bocastephen

I thought I would share a separate discussion regarding the drive up to Mauna Kea based on my own experience this past week - significantly different from all of the other drives I've taken over many years. There are now multiple rangers positioned at the exit of the visitor's center parking lot checking cars exiting, the road itself is closed at the visitor's center lot entrance, directing all cars into the lot.

1. You must have a true 4x4 - make/model doesn't matter, but it must be a true 4x4 with a 4LO gear option
2. You will enter the visitors center parking lot where you're required to acclimate for at least 30 minutes - and they will ask you to confirm and if they see you there for less than 30 minutes, ie you enter the lot and try to exit to the summit road, you'll be sent back
3. You must know how to shift into 4LO - and you'll be asked to demonstrate being able to do so, and have your car in 4LO gear before getting on the summit road
4. You'll be asked a series of questions about health, pregnancy, they will check the car for children, and you'll need to answer the questions to their satisfaction - and be told how to deal with sudden onset of altitude sickness
5. There are now two parking lots below the summit where you can stop on the way down for star gazing, but in everyone's opinion, the stars are clearer at the visitor's center - not sure if this is true, or they just want everyone off the summit and down to the visitor's center
6. On the way down, there is a mandatory brake check before you're allowed to proceed further down the Mauna Kea Access Rd beyond the visitor's center - if your brakes are hot, you'll be taken off the road to wait until they cool enough to proceed
7. The ranger will tell you not to take the last portion of the Humu’ula Trail to the very summit unless you are going there for religious reasons. Although not officially off limits, it's now strongly discouraged. For many years, walking to the top and watching sunset from what is the holiest site in all of Polynesia was how we completed our visit. While we have always been respectful of the site, and used it for quiet meditation and introspective thought, others were desecrating the site with rock piles, moving religious offerings, or creating other chaos - in fact, for the last few years of our visits, I was unable to have my own private time because I was so busy asking people to stop touching things, and be respectful - as that seems impossible without someone being posted there continuously, they now ask that no one go there, which is disappointing. So, because we under-estimated the cold, and didn't want to be "those people" going to the top and possibly encourage others to follow, we stayed down near the telescopes.
8. Watch your timing because there can be a backup of cars exiting the parking lot before sunset, and because everyone is getting about 3-5 minutes talking to a ranger, you might get stuck and miss the opportunity to go up - so get there earlier, assume at least 1hr of total time to get out of the parking lot and up to the summit, plus your 30-60 minutes of acclimation time and plan accordingly.

Also the old telescope setups at the visitor's center are gone, replaced with a once-monthly program with the new moon that is limited to 40 people, which sells out in less than a minute when released for booking.

So, that's the new reality of what to expect on the drive - the days of finding a Mustang convertible with the top down parked beside a telescope are long done, although the state does have a minivan shuttle, obviously not 4WD, that goes up and down with people and supplies - but it seems too many problems with visitors triggered the new crackdown. Hopefully they don't get stricter and force all visitors to take an organized tour.

Section 107

It is true. I dont remember all the science of it, but it is because of how the human eye/brain works that we can actually see better with more atmosphere than at very high altitude with thinner atmosphere. Generally, astronomists recommend being at 5,000-8,000 ft for the best viewing with the human eye. Above that, there is less oxygen which degrades the efficiency of the human eye.

dougfoglesong

We were there last October and all of the OP is correct. We didn't go up but they did say that AWD is OK if you take low all the way. They had a ranger just outside the VC for questions.

wobbly wings

Ok. Thanks so much to the OP for all the info!
Any further data points on AWD vs 4WD?

bocastephen

Good to know about the AWD, but the day I was there, the rangers were diverting all non-4WD back out, including most SUVs. Not sure if there was a recent policy change.

The one type of car they don't allow up, but really should are EVs as their regenerative braking systems would keep the downhill speed under control without using the brakes, plus you'd have a full charge on arrival into the parking lot (to make up for what was lost on the way up). Maybe they just need a few volunteers to demo them.

Mrgolfer21

This stinks....went in 2014 and had a front wheel drive regular rental car. Pulled up and inquired with the ranger how bad the road was and if he thought I could make it since 4WD was recommended. He said as long as I knew how to drive and could take it slow, I'd be fine. Made it up and down without issues...wasn't anywhere along the way I thought I might not make it. Have since driven an AWD SUV on Shafer Trail in Utah and that was almost too much. Has the road gotten so bad recently or just doing it to make sure they keep the riff-raff out? The scariest part was driving back to my hotel in Kona at night....super dark on 190, I was white knuckle driving there and probably one of the few places I've ever driven below the speed limit in my life.

bocastephen

A lot has changed since 2014. Back in the old Saddle Rd days, very few tourists ventured to the visitors center, and even fewer to the summit, mostly because visitors were not allowed by rental car companies to drive on Saddle Rd - there were even threads on this forum on how to drive Saddle Rd, along with debates on why visitors should or should be doing so. Way back then I took one tour with Hawai'i Forest and Trail, then on subsequent visits just drove myself, but usually in a regular sedan or SUV, or a 4WD if we were able to get one. I knew how to do the drive and make it down safely, but there accidents because other people did not. I took Saddle Rd many an afternoon and night in the dark when the road was covered in pea soup fog and I had to inch along at 5MPH because you literally could not see the road or the edges or were able to tell if you were still on the road except by feel.

