Schengen - What does 90 days in 180 days really mean?
Apr 5, 2012, 11:39 am
#62
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 7
It's a rolling 180 day period.
On each and every day that you are in Schengen you have to look back 180 days and ask yourself "was I in Schengen for more than 90 days in the last 180?"
On 10 April you look back to 10 October and your answer will be that you were in Schengen for 68 days out of the last 180 - so well within.
On 1 May you look back to 1 November and you find that you were in Schengen for 88 days (68 last time, 20 now) out of the past 180 - so still within the 90, just about.
On 2 May the figure will still be 88 because 1 November is now more than 180 days ago so no longer counts.
On 3 May it will still be 88 because 1 and 2 November are now more than 180 days ago and no longer count.
And then the figure will remain at 88 because every day you "lose" one of the days from the previous stay.
On each and every day that you are in Schengen you have to look back 180 days and ask yourself "was I in Schengen for more than 90 days in the last 180?"
On 10 April you look back to 10 October and your answer will be that you were in Schengen for 68 days out of the last 180 - so well within.
On 1 May you look back to 1 November and you find that you were in Schengen for 88 days (68 last time, 20 now) out of the past 180 - so still within the 90, just about.
On 2 May the figure will still be 88 because 1 November is now more than 180 days ago so no longer counts.
On 3 May it will still be 88 because 1 and 2 November are now more than 180 days ago and no longer count.
And then the figure will remain at 88 because every day you "lose" one of the days from the previous stay.
Apr 5, 2012, 11:45 am
#63
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 7
Dear Aviatrix,
I was just reading the Schengen agreement http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/...01:0473:EN:PDF
and on page 323 I met the following
2.1.3. Short-stay or travel visas: multiple entry visas
This visa entitles aliens who seek to enter the territories of the Contracting Parties, for
reasons other than to immigrate, to carry out a continuous visit or several visits whose
duration does not exceed three months in any half-year from the date of first entry. As a
general rule, this visa may be issued for one or several entries.
As you see ''any half-year from the date of first entry'' which means it's not rolling day period (unfortunately). Or do I understand wrongly?
I was just reading the Schengen agreement http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/...01:0473:EN:PDF
and on page 323 I met the following
2.1.3. Short-stay or travel visas: multiple entry visas
This visa entitles aliens who seek to enter the territories of the Contracting Parties, for
reasons other than to immigrate, to carry out a continuous visit or several visits whose
duration does not exceed three months in any half-year from the date of first entry. As a
general rule, this visa may be issued for one or several entries.
As you see ''any half-year from the date of first entry'' which means it's not rolling day period (unfortunately). Or do I understand wrongly?
Apr 5, 2012, 1:24 pm
#64
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 7,560
This would work out exactly the same in your case (as far as I can see). Your first entry was on 1 November, a half-year from that is 1 May (give or take a couple of days), so you'd still be within the 90 days.
Is your forthcoming trip on the same visa or on a new one?
Is your forthcoming trip on the same visa or on a new one?
Apr 5, 2012, 1:53 pm
#65
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 7
My trip is on the same visa
I got confused because I was also explained that after each 90/180 I have to go out of Schengen zone. I spent already 68 days, so now when i go I ll use the rest 22 and I have to go out and reenter in order to be able to restart the 2nd 90. Hope it is not correct because I don't like this activity, but I also don't want to overstay and make mistake. Thank you for your advice
I got confused because I was also explained that after each 90/180 I have to go out of Schengen zone. I spent already 68 days, so now when i go I ll use the rest 22 and I have to go out and reenter in order to be able to restart the 2nd 90. Hope it is not correct because I don't like this activity, but I also don't want to overstay and make mistake. Thank you for your advice
Apr 27, 2012, 6:31 am
#66
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 7
Dear Aviatrix,
Do you think that I should leave Schengen zone after the first 180/90 days?
1Nov-7 Jan =68 days
10 April -?
Can I stay from 10 April- 10 July ?
or After first 180/90 days I have to go out and reenter again.
In fact i am in Schengen area now, so if you dont know may be you can advise who can i address here, police or else?
thanks in advance.
P.S.
is this concerning me?
The 90/180 days rule means that once the visitor has spent a total of 90 days in the Schengen zone (either consecutively or separately) within any half year, he or she must leave the Schengen zone.
http://www.euro-dollar-currency.com/..._days_rule.htm
Do you think that I should leave Schengen zone after the first 180/90 days?
1Nov-7 Jan =68 days
10 April -?
Can I stay from 10 April- 10 July ?
or After first 180/90 days I have to go out and reenter again.
In fact i am in Schengen area now, so if you dont know may be you can advise who can i address here, police or else?
thanks in advance.
P.S.
is this concerning me?
The 90/180 days rule means that once the visitor has spent a total of 90 days in the Schengen zone (either consecutively or separately) within any half year, he or she must leave the Schengen zone.
http://www.euro-dollar-currency.com/..._days_rule.htm
Last edited by George MMM; Apr 27, 2012 at 6:37 am
Apr 27, 2012, 8:11 am
#67
Ambassador, Emirates
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: LGW / AMS / CPT
Programs: SA KL BA EK
Posts: 4,273
Dear Aviatrix,
Do you think that I should leave Schengen zone after the first 180/90 days?
1Nov-7 Jan =68 days
10 April -?
Can I stay from 10 April- 10 July ?
or After first 180/90 days I have to go out and reenter again.
In fact i am in Schengen area now, so if you dont know may be you can advise who can i address here, police or else?
thanks in advance.
P.S.
is this concerning me?
