That's a good point. If you switch your main account over to QF and reach Platinum one status, won't EK have to honour this?

I agree with you on all your points, and how EK need to improve the program. However, regarding the quote below:

I doubt highly that we, as a group, will influence MAJOR program changes for three reasons:

1) A lot of people, from my converstaions with EK customers in J/F, don't care about the program (especially people from the GCC). If they are getting/paying for the product everytime, what sort of benefit would a FF program give them personally. (Again, this is their view, and we can argue about upgrades/free tickets but if they always buy F, to them it wouldn't matter.)

2) EK as an entity doesn't seem to care about frequent flyer's. The passengers will come, one way or another, and cabins will be filled based on their pricing, global network, and frequencies. How many die-hard flyer program addicts are there in Skywards? I know for a fact from all my lurking on here before joining a lot of people who fly EK vote based on price in relation to the product/service. We all know EK has the worst Earn/Burn ratio and we still fly them, and I remember a chart comparing them to other programs and they were all they way at the bottom. Yet, passenger numbers increase yearly, and so does their profitability (barring anything out of their control, such as oil/gas prices). I'm sure EK notice this and know as an FFP that has been around for a while now, it suits their operation and interests the way it is set-up.

3) EK's location, and culture. Big corporations in the region don't change for customers, customer's must change for the corporation. It's a hard pill to swallow, but there are a lot of examples proving this. No matter how global EK is as a brand, the owners/shot-callers are local, and there is not a great amount of foreign holding in the company. (Other than bonds sold in international markets which don't have any control rights.)

Even with the QF agreement, I don't see how or why they would change things. QF will be filling up EK planes to Europe, and EK passengers have 2 extra flights to London and Oz. And we as flyers still get credited with the miles for sectors flown on QF metal. The agreement benefits EK more than QF, why change things that "cost" EK, when they have the upper hand.

True, but it would depend on if we will earn "status earning miles" on EK aircraft. As far as I heard and understood, only regular miles will be credited.

You will yes if it is a code-share flight.

Status credits will be awarded on EK/QF metal...this has been confirmed in the latest correspondence I have seen as well as by the official lurker - Red Roo over on the QF forum.

In that case, then I guess I will be switching to QF program when flying on EK to earn better recognition. Do the full/all benefits of the QF program be recognised by EK as well?

You just made a choice and since there would be many more like you who are planning to switch, shouldn't EK start getting worried that they need to seriously enhance the program? Unless, you are saying that EK (and its 'local' management) couldn't care less so long as their planes we full (of QF FFs of course) and they were making money and the entire Skywards desk didn't have anything to do (as no Skywards FF left) except play with paperweights, pens, sticks, and b@!!$. Of course, this is an extreme example but I hope you get the drift....

Yes they would be full of QF FF's instead of Skywards FF's. But how many seats are given for "free" or "upgraded" FF's per A/C? EK will be gaining profitability, not a single plane will be flown that is full with "free flyers".

I get what you mean, but what my point is about, is that there are not enough die-hard FF who would stop flying EK, or FFP memeber walk-outs to warrant a change through the eye's of EK management. If 1000 people leave Skywards, I'm sure 100,000 would still remain. Not everyone is concerned with earn/burn and status recognition, as much as service and product delivery. Remember, not eveyrone is an FTer!

Sure, I would leave Skywards, but my ticket would still be bought from EK, I would fly on EK, and use EK's service. And so will any QF FF's who apparentley will be getting more convenient European connections. Would they be opening Skywards accounts, if they are earning all their QF program entitlements on board EK? I'm willing to say No, they wouldn't join Skywards because they are already with the better FFP in this marriage. I would go as far as say it might be a step down for them. On the other hand, how many Skywards members would have the idea to join another airline's FFP while still flying on EK and booking through EK? Not many, because they aren't as addicted to FFP as us. Exactly like how not many people would pay for a roundtrip of DXB-DOH-DXB on the same day just to renew status!

EK has never been one to worry to much about Skywards. In fact I would bet many execs find it more trouble then it's worth. It was and is just a necessary evil that is part of running a world class airline. The difference between EK & many of its competitors is that EK knows they won't lose their premium customers & the economy customers fill up the planes because of price. It's important to remember that there was no Skywards in the 90's & EK was already well on its way to where it is today, competing w airlines that have had FF programs for years. I'm not saying I agree 100% with this thinking but know some execs that do.

I would say these 1000 people need to make a big noise before leaving so that EK listens. And a global airline competing in today's world can't afford not to listen to its customers, especially its most loyal ones.

True, EK has a great product but they are in an industry that is getting increasingly consolidated, competitive, with rising fuel costs, and a product that is now getting copied by others. The EK hard product has also been going down and is nowhere near what it was in the 90s or early 2000s. So, its shouldn't be long before they start 'really' caring about Skywards.

Anyway, as you can see, I am a die-hard EK fan (so far...) lets see what the future has to offer

I agree with you. Lets face it, in this cost cutting times, why would they pay an extra cost when its works as is to their advantage.

I agree, but we are "a drop of water" in an ocean to them. EK has had several millions of passengers to be distracted by noise from just a few like us. I would really love to see some data about FF in Skywards though to know how many there are like us, and if there are patterns that show walk-outs related to different aspects of the business, including the FFP.

EK is not going to listen to 1000 people unless those 1000 people are regular premium class big spend flyers, and even then dont expect them to listen very hard. Yes, the product is not what it was a few years ago but it is certainly better then the 90's. In the 90's there were no private suites, 380's & DXB was a miserable airport with a windowless room that was called the First class lounge. But EK was & is still superior in many ways for those of us who pay for a premium product. As for the masses that pay for Y, they are mostly driven in this part of the world by price & EK has in many cases the lowest price. One other thing to remember, EK probably carries more first time flyers & people that won't take more then 2 flights in their life then probably any other carrier. In many ways it's very similar to Macau, which now makes more money w gambling then Las Vegas. Those gamblers may only come w €10 each but they get millions of them thru the doors. EK has a very similar sub-clientele of passengers who spend close to nothing & won't come back again but there are millions of them to keep coming thru DXB & EK greets them with open arms

What I meant is that EK had a much bigger gap from the other carriers in the 90s than it has now. Speaking of Y, even in the 90s EK had personal video screens for passengers in Economy while most other airlines had the overhead 'pop-out' every 6-7 seats withe everyone watching the same movie, personal footrests, personal toiletry kit, etc...That gap has narrowed quite a bit (experience 9W in Y - its got an equally good hard product). Even in F, SQ now has suites.

In a lot of ways EK does not have a 'unique' product in premium or economy cabins anymore. So, the 'mindset' that worked for them in the 90s probably isn't going to cut much ice in 2012.

Won't the QF Platinum One still trump you even you make it to the Skywards 4th tier :D

I would hope that EKs platinums carry more (or at least equal) weight than QF Platinums or Platinum One on EK metal....:)