive would be if suite upgrades were not excluded and Unlimited would get an automatic 2-level upgrade. Otherwise, there is really absolutely no justification for the difference in price.