OliverB

To each his/her own but I have to say that this itinerary seems absurd to me and anyone who knows me on Flyertalk will surely attest that there is no more compulsive over-planner than myself... imagine a Japanese tourist visiting California for 5 days and deciding to spend 3 of them in Portland. Why bother?? Kyoto is beautiful but anyone who recommends that you split up your 5 days in Japan between both cities is dishing out bad advice imo. If I were going just about anywhere in the world for only 5 days, especially somewhere as vast and unique as Tokyo and with a significant time zone change, I would focus on exploring and getting to know that single destination. Tokyo is ten different cities in one... it seems crazy to fly all the way to Japan just so that you can scratch a robot show and a 5am trip to Tsukiji off your Tokyo list without really experiencing one of the most colourful and extraordinary cities in the world, and assuming that you're flying directly from the States, it also doesn't sound like much fun; just getting to Japan alone is exhausting. Spend your 5 days in Tokyo and save Kyoto for a future trip when you've already familiarized yourself with Tokyo and you can focus on exploring other prefectures. 3 days in Kyoto is fine albeit a bit rushed depending on how ambitious you are, but 2 days in Tokyo is neither sufficient nor fulfilling and it begs the question: why? There are so many other places to visit that can be adequately experienced within your time frame but Tokyo is not one of them.

pdxkankuu

Because Portland is awesome. =D

But it's not really possible to get to know any city of any real size in only 5 days. So while one person can say "why bother going for only 2 days?", another person can just as easily say "why bother going for only 5 days?"

Yeah, but it's all still just Kanto. *grin*

What future trip? Will the OP definitely be making a future trip? For many (most?) people, a trip to Japan is a once-in-a-lifetime thing. I don't know if that's the case for the OP. *shrug*

I see plenty of itineraries that I think are absurd. Some as little as a week, some as much as three weeks. But this is from someone whose idea of an itinerary is "fly to japan... return three weeks later". Putting myself in someone else's shoes, I can understand why people would want to make the kinds of itineraries they do.

Hey OP, will you be visiting Japan again in the future?

ksandness

On another travel board, I saw someone post a message that was something like, "I am taking a two-week trip to Asia, stopping in Tokyo, Seoul, Beijing, Hong Kong, Bangkok, and Delhi. Is there anything I'm missing?"

I felt like answering, "Yes, common sense."

Further discussion revealed that the OP on that thread did not understand the distances involved or the size of the various countries.

Years ago, I was staying in a gaijin house in Tokyo. Among my fellow residents were an American couple who were both models and in Japan to make their fortune. (I saw each of them on posters around town.) Anyway, they got cast in bit parts in an American movie that was being filmed in Tokyo and became friendly with some of the crew. As the weekend approached, one of the crew members came up to them and said, "Some of us are thinking of renting a car and driving down to Hong Kong on Saturday. Would you like to come along?"

Aventine

Sure would. Jetsons Hover car, right?

OliverB

All valid points but even spending 5 days in Tokyo would give anyone a better sense of the city versus 1.5 days - of which the .5 will surely be further compromised by the OP's 5am jetlagged Tsukiji plans (good luck accomplishing anything on that first night!). Moreover, it just doesn't sound like a pleasant trip. Why would anyone want to travel 14+ hours across ocean and continents only to spend less than 2 days at their point of arrival; especially with a child?

Adding a side trip to Kyoto just sounds exhausting and unnecessary. That's almost as many hours of travel between flights, busses, shinkansen, etc. as it is time spent in the largest super-mega-troprolis in the world; think about that for a moment. The parallel to California wasn't far off... I think Tokyo's population is something like 35mil; the equivalent of a concentrated San Diego-Los Angeles-San Francisco-and all points in between and beyond, in terms of diverse sights and attractions... in a single city alone! If you factor in the round-trip itinerary, it's almost twice as much spent time in transit versus the actual destination.

I'd sooner suggest dropping Tokyo altogether and transferring to Kansai domestically from NRT to spend the full 5 days in Kyoto if it's higher prioritized. That way they could plan an added day-trip or overnight to Nara, if so desired, and at least feel as though they've gotten to know and better understand & appreciate the region that they're visiting. I'm just trying to be helpful and offer my two cents based on experience.

4 days in Kyoto + 1 day in Nara sounds so much more practical and enjoyable than the current plans. Even 3.5/4 days in Tokyo + 1/1.5 in Hakone would seem like an equally ambitious yet far more reasonable alternative - though if Tokyo was to be the destination, I still wouldn't recommend planning for anything else on such a short trip if the OP has any genuine interest in the city itself. I just can't imagine going to Tokyo for 2 days with any reasonable expectations whatsoever unless I were on a long layover or detouring from another Asian country and was already familiar with the city.

