New to the Points World - Best Program for flights from Australia to Europe
 

Hi All,

Ahead of time thanks for all the information so far, it has been a steep learning curve so far. As a bit of background I travel what I consider relatively often (between 15-20 flights this year, mainly around Europe however 3 have been between Australia and London) and I never bothered signing up to any frequent flyer programs. I decided seeing as I traveled enough I should sign up to a program, however I was lost where to begin.

As I have no current frequent flyer program, I have no allegiance to any program or airline, I am simply looking to join the airline program that best services my own needs.

1. What is most important to you in a frequent flyer program (FFP)?

Best award redemption rates for flights between Australia and Europe. I have read that JAL points redemption on Emirates flights is potentially the best use of points, however am not sure if this is true. I want to use my points to outright purchase flights (business or better) between Australia and Europe, as I have no preferred airline I simply want to understand the cheapest award flights between Australia (Sydney) and Europe (preferably London, however European connecting flights are not an issue)

2. How many miles do you usually fly each year? How many flights/sectors?

This year I flew approximately 20 flights, the majority between London and Europe, with three return flights to Sydney Australia. As I have relocated to Australia, this will change to mainly domestic flights within Australia with one or two return flights out to Europe each year.

3. What fare class do you usually buy?

I usually buy business on short haul flights, however purchase economy on the long haul Australia - Europe flights.

4. Are you able to choose your airlines and/or class of service? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?

The majority of european travel was for work, I was able to select a preferred airline (and class) however had no preference. The flights between Australia and Europe were to visit family/pleasure which I was about to selected and due to outright cost I would always purchase economy or premium economy, however once again had no preference.

5. Which routes do you fly most often?

I have now relocated back to Sydney, Australia and the majority of my travel will now be domestically within Australia, however with one or two flights out to Europe each year.

6. What is your home airport?

Kingsford, Sydney, Australia

7. Do you have status in any FFP? What is it? How miles do you have banked in each FFP, if any?

I have no FFP, however I have accumulated approximately 100,00 AMEX points which can be transferred to the following programs: Asia Miles, BA Miles, Delta Sky Miles, Emirates Skywards, Etihad Quest, Fin Air, Flying Blue, Iberia Plus, SAS Euro Bonus, Singapore Air Krisflyer, Virgin Atlantic Flying Club.

On top of the airline partners it can be transferred to SPG points, which can then be transferred to any of their airlines partners. The majority of my points will come from spending, rather than flying. I am also aware I am able to purchase SPG points which can in turn also be converted to certain airline miles.

8. What are your preferred airlines, if any?

I generally have no preference, however as the entire purpose of signing up to a FFP is to obtain award flights between Australia and Europe, my preferred airline between these destinations would be: Emirates, Etihad, Cathy Pacific, Singapore Airlines or Qatar.

OVERALL GOAL / REASON FOR FFP

As I mentioned earlier my entire reasoning for joining into the FFP and using award seats is to be able to travel business class or better between Australia and Europe.

Thanks for all the help!

drdraper Welcome to FT (Aussie branch)
www.australianfrequentflyer.com.au may also interest you for a more Au focus. And a high portion of medicos (if that’s your profession)

Flying and not getting ff miles is a horrendous crime here on FT :D ;)

You will have a steep learning curve to understand ffp’s. They can be very different and all have good and not so good points/features.

For domestic flights in Australia that limits you to
- QF Qantas Oneworld FF partners include QR Qatar, CX Cathay, BA British, JL Japan (all OW) and EK Emirates and others
- VA Virgin Australia. not in a alliance, but FF partners include EY Etihad (who part own VA), SQ Singapore, NZ Air New Zealand and others
- Will forget about JQ Jetstar (owned by QF) & Tigerair (part owned by VA)

FF partners are usually reciprocal to earn & burn. So you could fly QF and collect miles/points with one of their partners or fly VA and collect points/miles with one of their partners if you decide to go that way, if an eligible fare.. Same with using miles/points for awards (burning)

The airline you fly and the airline frequent flyer program you credit those flights to does not need to be the same. That is what ff partners and alliances are about. You can earn ff miles in your ffp flying on other partner airlines. However generally you are better with the airline ffp you fly most with (by $$ spent or distance or number of flights)

www.wheretocredit.com/qf
www.wheretocredit.com/va

Many people earn ff miles/points from credit card spend & cc sign up. However these are generally limited to home country airlines: that is QF or VA

Getting ff status boost earning and has other benefits, like lounge access for mid-high tier status.

