Visconti

My standard practice is just to subtract whatever they levy on me from the tip. Servers likely don't appreciate this, but, that's between them and their employers. I offer my 20% - X% (whatever tax for whatever cause) tithe, and they can split however they'd like; just leave me out of it.

PS - goes without saying that I don't tip on the tax, which those those receipt suggestions always include.

Collierkr

eielef

Hilarious!
Have you ever been asked to pre-pay for booking a table? This is such a new concept, I just learned it existed a few months ago. I've never booked a table. I've gone to the place, if it was full, i'd go to a different one. Very easy. I'm also not a big fan of booking hotels when they ask you to pre-pay it or when they ask you for a credit card (I do give them one, but I put, on purpose, a fake expiration date). For two reasons: there is no clear benefit on doing so (it has mostly the same price if you book it (to get miles, or a better rate) a minute before checking in. And there are many chances you can't make it there. Like last year, I had booked a hotel, my flight was two hours delayed, I e-mailed them, and texted them, saying I'd be late. Then I got there, but no one was in the check in, like the hotel was closed, at least the reception. Called and called with no answer. After over an hour waiting, I left and found a different hotel. On the following day, I find out Booking had decided to charge to my credit card the whole bill (of TWO nights). I showed booking my email saying I would be late, and my 12 unanswered phone calls. They say the hotel reported me as a no-show. I explained them the situation. No more answers. The hotel didn't answer either.

I've been living in Russia for 6 years, and I've never tipped to any waiter, though I've been forced to pay the "service" fee whatever it means. I'm not sure how far it will this stupid mostly American tradition that we, Latin Americans, have proudly copied. Russian's are not aware yet.
I've been some times in countries where tipping is expected, but don't expect me to tip you. I can be a pain to find mistakes on the service, e.g. the plate hadn't been pre-warmed, or the fabric used for table clothing was cheap, or even the glasses were not properly cleaned. I could show that to the manager to avoid the service fee.
In my work, I'm not tipped. Actually, I could be fired if i'm ever tipped, because it is seen as un-ethical and ilegal (it's would be called a bribe).

If you read the Karl Strauss website (linked in the thread), it says that between 2015 and 2019 the minimum wage in LA is 42,5% higher. That means everyone in LA must be rich now. I doubt this is true. And I'm seriously against having it added to my bill. There is so much written on the topic I'm surprised the US has no serious legislation on the matter. Ban tipping, make restaurant owners pay decent salaries, and make plates a bit more expensive, or much more expensive. But stop forcing us to pay this untaxed money, because there are no taxes on tips, so no income tax, and the whole story. In Latin America it would be called: payment in 'black' or undeclared money.

milepig

strickerj

krazykanuck

Correct, they don't. I had an interesting situation that even I hadn't run into before on Southwest a couple months ago. They had sent me a discount code as an apology for IRROPS and the way it applied was against the base fare, before taxes and fees were added. So my $75 discount code wound up saving me about $80 because it lowered the fare that is subject to the US transportation tax.

There is also a tax reason for this. In many US locales, labor isn't subject to sales tax, where as parts that are resold are. So itemization does help to lower costs.

Enigma368

This is harsh on the staff in the short term but to be fair, if we all did this, the restaurant would lose all its staff - or they would revolt - pretty much immediately and they would be forced to remove any hidden surcharges.

This is more or less what I do. Again, it might hurt servers a little in the short term but pretty quickly if they are not getting the tips they would get elsewhere, they will either leave or they will ask the restaurant to make it up some other way - so ultimately the restaurant will be forced to address the issue. I think this is the best course of action to stop this kind of surcharge behaviour spreading without hurting the staff too much.

Rbt001

I disagree with the philosophy of tipping the same at a buffet. While they may clear plates and offer beverages, that's about it, and consequentially, the restaurant will assign a far greater number of tables for each waitstaff member to cover. So essentially the waitstaff can make it up in volume.

Tipping is supposed to be about compensating appropriately for service provided by employees that are in service positions.

With respect to your reference of 1990's labor for Chinese buffets, sounds like what you describe is what we today refer to as Human Trafficking, and I would say the answer is to avoid such establishments. Tipping aside, simply patronizing such an establishment supports this inhumane practice.