Then again, as someone who values quality over quantity when it comes to travel experience, I wouldn't even fly transcontinental between American coasts for a 48-hour stay. We were in Tokyo for 10 days last autumn and just barely scratched the surface... Heck, we didn't even make it to the Imperial Palace which was directly across the street from our front door. It seems to me like they're selling themselves short on a potentially wonderful trip as the time spent in Tokyo is really not going to benefit their itinerary nor offer them any sort of tangible experience beyond a check mark on the bucket list.

Aventine

We've been (to Tokyo) 9 times and never seen or done all that we want to do!

OliverB

Tokyo is really unlike any city in the world. Each neighborhood exists as a separate city within a city; entirely distinct from any other place. Areas like Ginza and Shinjuku feel more like a city-themed amusement park. It's also a city that's constantly pulsating with life, twenty-four hours a day. Nightlife spills into mornings and you can always stumble onto something exciting. Through all of our travels, from the snow capped alpine mountains of Nagano to the sleepy seaport of Nagasaki and the boundless autumn painted hillsides and maple glazed valleys between, Tokyo always exuded the greatest sense of excitement and adventure. You never knew what you were going to find down the many narrow alleyways and cramped passages that are the veins of the city, opening into hidden arteries, each like a neighborhood unto itself that seemed to stretch out in every direction; from claustrophobic basement bars and jazz kissas to closet sized nightclubs and cocktail lounges perched atop highrises towering over the heart of the city and its teeming masses below. There are thousands of businesses stacked vertically into every foot of real estate on each city block. Elevators open directly onto sidewalks. Crawl spaces between buildings lead to hidden quarters and shadowy environs that seem to wind into mazelike channels reaching in every direction. There is life in every corner of the city! It wasn't unusual to walk into a restaurant one night and find ourselves sitting at a bar in front of a pair of giant horned owls! Osaka is like this too in many ways, though not on the same scale. It's Tokyo's evil twin; more gritty and rough around the edges. We are already planning a return visit for 2017 and we're going to rent an apartment in Shibuya and spend a full 2-3 weeks living in Tokyo, which is really the only way to fully experience the city.

Aventine

Very well said. :-::-::-::-::-:

Enjoy OP, wherever your travels take you.

mkjr

actually, to fully experience the city, the only way is to actually live there and 2-3 weeks, i respectfully disagree, is not "living" in Tokyo.

OliverB

Well of course, but I feel that it's the bare minimum if anyone is interested in truly getting to know and understand the city and while I'm not oblivious to the fact that most people (Americans in particular) aren't likely afforded the luxury of so much time off, I was applying the idea of "living" rather than "vacationing" to our own experience in that we've visited before, stayed in hotels where many vacationers would chose to situate themselves, dined at a number of high profile restaurants (ie. Sawada, Yoshitake, Ryugin, Ishikawa, etc.) where great effort is often exerted by travelers in order to obtain reservations through hotel concierge, etc... next time we're opting to rent an apartment around Shibuya and approach Tokyo from an entirely different and hopefully somewhat more local perspective. If we can get the time off work, we may even try to spend a full month, though it's unlikely. The only other destination that we're planning for is a weekend getaway at a rural ryokan somewhere nearby and hopefully new to us. We've been considering Asaba in Shinzenji on the Izu peninsula.

pdxkankuu

This is really what it's about. While it's obviously true that one can't legitimately "experience" a city without actually living there, it's definitely more about one's perspective rather than the length of time; i.e., visiting with less of a "tourist/traveler" mindset. But for that, the ability to read/speak japanese is kinda important. =D

mkjr

without the language, you will still be and be treated like a tourist even if you stay for a month. you can pretend like you are living like a local but you won't be.

SQFAN

Personally, I would recommend spending the whole 6 days in Tokyo as an introduction to Japan. I share the other posters recommendations about not cramming too much. As to the places to visit, mine are rather domesticated stuff

We have been back to Tokyo quite a few times (& Kyoto once) each about a week, discovering more little gems here and there. However, I could understand doing the big ticket items (Tokyo & Kyoto) for the first visit.

OliverB

I don't doubt that but the personal experience would surely differ greatly.

There's also no real way to define "living like a local" in a city like Tokyo where 35 million people are living disparate lives in diverse neighborhoods that are like separate cities unto themselves.

My point was that we would surely appreciate a greater sense of what it would be like actually living in Tokyo versus traveling as tourists, if we were to rent an apartment in Shibuya over a hotel room in Marunouchi or Chiyoda, do laundry, shop at the markets and depachikas and maybe even take some cooking classes rather than eating out for every meal, etc. It helps that we also have a gaijin friend who lives in the city...

pdxkankuu

There's nothing special about Tokyo. It's just a city. Like any other. With people who are living their lives. Like any other. Living like a local means just that -- living like a local. Not living like a tourist, and not doing tourist things.