Flew in C from MXP-TLV today. Great, comfy seats, great food, great service, all in all, better than any European Airline for such a flight. Great experience.

Why am I frustrated? Because the only reason I took that flight was because my client was paying for me to fly C, and it was the only nonstop.

If I'm paying for it myself and want to earn proper miles, I never fly LY because they are always the highest priced option in coach, and the mileage program is useless. As a result, 90% of my flying is on other airlines, and I'm based in TLV.

Why can't LY management do something about this? It should be the opposite - 90% of my flying should be on LY.

Separately, off the coast of Albania, I looked out my window and saw an LY 747 passing us about a mile to our right and 2000 feet below us. In my 37 years of flying I have never seen such a close parallel IFR cruise track with a another plane (and I'm including the several hundred hours flying my own plane in the US) and certainly not another plane from the same carrier. I felt like I was in the Yom Ha'atzmaut flyby. I got a photo but not sure how to post it here.

This is exactly why EL AL needs to get into an alliance ASAP. Some people have debated me on here and in other forums about the virtue of alliance membership and they express doubt as to its importance. The fact is that unless LY is in an alliance their Matmid program will always significantly lag behind virtually all of their European and American competitors. Additionally, business travelers, such as yourself, will likely shun flying EL AL because of that even when the hard product and service are superior to the competition. It is business travelers which Yield the highest profits for airlines.

The reason why I've stopped flying EL AL is precisely because of the Matmid and miles issue. Your post and the frustrations expressed therein validate the necessity for EL AL obtaining alliance membership now more than ever given Open Skies.

I agree with you that LY's shorthaul business is great. Their economy is great. Why do they completely fall apart on longhaul business/first?

I am also like you - in TLV but avoid LY at all costs. They also have horrible lounges throughout the world.

Lots of things would be improved if they joined an Alliance, but this isn't going to happen any time in the near future. In the mean time, if they simply improved their longhaul offerings, they would at least win back occasional longhaul travel by me and others.

If I have to go to Los Angeles, for example, I seriously have an internal debate as to if I should take El Al direct or BA via London! Frankly BA usually wins that one. I would rather stop in London and be pampered in the lounges for a couple hours than sit in substandard seats for 14. This means something is seriously broken in LY-land.

The Mrs. & me are considering a trip there next year. We will most probably purchase either C or A class tickets. I would LOVE to give the business to El Al.

HOWEVER, No Alliance=No Money!

So, BA will be the airline of choice (1W)...

The FFP is terrible for people like myself who want free perks and who fly in discount econ classes.

Just compare to United's program and the differences are crazy. Someone taking 5 disc economy RT flights TLV-NYC would be United Gold and LY Silver.

United Gold is absurdly unbelievably better than LY silver. Unlimited econ+, 50% bonus miles, *G (lounge access for free), 3 free bags, possible free upgrades.

LY gets you 10% bonus miles and the right to buy lounge access for $300!

I would have gladly spent an extra $150 for a summer TLV-ORD, NYC-TLV trip to fly LY and get a direct flight back, but the FFP program is so bad I would feel dumb doing it.

Not just the FFP. As someone who has flown Pegasus and easyjet from TLV where there are no miles to speak of, not only is the FFP bad but the prices are higher than any other airline. Higher than AF to Paris, higher than BA to london. For the same price and more convenient schedule MAYBE I could overlook the FFP but as it is I can't.

Not sure what you mean by "such a flght", but I agree LY's 737 C product is vastly superior than any other Europena Airline that uses a S/H product on th TLV route, but BA's, IB's, LX's, and TK's hard product wins hands down.

Why the debate?

BA has a vastly superior product. Personally the only thing that would sway me LY's way on that route would be if I need to be in LA on a Sunday morning as flying BA would mean leaving before the weekend (for me anyway). And for that exact reason I have taken LY once on that route and did not enjoy it, not least because I sat next to someone (I know) in J who I didn't fancy sitting next to for 15 hours. On BA, such a situation no problem - politely say hello or not (depending on how bad it is between you ), raise the divider, and no more contact fr the whole flight.

Because one way I get on a plane in TLV and off a plane in LAX, with no stops, circling, snow, or ash clouds in between I opt for a direct flight over a stop almost no matter what.... but 14 hours on an El Al seat...is just too much to handle.

I thought from FT-Do back in April that EL AL was relaunching ( revamping) matmid

You're right, we ARE working on that.
Still haven't re-launched yet.

Liat.

Any ETA on that?

Hope you'll finally make it at least as good as every other airline on earth.

I hope revamping Matmid would, at minimum, include the following:

1. Obtaining alliance membership; if that is impossible adding more codeshare partners

2. Moving to a mileage based system as oppose to a points/booking class one and making status attainment/retention and mileage redemption on par with competitors like United.

Good news! Leaning towards flying LY to HKG/BKK this summer- it's actually cheaper and nonstop, but still debatable!