There are several QF vs xx linked in post 3. And a few for VA.
With most ffp’s you need to be a signed up member at the date of the flight. However the QF ffp allows retro credit for flights taken in the past 30 days

Awards are not guaranteed. Long haul premium cabin awards are hard to get with any ffp. You need to be flexible with date & route

QF has high ff points requirement and high cash surcharges for awards. That’s why some in Au credit QF flights to other ffp’s like AA American Airlines or BA British Airways.

Frequent flyer miles are not equal to earn or burn between ffp’s. 10,000 frequent flyer miles in 1 ffp may get you a longer award flight than 15,000 frequent flyer miles in another ffp. Each airline ffp has different rules for using (burning) those miles/points for awards and different copay/surcharge $$ fees. There are award cash surcharges with some ffp’s/routes/airlines. With awards taxes are the same for all airlines for the same route and class. Award surcharge can/are different.

Awards assistance tools
Use at your own risk. These may not be up to date. (These are not recommendations)
Frequent flyer miles/points are not equal to or burn. They are not 1 to 1
If a multi segment award check the rules/cost carefully. With some ffp’s it can be 2 or more awards or cost more ff miles than a direct flight.
Some awards/airlines/routes can have cash surcharges, in addition to real taxes.
-AwardAce: Compare Award Redemptions Across Airlines In Seconds --> http://www.awardace.com/
-Economical Excursionist's Tools to compare Frequent Flyer Mile Redemptions --> http://www.flyermiler.com/
-http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...ast-miles.html --> http://www.awardhacker.com/

KLM or Brussels Airlines?
 

Hey all!

I will be moving to Edinburgh for work in January, and I’m trying to figure out which FFP to join. Due to the move, my travel pattern will change and the answer to Question 2 below is a very rough estimate. I will frequently fly between EDI and HAM (home) respectively BER (for work), both of which require connections. Also likely are other trips within Europe for leasure, as well as one transatlantic trip per year for work, and possibly a long haul vacation. Here are my answers to the questions above:

1. What is most important to you in a frequent flyer program (FFP)?
Lounge access, priority services, baggage allowance, slow expiry of miles, in that order, where the miles expiry is only marginally important.

2. How many miles do you usually fly each year? How many flights/sectors?
Around 20k-30k miles, roughly 50-60 (maybe more) segments.

3. What fare class do you usually buy?
Economy, pretty much exclusively.

4. Are you able to choose your airlines and/or class of service? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?
Travel mostly for pleasure, plus a few trips inside Europe and one transatlantic per year for work. Work is economy flights by company policy, pleasure travel is economy by choice (unless I do a long haul vacation where I might think about premium economy).

5. Which routes do you fly most often?
Inner-European

6. What is your home airport?
EDI – a horrendeous airport connection-wise, forcing me to route through LON, BRU, AMS, FRA or similar bases of large airlines basically every time I fly. GLA is close by, but not much better.

7. Do you have status in any FFP? What is it? How many miles do you have banked in each FFP, if any?
I used to be BA Silver, now Bronze, will drop to nothing in February. Ca. 100000 miles banked. Also 25000 or so miles in a Delta SkyMiles Account plus a few forgettable amounts elsewhere, like Lufthansa M&M.

8. What are your preferred airlines, if any?
BA. I dislike LH.


I think my sensible choices are either KLM via AMS, Brussels Airlines via BRU or BA via LON, but flight schedules (for Friday evening) somewhat surprisingly don’t make BA a great option, unfortunately. Would have liked to stick with them for my travels (respectively pick them up again), but it doesn’t seem plausible.

