[Agreement terminated March 2024] B6, NK agree to $3.8 billion merger
#31
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Do you think NK/B6 to move to another terminal? Gate change? Combined the ticket counter?
FLL
NK will relocate to T3. But they will keep concourse G gates.
PHX
B6/NK will stay at T3 and still in concourse F.
LAS
B6 will relocate to T1 from T3. It will combine.
LAX
B6/NK will stay at entire T5. No change.
ATL
B6 will relocate from concourse E gate to concourse D gate.
LGA
NK will relocate to new terminal B. NK Ticket counter will be moved.
Let the speculation begin!
FLL
NK will relocate to T3. But they will keep concourse G gates.
PHX
B6/NK will stay at T3 and still in concourse F.
LAS
B6 will relocate to T1 from T3. It will combine.
LAX
B6/NK will stay at entire T5. No change.
ATL
B6 will relocate from concourse E gate to concourse D gate.
LGA
NK will relocate to new terminal B. NK Ticket counter will be moved.
Let the speculation begin!
#32
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,485
Spoke to someone who knows industry pretty well. He thinks both nea and merger will go through. Maybe nea will be slightly reduced. We will see
Secondly, JetBlue cannot possibly achieve nk level of unit cost. It's just not possible. As such, they will not densify seats and degrade service to nk level. They have to compete for higher revenue passengers to cover their higher costs. Now, I do think it is possible they find that the big seat model works well on nk and add something similar to non mint flights. We will see
I see e90s go away pretty quickly with a merger and a319 take over those Boston business markets.
Secondly, JetBlue cannot possibly achieve nk level of unit cost. It's just not possible. As such, they will not densify seats and degrade service to nk level. They have to compete for higher revenue passengers to cover their higher costs. Now, I do think it is possible they find that the big seat model works well on nk and add something similar to non mint flights. We will see
I see e90s go away pretty quickly with a merger and a319 take over those Boston business markets.
#33
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: NYC
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I keep forgetting they have A319s. It would be nice to have A319s on shuttles again. Throwback to US Airways
-J.
-J.
#35
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
Spoke to someone who knows industry pretty well. He thinks both nea and merger will go through. Maybe nea will be slightly reduced. We will see
Secondly, JetBlue cannot possibly achieve nk level of unit cost. It's just not possible. As such, they will not densify seats and degrade service to nk level. They have to compete for higher revenue passengers to cover their higher costs. Now, I do think it is possible they find that the big seat model works well on nk and add something similar to non mint flights. We will see
I see e90s go away pretty quickly with a merger and a319 take over those Boston business markets.
Secondly, JetBlue cannot possibly achieve nk level of unit cost. It's just not possible. As such, they will not densify seats and degrade service to nk level. They have to compete for higher revenue passengers to cover their higher costs. Now, I do think it is possible they find that the big seat model works well on nk and add something similar to non mint flights. We will see
I see e90s go away pretty quickly with a merger and a319 take over those Boston business markets.
They also stated they are going after higher revenue not the lowest possible costs which is why they are using the B6 inflight product instead of the NK one. They have been successful at places like SFO/LAX because of Mint--not because they are offering more $39 fares from those airports.
The E90s were going away anyway and this gives them the opportunity to dump them more quickly which B6 has also stated. Depending upon what the economy looks like when the integration happens they have flexibility to ground some of the older owned aircraft at NK as well if needed.
A lot of the press coverage that this merger would be a huge hill to climb as far as regulatory approval goes was just talking points from F9. We saw how quickly the CEO of NK changed his tune on CNBC after F9 cancelled the merger agreement. LOL. If true competition were really what is wanted, then WN should give up gates at DAL; DL should contract at ATL/LGA, AA should give up slots at DCA and gates at DFW/CLT; UA should be forced to pull back at EWR/SFO/ORD to open up competition. That is highly unlikely to happen so there is really no basis to deny a merger to a combined carrier that won't be dominant at any airport.
#36
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A lot of the press coverage that this merger would be a huge hill to climb as far as regulatory approval goes was just talking points from F9. We saw how quickly the CEO of NK changed his tune on CNBC after F9 cancelled the merger agreement. LOL. If true competition were really what is wanted, then...
-J.
#37
Join Date: Apr 2003
Programs: B6 Mosaic, Bonvoy LT Titanium (x SPG LT), IHG Spire, UA Silver
Posts: 5,848
A lot of the antitrust argument revolves around Florida, particularly MCO and FLL (maybe FLL/MIA). In FLL I think they would become the vastly dominant carrier, but probably still not as big as AA in MIA. In MCO they would be a lot bigger than they are now. That's what a lot of people are grumbling about -- nobody (other than JetBlue and Spirit) wants to see a new fortress hub in this day and age, especially not in huge O&D destinations like Orlando and SoFla.
-J.
-J.
#38
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: NYC/PHX
Programs: IATA, Sabre, AvgeekAgent
Posts: 1,958
This is basically what B6 has been saying since this whole thing started. NK adds nothing to JFK and has a very small presence at LGA which itself is an airport dominated by the US3. A larger presence at EWR just provides more competition for the dominant carrier, UA. NK does not add much to BOS either. If more competition is what is being sought, having a strong counter to DL/UA provides that competition.
