889

Lots of people in Hong Kong use bank-issued Octopus cards that automatically reload in HK$250 increments from their current account. No need to reload with cash.

gpia

They are not "bank-issued Octopus cards", but the standard ones from the MTR service desk. You can link any one of those to a credit card

889

No. You can get an ATM or credit card from your bank with Octopus AAVS function. After you receive it from your bank, you take it to an MTR service desk to have the Octopus function activated. It looks like a normal bank card, but there's an Octopus logo on the front and an Octopus chip inside.

http://www.octopus.com.hk/easy-reloa.../en/index.html

http://www.citibank.com.hk/english/c...CIYMENCCOABB01

You can also directly link a normal Octopus card to your HK credit card:

https://www.octopuscards.com/onlinef...n/aavsApply.do

gpia

Sorry, misunderstood your post. Just meant to say that you can (also) link any normal Octopus to AAVS.

aznichiro115

octopus IS NFC......

wco81

Octopus doesn't want to support mobile payment systems which also use NFC.

Chromie25

Sounds like a fun discussion here about NFC and Octopus. It's not that Octopus does not want to support mobile payment systems; they don't need to. As someone mentioned before, the idea of Octopus was conceived by merchants and transportation providers, NOT banks, back in the late 90s.


I can imagine someone getting the death stare if MTR allows something like Apple Pay and the person using it is stuck at the turnstile for 15 secs waiting for the transaction to go through.


BTW MTR is a listed company and runs independently, although the biggest shareholder is the HK government.

:D!

This entire thread has been off-topic from post #2.

With the exception of AAVS, Octopus is cash.

NFC/Apple/Android Pay etc is fine for certain uses but it is not cash. Personally, I don't want to use my phone for payment anyway, and I'd rather keep things separate than give public transport companies authorisation to charge my bank accounts directly.




In the next 10-20 years HK should just get rid of all coins and notes except for $500 and use Octopus for everything else.

They should install public machines everywhere that let you transfer any amounts between Octopodes and when you go to the bank or an ATM if you want small amounts you should be able to withdraw it onto an Octopus - in recent years I see more and more people getting cash from the ATM only go to straight into a 7-11 and put the maximum onto their Octopus.

There is this guy who lives near to my place in HK who seems to time things exactly right so that he always has -$10 on his Octopus and can top it up with $1000 exactly.

889

The current limit is HK$1000, but there are plans to increase the limit to HK$3,000.

http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/e...uld-change-our

kevincrumbs

So, who foots the bill for the installation of the machines and the assorted processing fees for all the small mom-and-pop local restaurants, streetside newspaper/magazine vendors and other assorted business who are thankfully not part of a global corporate conglomerate? I mean, we can't even get the taxis to accept Octopus on a wide basis, so how is this going to happen for all the instances above?

And yes, this thread has long been OT. Not sure what this obsession w/NFC is...

wco81

A modern city not adopting contactless to the extent it could because of intrenched interests.

Australia and NZ are a complete different story, though the transport systems in those countries also need to follow the lead of the TFL. But at least you can use credit cards on those systems.

Chromie25

Without extensive research and based on my knowledge from a few friends that run small shops and accept Octopus...


There's an installation charge and processing fees are quite low. There are additional incentives for small shops to use Octopus in the form of not having to count (as many) coins and depositing them to the bank (banks charge a fee for depositing large amount of coins). A typical shop that may find Octopus a better alternative are small snack shops near schools, as students sometimes may not carry cash and only an Octopus card to school (especially elementary school kids).


There's one simple reason why Taxis wouldn't use it. Taxi drivers are basically freelancers and if everything is on account they would not be able to receive their pay immediately, not to mention tax issues. Both taxi owners and drivers would not bother with this admin stuff as Octopus won't give them that much more business to compensate for the trouble.


With regards to OP's point about a modern city not adopting contactless to the extent it could because of intrenched interests, first of all HK is one of the first (if not the first) to use NFC technology for transportation. The Octopus company actually was behind many of the similar systems used worldwide.


The Octopus card also have many other uses beyond paying. Using the school kid example above, the school kid's Octopus card can also be used as the entry card for the apartment building that he lives in, for attendance when he goes to class (school will have a place with several machines to record attendance), snacks through the vending machine, photocopiers, etc. Octopus has uses beyond what a credit card can do.


And FYI, I live in HK but interestingly don't like to use the Octopus card besides for transportation (I have a different reason for this)..

wco81

How many of those mom and pop shops are there?

Where is the majority of the dollar volume, those small shops or the larger stores including the chain stores in all those malls.

Someone was talking about how suppliers would refuse to do business with some discounting chains from other countries which tried to establish a presence, such as Carrefour.

I know it's a cash-oriented culture but what about large purchases, like expensive clothes, electronics (like spending $3000 HKD or more for a phone), etc?

Are people using cash or credit cards for those transactions? Are there buyer protection benefits with HK credit cards?

889

There are thousands of small shops in Hong Kong. They're everywhere.

For larger purchases, over the usual stored value on an Octopus card, there's another system in Hong Kong linked to ATM cards called EPS. You hand over your card, punch in your PIN on a terminal, and the funds are immediately debited from your account.

EPS is not very popular with merchants, though, because the banks adopted a high fee schedule some years ago. Smaller merchants that still offer EPS often impose a fee on customers for using it. So if you're buying a camera, say, it's just as easy to head to an ATM and get cash than to pay with EPS. With the popularity of Octopus and the increase in the stored value limit, EPS will probably be dead in a few years.

As to taxis, riders would tend to pay exact fare with Octopus, reducing the drivers' income from rounding up. Further, taxi owners would presumably charge the drivers fees for Octopus use to recover their costs. And a bit more, of course. So naturally the drivers aren't too happy.

wco81

I've been in Vietnam for two weeks. For getting around, Uber is ridiculously a good value in HCMC and Hanoi. I also got the GrabCar app. but have use Uber since I already input my credit card there. Have taken about 10 rides and other than the rides to and from airports, all the rides have been under 1.50 USD. Besides navigating the chaotic traffic with all the motor scooters, you get out of the heat and into air conditioned comfort.

GrabCar is in the smaller cities like Hue and Hoi An. Looks like other Asian countries as well.

Again, maybe an American thing but Uber lets me minimize dealing with cash.

For major purchases, US credit cards provide purchase protection in various forms, including doubling the manufacturers warranty. So cash purchases for anything a couple of hundred dollars and more is unthinkable.

Some independent stores offer "cash and carry" discounts on 2-3%, which would be $50-60 on a $2000 purchase. But honestly a lot of people won't bother to go draw that cash, not to mention the buyer protection from credit cards.