bau31888

Who said this?
Hopefully no doctor will even think about whether he is on a flight to/from U.S. or not, when a emergency is announced (Hippocratic Oath)... The equiqment onboard is not too bad.

Kranich

I thought being in a Lufthansa plane in the air is to be considered as the same as to be on German soil. Is that correct?

Otherwise the minimum drinking age would be 21 on flights to the U.S.

andre1970

Yes

supermasterphil

He was told so at Check IN on his flight CGN-FRA-JFK metal change to UA - LAX at the end of the 90s....

He has always the minimum equipment around and he will always help, it's just what they said to him when she saw his doctors bag.

Seems as this was propably just a single opinion of this lady or a change in LH policy... As we all can read, you get extra miles to be a doctor on board now...
I really appreciate that... It's better to have minimum help by a doctor than no help

Sydfly

I've only once been asked by the purser whether my title was for a medical or an academic doctor on a UA flight last year. Noone else ever cared at all. Unfortunately, I had to disappoint her that it was "only" a PhD, and after she knew that I wasn't of any use for her I received no more attention (note to self: Should have rather studied medicine than Biochemistry...especially now with the extra miles )

bau31888

Even if Germany is not US, we have some laws. And a doctor (or EMT) who intentionally does not help in emergencies can get into trouble (unterlassene Hilfeleistung, not Garantenstellung )

As I said, on LH interconti flights the medical equiqment is IME not bad: oxygen, blood pressure meter, heart defibrillator, dressing material, selction of emergency medicine etc.

Holgi98

I, too, hope that there will be some incentive for EMT-Paramedics or even some nurses.

It is a long hard way to become a Doctor, even more so to specialize.
And a Doctor will probably be very good in his/ her specialty, but not
necessarily in emergency medicine.

Even though emergency medicine is taught in medical school nowadays in
Germany, if Doctors don't practice it for many years they will have a hard
time to help in an emergency.

If you have ever seen a family Doctor, Gynacologist, Dermatologist, eye Doctor, Dentist and many other specialties trying to perform emergency medicine you might agree with me, that in many cases it is a sad experience,
especially for the patient.

During a possibly life threatening inflight emergency I would prefer to be
treated by a well trained and experienced paramedic or ER-/ ICU nurse rather than by one of the mentioned specialized Doctors, who might not have seen any advanced life support in many years.

Concerning Lufthansa giving extra miles to paramedics or nurses, too, you
should consider that the profession of a Doctor is different here, compared
to the US for example.
In the US there are so many jobs below a Doctor (like physician assistant,
nurse practitioner, respiratory therapist etc.), and for these other professions
the scope of practice is very broad.

A Doctor in the US in many cases mainly diagnoses and gives orders for
treatment, someone else will follow his orders and treat the patient.

In Germany however Doctors usually want to perform even the smallest
invasive techniques (like starting an iv) themself - and for the american,
british or australian reader: yes, Doctors in Germany even ride on Ambulances.

Lufthansa will probably stick with this common german opinion, that there
simply is noone else qualified to help besides a Doctor.
So it's strange but likely that they will be the only ones recieving extra miles.

But, bau31888, we can still try and write a letter to LH.

chejus

This is no longer the case.
Although any passanger can do whatever they want, the law of the "good samaritan" applies.
This was clearly explained in one of the most respected medical journals called "The New England Journal of Medicine", in its issue http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/short/346/14/1067
So that you do not have to read the full article I will quote the part where it speaks about liability:
[I]Medical Liability

In general, airlines are legally liable for gross neglect or willful misconduct during in-flight medical events, as stipulated by international treaties.51,52 The threat of lawsuits is one of the factors that has recently motivated airlines to improve their resources for handling in-flight medical events. To our knowledge, no litigation has been brought to date against a physician who has rendered assistance during an in-flight medical event. Does a physician who is a passenger have a duty to volunteer medical assistance? In the United States, Canada, and the United Kingdom, physicians do not have a legal duty to render assistance unless there is a preexisting physician–patient relationship. In contrast, many European countries and Australia do impose such a legal obligation.51,52,53 By international law, the country in which the aircraft is registered has legal jurisdiction.52,53,54 However, the country in which the incident occurs or the country of citizenship of the plaintiff or defendant can also have jurisdiction.51,52,53,54