Often1

Much of this is fine if one is vacationing and has no intention of returning to the place.

But, if you do this where you live and are a regular, it does not do much to build a good service relationship. Staff remember the people who take care of them.

JBord

This is itemization, not surcharge for business overhead costs. Restaurants itemize as well, so you can check that your bill is correct. The other difference is that you'll usually get a quote and sign a work order up front for auto repair, so there's no dilemma on how much to pay after the service.

This is true. That's the problem with the new surcharges popping up everywhere. They result in several different outcomes:
1. Customer doesn't notice or doesn't understand and tips normal amount - restaurant and server make more money
2. Customer reduces the tip, as we've seen in this thread - no one makes or loses money, but both sides are now upset
3. Customer no longer patronizes the restaurant - everyone loses

The only positive outcome is one where the customer is fooled. So while your statement above is correct, customers also remember which restaurants or staff take care of them. For me personally, it's not as much the cost as it makes it seem to me that the restaurant owner is whining or making some kind of political statement when they do this. If they just raised the base prices to cover the new costs, like most companies do, I'd have no issue, and I'd tip normally -- that's an outcome where everyone is happy (given the assumption that the price will increase one way or the other).

Visconti

This.

Unless it's something extraordinary, wait staff get 20% net excluding taxes and high priced alcohol (of course, I'm not tipping 20% on a $200 bottle of wine). In most major cities, I can spend my money anywhere; matter of fact, I can spend it anywhere in the world. I'll ditch any restaurant without a second thought. Enough of these cheesy articles pushing tipping 25% including the tax and full price of alcohol & health care (or, whatever other virtue signaling tax).

If they don't like it, fine. I can spend my hard $$ anywhere.

enviroian

wine choices at my wedding

Eastbay1K

It is even (potentially) more complex than that. Many restaurants pay a % of gross receipts to the landlord, and pay a % of gross receipts to the local governmental agency as a tax or business license. The base payroll may affect various other items such as comp insurance rates, benefit plans, and the like.

The restaurant industry business model as we know it is hanging on for dear life. Margins are thinner than ever. While I abhor these surcharges (and my region probably gave birth to them) and believe that prices should just go up, owners (not the mega chains) are looking to tweak their business models to survive. Some jurisdictions require that a person be in the chain of direct service to the patron to share in tipping, and the restaurants can't even keep kitchen help at far above minimum wage, so this provides a pool to "tip" the kitchen staff. Having known enough restaurant owners who have been teetering on the edge at long time "successful" restaurants, the small guys aren't "greedy owners." They are looking for ways to keep their doors open and continue to provide quality food with decent service at prices that won't choke us. While I may not agree with how they are doing it (including some friends that own a restaurant), I can understand why. The current business model is not sustainable. Something's gonna blow. The owners can't charge enough to make a decent living. Sure, vote with your wallets, but when the only places that remain open serve Sysco GorMay under a number of various chain brand names, you'll have "won."

My comments are based upon restaurants in my area, which are almost all independently owned (including very small restaurant groups).

As far as the tip itself, nothing wrong with tipping on whatever percentage of the base food cost that one deems appropriate.

s0ssos

Presuming you are from the Bay Area, I don't think this is the issue. There was an article (Chronicle I think?) talking about how all the big tech companies are hiring away chefs, so restaurants (even famous ones, like Del Fina) cannot keep staff. But that is because when you go to work for a tech company they give you benefits, and restaurants don't.
Even though other areas aren't as expensive as the Bay Area the same pressures do exist. People hate serving other people nowadays, probably moreso than ever before in the history of the world. Why would they do that job, kissing up all day long, if they have the option of a better job?
In New York they had a "pilot project" to see if the quality of teachers would be improved if they paid them more. So they paid them $100,000 a year. And guess what? They had much better applicants.

I doubt there are many people who would be a "waiter" for fun. Some people are "flight attendants" even though they can retire though. But waiter? No.

seat38a

Yup, pretty much a much more fleshed out explanation of what I was trying to say. Too many additional costs are directly tied to actual wages paid and gross sales. Tips generally except the mandatory assumptions that the IRS requires, do not generate additional FICA burden on the employer but a higher base wage does. Tying payroll taxes, insurance, unemployment directly to hourly pay/salary has really been the wage depressor.