The question thus is, should I choose KLM as my main airline and join FB, or pick Brussels Airlines and collect on my M&M account. Flight time and schedule-wise, these options don’t differ massively. In both cases, 30 segments suffice for the status level that gives me lounge access, which is mainly what I care about, and should be no problem with 4 segments per weekend trip anywhere. There are, however, a few other differences as far as I can tell from the reading I have done, listed from the perspective of Brussels Airlines:

Pro Brussels:
- Flights tend to be cheaper than with KLM when booked short notice – KLM seems to get more expensive about 3 weeks out.
- Access to (presumably) better LH lounge at German airports as compared to contractor lounges KLM would presumably use (quite a lot of my flights will be EDI-Germany)

Contra Brussels:
- Lounge access for Frequent Traveller only valid for flights with Lufthansa group, not all of *A. KLM gives access to all SkyTeam lounges.
- Thus no lounge access at EDI (but will spend very little time there anyway given that I will usually fly Fridays after work), which I would get with KLM. Presumably also no security fast track, but I am not sure on this one. Also no access when flying to the US on United.
- Miles expire, much better expiry rules with KLM.

Other factors I cannot estimate include the quality of the airlines themselves (I flew KLM twice, Brussels never before) and how pleasent or unpleasent it is to connect at AMS via BRU (never been to BRU, only started or ended journeys at AMS).

Is there anything I missed? Any recommendations which one you’d pick? Or should I just decide which one to fly on a case-by-case basis? With easily above 30 segments, that would mean I would most likely eventually reach status with one of them within the year.

A very good summary.
Are you paying for the HAM trips? Will you book at short notice or a long time before. If you have BA avios an award flight may be an option sometimes. Or some of those DL ff miles for an award. Or are you saving avios/miles for a longer trip? (They do not increase in value)
Will you combine a EDI-BER then onto HAM? Guess will depend on your employers travel policy.
A train after a flight is an option. Point to point for short distance trains can be as quick as flying considering time to airport etc.
From EDI/GLA Easyjet & RyanAir also fly but with limited schedules.

Thank you for the quick reply Mwenenzi!

Yes, I'll be paying for the HAM trips. Notice period for the bookings will vary quite a bit. For exmple, I already have fixed plans for some weekends in June, July and September that I could theoretically book already, but also one in Febraury where I will only be able to decide about a week in advance whether I can fly. And probably there will be anything in between over the next months.

Using BA Avios is always an option if flights get too expensive - I have done that quite a few times in the past (if I hadn't I'd be at about 50% Avios than I currently have), and I'm aware that they are not much use for a long haul due to the fuel surcharges. I'll probably likely keep using them up in exactly the way you suggest. Unfortunately, the connections from EDI to LHR/LCY and then on to Hamburg don't seem ideal.

DL miles seems to be less of an options, the number of miles needed for even a one-way flight would mean I could do something like 3 segments with the miles I have. Not sure what I will use those miles for, but when I get to the States in the not so far future - which I will - I might be looking at somehow using them towards a trip to Hawaii or something like that. Since it has become possible to pay half the miles for a one way I haven't been to the US, and before that I had too few to do anything meaningful with them.

I'll most likely not combine trips to BER and HAM - and if I would, it wouldn't affect the flying pattern due to the wonderfully fast train connection between them, as you say. Unfortunately there is no airport close enough that is reguarly served from EDI by a big airline - so while I could fly to AMS, BRU or FRA and take a train, that train would take about 5h+ in each case.

I'm aware of Ryanair's and Easyjet's presence at those airports - it seems to be there prime reason of existence. :mad: Unfortunately most of the time the scheduled departure times are extremely inconvenient, e.g. there is no direct flight to HAM on a Friday and none from BER on a Sunday, and for the rest the times of day could be better.

Nevermind

Hey everyone! I need some advice.