May be a mix of:
- Ending slot sharing (which would force AA to compete or relinquish its NYC slots to another, presumably low-cost, competitior).
- Ending schedule coordination with AA
- Ending code-shares on all or some (i.e., Florida, California) routes
- Ceding some gates at LGA/FLL/LAX to ULCCs
In the end, I suspect B6 will be able to retain its frequent flyer partnership with AA, which gets B6 most of what it needs. It's possible AA might be able to strike a deal to permanently sell some of its slots to B6 and give up others to ULCC competitors if AA decides to throw in the towel in the NYC market. But, I expect AA will make the decision to fight at least one more major battle for NYC relevance with whatever assets they're left with coming out of the B6-NK tie-up.
-
Last edited by NYC Flyer; Aug 1, 2022 at 6:34 am Reason: clarif
#39
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,607
I grabbed the 80K mile Jet Blue card today figuring routes to/from MSP will be expanded in the near future.
#40
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,607
Do you think NK/B6 to move to another terminal? Gate change? Combined the ticket counter?
FLL
NK will relocate to T3. But they will keep concourse G gates.
PHX
B6/NK will stay at T3 and still in concourse F.
LAS
B6 will relocate to T1 from T3. It will combine.
LAX
B6/NK will stay at entire T5. No change.
ATL
B6 will relocate from concourse E gate to concourse D gate.
LGA
NK will relocate to new terminal B. NK Ticket counter will be moved.
Let the speculation begin!
FLL
NK will relocate to T3. But they will keep concourse G gates.
PHX
B6/NK will stay at T3 and still in concourse F.
LAS
B6 will relocate to T1 from T3. It will combine.
LAX
B6/NK will stay at entire T5. No change.
ATL
B6 will relocate from concourse E gate to concourse D gate.
LGA
NK will relocate to new terminal B. NK Ticket counter will be moved.
Let the speculation begin!
#41
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 41
Deleted...forgot to reply i post
Last edited by MilesPointsCollector; Oct 28, 2022 at 9:52 am Reason: didn't attach to quote
#42
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 41
As I shared in the speculative thread, JetBlue has a new landing page for merger information: https://lowfaresgreatservice.com/
-J.
-J.
#43
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Can you share a link to the speculative thread you mention above? I think there is value (for some) in continuing a thread on how to play the merry-go-round of status: Mosaic to Free Spirit then back to Mosaic in '24/25 through status matches/ credit card spend etc. I'm at the point where the only airline loyalty programs that interests me are the ones I can obtain by a reasonable amt of annual spend while minimizing butt in seat. (I define reasonable cr card spend as ~$50K/yr) Regarding the merger overall...I'm a JB loyalist, though Mosaic is much less valuable in '22 than 5 yrs ago. Based in S FL the short-term net effect will likely be positive for me personally.. Everyone on FT knows, however, that the long-term cumulative effect of these mergers is almost always a net negative for the masses when you take all factors into account (devalued loyalty programs, less consumer choice in airfare etc)
Ever since JetBlue's reliability plummeted Mosaic has never caught my attention. Benefits are great but what good is it if they can't get you to your destination on time? I haven't flown JB on cash since 2019 and I don't miss it; in fact, I will be sad to see Spirit get absorbed by them, should this all go through. As a frequent traveler, I want this all to fail... but as a JBLU shareholder, I *really* need this to work out.
-J.
#44
Join Date: Feb 2023
Posts: 43
Biden administration moving toward blocking JetBlue-Spirit merger
Via Politico, February 10, 2023 (I can't post links yet):
"The Justice Department is likely to sue to block a pending $3.8 billion merger between JetBlue and Spirit airlines, five people with knowledge of the matter told POLITICO."
"Even without Biden’s increased emphasis on promoting competition, the JetBlue-Spirit tie-up would probably draw scrutiny in any administration, according to antitrust experts."
"The companies are arguing in part that in a highly concentrated market that exists due to past DOJ antitrust decisions, the only way to move forward is to be bigger. That argument is not expected to persuade DOJ lawyers, despite acknowledging that past federal decisions contributed to the current merger plans."
Adding article cdate
"The Justice Department is likely to sue to block a pending $3.8 billion merger between JetBlue and Spirit airlines, five people with knowledge of the matter told POLITICO."
"Even without Biden’s increased emphasis on promoting competition, the JetBlue-Spirit tie-up would probably draw scrutiny in any administration, according to antitrust experts."
"The companies are arguing in part that in a highly concentrated market that exists due to past DOJ antitrust decisions, the only way to move forward is to be bigger. That argument is not expected to persuade DOJ lawyers, despite acknowledging that past federal decisions contributed to the current merger plans."
Adding article cdate
Last edited by hiker67; Feb 10, 2023 at 8:48 pm Reason: Added article date
#45
Join Date: Dec 2018
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not there yet: https://nyti.ms/3ImbxF4