Fast forward to the completion of the Saddle Rd re-alignment to Hwy 200, and that opened access to every visitor and rental car on the Kohala coast, along with Kona town - and the change was a sudden influx of tourists to the visitors center, and more attempts to drive the summit by a motley collection of convertibles, sedans, SUVs, 4WD and others - with resulting chaos, crowding and accidents on the road. So, the decision was made to crack down and limit access to actual 4WD cars and drivers who knew how to operate them. I am not sure if the new procedures around forcing acclimation and doing checks for children and pregnant women are new, or have been around since the new rules because this was our first drive up since the ranger checks started.

When I first started going to the visitor's center years ago, I would park in the small side lot to acclimate and eat dinner, and the only other vehicles were the tour vans and maybe a couple other self-drive tourists. On the way down we would stop back at the visitor's center to view the telescopes and I could still find a spot in the side lot. Once Hwy 200 was finished, the next time we went there, it was total chaos with people parking everywhere (the new lot wasn't totally finished yet), crawling on everything, lining up 20 deep to look through a telescope, a traffic jam snaking its way up to the summit, plus the chaos once you got to the summit with dozens of people taking the trail up to what is the holiest site in Polynesia, and desecrating it with trash, loud talking, selfies, stone piles, etc.

In the end, something had to be done - and today's reality is the result.

STS-134

I wonder how they'd deal with a Rivian R1T or Ford F-150 Lightning? They're obviously pickups and can handle rough terrain but don't have 4LO, they have regenerative brakes so the friction brakes shouldn't overheat.

But the 4LO rule is stupid to begin with. If you overheat your friction brakes you are an idiot, and should have your driver's license revoked. Plus they have so many photos of crashed Jeeps so the problem is obviously not the cars, it's the idiots behind the wheels of some of the cars.

bocastephen

I would ask the same question about any EV that uses regenerative braking - since that would remove friction brakes from the equation, but maybe they need to do some tests to make sure those braking systems wouldn't fail under the constant stress of controlling the car's descent. Since overheating the brakes is an issue, they stop everyone coming down from the summit to take the temperature of your brakes and if your brakes are hot, you are sent into the parking lot (good luck finding a parking spot) to wait until they cool off before you're allowed down the rest of the Mauna Kea Access Rd back to Hwy 200 as they don't want someone to go off the road further downslope - I guess that also happened.

I think you can rent Model Y and Model 3, and maybe Polestar EVs at Kona, but the other question is their clearance over the very uneven summit access road - one bad pothole and you could scrape your battery pack open and cause a fire or explosion.

747FC

bocastephen : Mahalo for the information! Could you provide the contact information for making bookings for New Moon viewing? How about suggested rental car agencies?

Thanks!

bocastephen

Any car rental agency will be fine - but they are charging a premium for 4WD. I used my National free days, otherwise it was $225 per day plus tax for a Wrangler. One option if staying on the Kohala coast is booking one for 24hrs, picking up at the Hilton Waikoloa, but after gas and time taken for pick-up, finding and buying a take-out meal at the market, buying gas at Waikoloa prices, drop-off, etc, it almost makes more sense to just book one of the tour vans for the same or less cost unless you have a coupon or free days to burn, plus the tour comes with private stargazing, although with less sophisticated telescopes and commentary.

For the new moon stargazing, here is the link: https://hilo.hawaii.edu/maunakea/kuene/stargazing.php

However, one of the astronomers we were chatting with while acclimating, aside from regaling us with tales of his friend who would drive up to the telescopes in his 3cyl Geo Metro, did warn that the moment the reservation portal opens for the next month, the slots are gone within 30 seconds and people have the webpage loaded and ready for the very moment the slots open, so it will take some technical acumen and luck to grab a slot.

seawolf

You're guys are saying Hertz/Avis/National have no restrictions on their vehicles going up past the visitor center? My understanding is operating on unpaved roads is a violation of rental agreement.

STS-134

Do Jeep Wranglers have this restriction? If so, it's pretty much useless to rent one. As far as 2WD vehicles, on Maui, they used to say that driving on "unpaved roads" violates the contract. And then when they paved most of the Kahekili and Pi‘ilani Highways, they changed the language on the maps they give you at the rental car office to say that driving on "unauthorized roads" violates the rental car contract. Although I've not actually noticed any fine print in the contract language that specifically mentions the Kahekili or Pi‘ilani Highways. If I have a rental car break down on one of those roads at some point it would probably make for an interesting legal dispute over who is responsible for the towing bill. In any case, to get to the Maunakea summit, I rented a Wrangler from Hertz and drove it to the top.

bocastephen

In general, it may violate that specific provision of the rental agreement but countless rental cars go up without a second thought. I wouldn’t be concerned and the rental car agencies can’t be so dumb they don’t know it.

Back in the day, driving on Saddle Road was forbidden but even with it being paved, many drove it anyway.

seawolf

Ok I understand. This is one of those don't get caught situations. If there is a breakdown or accident on these roads, the game is up. Otherwise no one is wiser.