I'm currently in a FFP (details below) with Star Alliance. My travel habits will change, so I am wondering if I should switch to a different FPP. I'm considering Miles & More (Lufthansa, Austrian Airlines mostly) or United MileagePlus - also on Star Alliance - to get better redemption rates and better upgrade availability on those airlines. I will fly more long-haul on routes that my current airline has only through the alliance partners - upgrades are important to me on those long routes.

I'm also wondering whether it's a good idea to change alliance partners to SkyTeam to spread out the awards and miles? That way I get status on another alliance, instead of starting from scratch on another airline of my current alliance.

1. What is most important to you in a frequent flyer program (FFP)?
upgrades, priority services, baggage allowance, good award redemption rates, better award access, lounge access, etc.
>>> Reply: Upgrades, priority services, award redemption rates, lounge access.

2. How many miles do you usually fly each year? How many flights/sectors?
less than 25000 miles, 50000+ miles and 20-25 flights, etc.
>>> Reply: 50000+ miles, 60-90 segments.

3. What fare class do you usually buy?
first, business, premium economy, economy
>>> Reply: Premium Economy, Economy

4. Are you able to choose your airlines and/or class of service? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?
>>> Reply: I can choose airline, cannot choose class of service. Travel for WORK mostly.

5. Which routes do you fly most often?
transatlantic, domestic USA, intra-Asia, etc.
>>> Reply: America (Between Latin and North America), Transatlantic

6. What is your home airport?
>>> Reply: SJO (San José, Costa Rica)

7. Do you have status in any FFP? What is it? How miles do you have banked in each FFP, if any?
>>> Reply: Copa ConnectMiles Presidential Platinum (Star Alliance Gold), 125,000 miles, 86 segments.

8. What are your preferred airlines, if any?
>>> Reply: Copa, Lufthansa, KLM

Hey all, hoping you can give me some suggestions; I had settled on Alaska, but with the Delta partnership over, the new year gives me an opportunity to reconsider.

The biggest hurdle for me is that Alaska flights to SDF are slim pickings, and that's my primary destination. I could fly AA and credit Alaska, but I don't even have a chance of upgrades in that case; and my experience with AA has been poor, or else I'd probably just choose them - especially since Alaska only goes to SDF via AA metal.

I like United, especially with their rates for the Caribbean, but earning status - and achieving upgrades - seems to be more of a problem than with Alaska.


1. What is most important to you in a frequent flyer program (FFP)?
upgrades, priority services, baggage allowance, good award redemption rates, better award access, lounge access, etc.
Upgrades, redemption rates, priority services, in that order

2. How many miles do you usually fly each year? How many flights/sectors?
less than 25000 miles, 50000+ miles and 20-25 flights, etc.
For business, I fly at least 12+ R/T flights, averaging 4 legs per RT flight; so say 48+ segments. For personal, I usually fly another 5-10 paid trips per year, including a couple trips to the Caribbean; and I'm happy to pull milage/segment runs if needed.

3. What fare class do you usually buy?
first, business, premium economy, economy
For business, economy; for personal, at least premium economy, but I try to pull inexpensive business class for Caribbean trips.

4. Are you able to choose your airlines and/or class of service? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?
I'm always able to book my own tickets on any airline of my choice

5. Which routes do you fly most often?
transatlantic, domestic USA, intra-Asia, etc.
PDX to SDF (10+), California, Caribbean

6. What is your home airport?
PDX

7. Do you have status in any FFP? What is it? How miles do you have banked in each FFP, if any?
I currently have MVP on Alaska and Companion pass on SW (via the points/miles transfer trick). I have ~100K Alaska, 100K SW, and will have ~250K UA soon (complicated - via a bonus program - doubt they are PQMs). Most of my accrual is via CC spend or the like.

8. What are your preferred airlines, if any?
>>> Reply: Alaska, Delta, United.

(1) What is most important to you in a FFP?
Lounge access, upgrades on travel, good upgrade options

(2) How many miles do you usually fly each year & in what class? How many flights/sectors?
In europe about 20k miles a year, around 30-45 segments.