An important step that reduced physicians' concern about liability was taken in 1998, when the Aviation Medical Assistance Act was signed into law.55,56 The act provides limited "good Samaritan" protection to any medically qualified passenger who provides medical assistance aboard an aircraft.55 In addition to being medically qualified, the assisting passenger must be a volunteer, render care in good faith, and receive no monetary compensation. Gifts in the form of travel vouchers, wine, or seat upgrades are not considered compensation. The assisting passenger must also render medical care similar to the care that others with similar training would provide under such circumstances. Physicians should be aware of the provisions of the Aviation Medical Assistance Act and recognize its limitations.[B]

Tyrolean

<IRONY>
Or a computer technician that can reboot MediaWorld!
Or a Business-Consultant to improve the LH Stragegy?
Or a cleaning-lady that can do an emergency cleaning of the toilet?
</IRONY>

Sorry I can really understand LH. And I cannot understand the "Neidkultur".
Medical Doctors have the longest study in Germany.
They have to work four to six years for a lousy money and lot of unpayed overwork to get their "Facharzt". Yes some nurses know some emergency procedure and have some special knowledge in some very special cases, and some beive all doctors are stupid.

BTW: A dentist in Germany is not a doctor of medicine. It is a complete different study.

Until I see it officially on the LH page i wont beleive it.
I love the new rules, because it is a great incentive for my wife to do some weekendtrips with me! Lovely!

Oldthinker

Do you mean that German medical doctors deserve extra miles when flying LH because of that? Do you expect airlines to fight social injustice? The idea sounds really scary to me...

andre1970

^

Passenger_by_Passion

I honestly hope, you will never need medical help on a longhaul flight!
Maybe then there will be a physician on board, who can an will provide this (maybe lifesaving) help to you, come back to you from his seat in F or C (that he bought to catch some sleep) to spend his time and his professional skill with your problem, without billing you?!

And you really envy this guy for lousy 35.000 extra miles???

And you really compare this with other professions or even Hartz IV transfer receivers??!!

What is wrong with you guys. Do you think a medical doctor on board is your private slave, who has to do all this, just because he or she has this profession?

The only "social injustice" issue that I can see here, is that people like you and others in this thread obviously have a "take for free as can" mentality concerning medical assistance.

As far as Lufthansa is concerned, the "gift" of 5.000 miles helps them to identify physicians in case of an emergency very fast. It saves them a hell lot of money (up to 20.000 $), if they must not have an extra unplanned (medical emergency) touch down, due to the work of this passenger-doctor.
Compared to what they save here, 35.000 miles is real peanuts.

And sorry, there is no other profession, who can provide this (sometimes lifesaving) skill and therefore has earned any mileage or compensation!!!!

peter42

FRADOC and other reported, that until now the compensation for a doctor giving treatment inflight was a free C RT wherevere LH flies, so this seems to be a more official but downgraded compensation.

peter42

As all physicans obey the Hippocratic Oath, I highly doubt a physican will get away either legally or by his physican association, if he does not help in case of an emergency. Same is true for members of the Red Cross e.g., who take a make a similiar oath.

bau31888

C RT is not the standard compensation, however, sometimes it is given out by customer service.



It is not only a question of speed. During a night flight, the crew cannot identify a doctor onboard at all, if he/she is sleeping and consequently does not react to the announcement. Happened on my last medical emergency, where I was the only one helping for the first time. Later a doctor came to the galley to get something to drink and then helped me.

I'm sure that - when you register for the miles - you allow LH to wake you up whenever there is an emergency.