The 90/180 days rule means that once the visitor has spent a total of 90 days in the Schengen zone (either consecutively or separately) within any half year, he or she must leave the Schengen zone.
http://www.euro-dollar-currency.com/..._days_rule.htm
Do you think that I should leave Schengen zone after the first 180/90 days?
1Nov-7 Jan =68 days
10 April -?
Can I stay from 10 April- 10 July ?
or After first 180/90 days I have to go out and reenter again.
In fact i am in Schengen area now, so if you dont know may be you can advise who can i address here, police or else?
thanks in advance.
P.S.
is this concerning me?
The 90/180 days rule means that once the visitor has spent a total of 90 days in the Schengen zone (either consecutively or separately) within any half year, he or she must leave the Schengen zone.
http://www.euro-dollar-currency.com/..._days_rule.htm
In my experience, the most common interpretation of the 180 rule in the (vaguely worded) Schengen agreement is to use a rolling 180 day period.
180 days after 1 Nov is 27 April. So on 28 April, 1 Nov does no longer 'count' for the 90 days. You are currently on 87 days and (assuming you are going to remain in the Schengen area), will stay on 87 until 5 July. Then, as there are no days to 'remove' after 7 Jan, the count will go up again and reach 90 three days later.
So as long as you leave before 8 July, you are 'legal'! On the 10th, you are 2 days over.
Jun 17, 2014, 5:55 pm
#68
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: HNL
Programs: AA, DL, UA, US
Posts: 24
Thanks for some clarity
It's a rolling 180 day period.
On each and every day that you are in Schengen you have to look back 180 days and ask yourself "was I in Schengen for more than 90 days in the last 180?"
On 10 April you look back to 10 October and your answer will be that you were in Schengen for 68 days out of the last 180 - so well within.
On 1 May you look back to 1 November and you find that you were in Schengen for 88 days (68 last time, 20 now) out of the past 180 - so still within the 90, just about.
On 2 May the figure will still be 88 because 1 November is now more than 180 days ago so no longer counts.
On 3 May it will still be 88 because 1 and 2 November are now more than 180 days ago and no longer count.
And then the figure will remain at 88 because every day you "lose" one of the days from the previous stay.
On each and every day that you are in Schengen you have to look back 180 days and ask yourself "was I in Schengen for more than 90 days in the last 180?"
On 10 April you look back to 10 October and your answer will be that you were in Schengen for 68 days out of the last 180 - so well within.
On 1 May you look back to 1 November and you find that you were in Schengen for 88 days (68 last time, 20 now) out of the past 180 - so still within the 90, just about.
On 2 May the figure will still be 88 because 1 November is now more than 180 days ago so no longer counts.
On 3 May it will still be 88 because 1 and 2 November are now more than 180 days ago and no longer count.
And then the figure will remain at 88 because every day you "lose" one of the days from the previous stay.
Jun 18, 2014, 3:43 am
#69
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 399
Croatia plan to start the joining process in July 2015 with a view to actually joining in 2016.
http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti...en-in-mid-2015
http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti...en-in-mid-2015
Jun 19, 2014, 3:20 am
#70
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: HNL
Programs: AA, DL, UA, US
Posts: 24
Croatia plan to start the joining process in July 2015 with a view to actually joining in 2016.
http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti...en-in-mid-2015
http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/arti...en-in-mid-2015
Jun 22, 2014, 12:48 am
#71
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Exile
Posts: 15,656
Just one comment here - while the 90 in 180 calculation being used here is the interpretation adopted by almost all Schengen states, BELGIUM is a notable exception and adopts a literal interpretation of a 180 day clock from first entry to Schengen that resets the 90 day clock to zero on a fixed date.
Therefore a situation may exist (and has existed) where a foreign national is admitted to Belgium on the basis of the above interpretation but subsequently deemed by another country (eg. Germany) to have exceeded the 90-in-180 permitted period.
An outlier for sure, but something that people should be aware of.
Therefore a situation may exist (and has existed) where a foreign national is admitted to Belgium on the basis of the above interpretation but subsequently deemed by another country (eg. Germany) to have exceeded the 90-in-180 permitted period.
An outlier for sure, but something that people should be aware of.
Mar 27, 2017, 11:31 am
#72
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
I wonder if I could ask the experts another question on this subject. If a citizen that has dual passports from non-EU countries, stays 90 days in the EU on one passport. Can they then leave the EU on that passport, and return a week later on another passport? Like a dual US-Japan citizen for instance.
Mar 27, 2017, 6:43 pm
#74
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Heraklion, Greece
Posts: 7,566
I only disagree with you when you say "it might just not be detected": It will be detected, as they check everything through the same database in all countries and all immigration checkpoints. A very bad idea...
Mar 28, 2017, 2:08 am
#75
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Seat 1A, Juice pretty much everywhere, Mucci des Coins Exotiques
Posts: 34,339
Thanks. I figured it was against the spirit of the law, but wasn't sure if the law was written to cover this specific case. Does anyone have a link to the actual legal text? I googled around a bit but haven't found it yet.
Actually that is not true, at least not yet. Passports are not scanned at every immigration checkpoint across the entire EU. In some cases it may be for technical reasons. In other cases (Paris), it's just because some policemen don't want to it seems. Although that has tightened up quite a bit in the last few years.
Actually that is not true, at least not yet. Passports are not scanned at every immigration checkpoint across the entire EU. In some cases it may be for technical reasons. In other cases (Paris), it's just because some policemen don't want to it seems. Although that has tightened up quite a bit in the last few years.