(3) What types of fares do you usually buy ?
Economy (with luggage)

(4) Can you choose your airlines and/or class of service? Airline most flown? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?
Travel for work (AY) plus few holiday flights (any OW carrier) a year in Y+ or C, My flying for work is only FRA-HEL-FRA (AY).

(5) Which routes and airlines do you fly most often
FRA-HEL-FRA (AY)

(6) What is your home airport?
FRA

(7) Do you have FFP status of any kind in an airline? What is it? Do you have any miles banked in a FFP?
AY+ Silver (OW ruby). Some 60k points there.

(8) Preferred Airlines
Any OW

-------------------------------

Hi everyone,

The main question here is the choice between BAEC / AY+ I guess. I have for this year most likely 10x FRA-HEL-FRA flights with AY and the awesome QR BRU-DOH-NRT-DOH-BRU in J booked.

The QR flights would get me 560 TP for BAEC as well as ~20k avios OR ~30k points for Finnair.

Normally my work flights in economy books into N or O class which only gives 240 avios and 5TP per segment.

So I could just take some MR to get 40TP and BAEC Silver or keep crediting points for Finnair. With the QR flights and annual work flights I should make 30k (QR) + 40k (work) = 70k out of required 80k for AY+ gold.

The BAEC Silver (OWS) would be possible to get basicly immediately after my QR flight + some MR. And as I am not BAEC member yet, to get most out of the BAEC Silver I should join just before my QR flights in May, bank in 560 TP from those and then get the missing 40 TP and thus enjoy BAEC Silver benefits for almost full 2 years (running year + the following?).

Does BAEC Silver (OWS) get op-ups with other OW airlines often?

Thanks for helping me to decide!

More AA or jump ship
 

I'm in a fortunate position, as I have banked AA miles, and also will have 100K+ UR points due to CSR. Wee're new to this, as we've usually collected miles but never used them and never flew enough for elite status until a fluke last year. So my question is: do I double down on OneWorld (and specifically AA), or should I consider moving while I have UR points for immediate upgrades while grinding status?

1. Most important in order: upgrades on travel (specifically international to Eur/Asia), good redemption rates, then lounge access.

2. Miles/segments per year: usually ~20K, but could double+ that for good experiences & shooting for 75K. E.g. the QR LAX-DOH-SIN run in business got me interested in both better cabins and status, and I'd add 1 of those/yr for similar experiences. Segments is usually ~10-20.

3. Usual fare class: Economy, no luggage. We want points to upgrade, and I'd use a domestic bag probably 10%. Also, Premium Economy is intriguing as a possibility for us, and we could end up booking this regularly for international flights.

4. Airline choice/main airline/work or pleasure: most flights are for pleasure with my wife, and we can choose our airline (mostly flying Oneworld for now). I fly 3-6 times/yr for work, but almost always <500 and always in coach.

5. Most common routes: none really. Work is generally PHX - somewhere in the LA MSA, but that could be almost any of the small ones and rarely LAX.

6. Home airport: PHX.

7. FFP status & miles: AA Gold. Will definitely be Plat by end of year, and probably PP. 140K banked miles that I plan on using constantly for international upgrades starting this year.

8. Preferred airlines: The good international carriers all seem better than any domestic, but we have a small sample size.

1. Upgrades
With most ffp's generally you are far better to use miles for a straight out business class seat, if available. You know what you are getting.

Upgrades are never guaranteed.
For upgrades the general rule is you can only upgrade a flight marketed (flight number) and operated (metal) by the airline of your frequent flyer programme (no codeshares) with your airlines upgrade instrument (e.g. SWU, miles) or complementary with status (if applicable) or ff miles/cash co pay. All subject to the t&c's of your FFP and your paid ticket. Low cost tickets are often not eligible for upgrades. Cross airline upgrades are uncommon. If cross airline upgrades are offered they tend to require a very expensive base fare.

AA, BA & IB have a cross airline upgrade scheme, subject to hefty t&c's
Some Star Alliance airlines have a cross airline upgrade scheme, subject to hefty t&c's.
For most people/flights these are useless and poor value

8. You are not the only person from USA with that opinion. But the aircraft - seating used on long haul flights by USA airlines has improved a lot in the last 2~3 years (albeit from a very low base line)

Having multiple ffp’s with low balances is never a good idea. You may never get enough ff miles/points to be of use before they expire. FFP’s are for the medium to long term. However at times it makes sense to have a ff membership with an airline in another alliance. (e.g. Oneworld & Star)
Be mindful of expiry http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/miles...-t-expire.html

Its time to start using those accumulated ff miles. They will not increase in value

Mwenenzi: I'm reading that as "basically stick to AA". Most upgrades, we'll try to shoot for AA, after looking at the chart. We'll be trying to burn our miles continually on upgrades and business class purchases starting this year and next. Thanks for the advice!

Upgrades are hard to get. If you get AA status that will give you some upgrade instruments depending on what status you get. If going to a destination by a Oneworld airline, other than AA, look for a straight out award, but that can also be hard.

Still having ff miles in Star Alliance, Skyteam Alliance or non alliance airline ffp is OK, but do not spread your miles to thinly so they are of little value.

The grass in not always greener on the other side

(1) What is most important to you in a FFP?
(upgrades on travel, priority services when flying the airline, extra baggage allowance, good award redemption rates, better award access, free - discounted lounge access, etc.)
Reply: Nothing too important, just the ability to build up miles fast and then redeem them to either get an upgrade to Business or to get a free flight


(2) How many miles do you usually fly each year & in what class? How many flights/sectors?
(<25000, 25000-50000, >50000 miles - <25, 25-50, >50 flights?)
Reply:

Hmmm that really depends, there is no average, at least one flight from Orlando to Dublin, for myself, my wife and my infant child


(3) What types of fares do you usually buy ?
(First, Business, Premium economy, Economy, cheapest)
Reply:

Economy

(4) Can you choose your airlines and/or class of service? Airline most flown? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?
Reply:

Aer Lingus as they have the only direct flight, but I hate them and fully intend on changing airlines and flying via Atlana or NY or something.

(5) Which routes and airlines do you fly most often
(US Domestic, Transpacific, Kangaroo, in Asia etc)
Reply:

International: Orlando to Dublin

Domestic: None really, I would like to start travelling more, maybe to Boston & NYC to see family

(6) What is your home airport?
(SFO, SCL, London LHR, HKG, Singapore SIN etc.)
Reply:

Orlando Airport

(7) Do you have FFP status of any kind in an airline? What is it? Do you have any miles banked in a FFP?
(AA Executive Platinum, UA 1K, LAN Comodoro, etc)
Reply:

I have a BA rewards program, but rarely fly BA anymore, as Aer Lingus only fly into Dublin Airport I believe

(8) Preferred Airlines
Reply:

Anyone but Aer Lingus.


---


Thanks guys for the help, basically I fly to Ireland with my wife and kid once a year, and then my family, maybe 2-4 people will come to visit Orlando once a year, and I was thinking I could use their points too. Most Common in Direct Orlando to Dublin with Aer Lingus, but I hate Aer Lingus so will be flying indirect going forward. I have some points with BA, not a lot I think like 11k, but theyre worth very little now it seems.

Any help would be hugely helpful

Currently have Silver status on BA - ends in June...ideas?
 

Hi all,

I used to travel quite a bit for work, but since changing jobs, I hardly travel at all now.

Currently, I have Silver EC status (Sapphire - One World) and by the end of this tier point year will have collected < 200 points. I wondering what I can do to prolong my status other than doing a tier point run like I did last year.

However for the amount of travel I will be likely doing and even though, it’s quite fun to do the travel for a tier point run, the expense isn’t quite worth it and besides, if I do travel with this new position at all - its likely to be Virgin/Delta rather than One World.

By prolong status, I don’t necessarily mean with BA Exec Club. From what I understand, no other one world airlines will status match another; but does anyone know of a matching program that doesn’t require a “challenge” ?

Any ideas ?

SG