Wine tasting - what's the point ?
Feb 21, 2010, 12:42 pm
#1
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Wine tasting - what's the point ?
I like wine, but I'm no wine expert. Therefore this is a genuine question rather than a statement.
If I'm in a restaurant or eating on a flight and order some wine, most of the time the waiter/waitress will pour a little bit in the glass for me to taste first. Why ?
If it's to check that the wine doesn't have anything wrong with it, then surely it doesn't matter how much has been poured into the glass - it has to go back.
If it's to check whether you like the wine or not, then are they implying that it's ok to request a different bottle of wine just because you don't like the first bottle ?, even though it was wine that you chose from the menu and there's nothing wrong with it (other than you don't like it) ?
I could understand if you had asked for a recommendation and it was not what you expected. For example, you'd asked for a dry white and it tasted like dessert wine.
So my question is; is the tasting to decide:
a) if there's something wrong with the wine , or
b) whether you like it or not.
If it's b, then is it acceptable to return a perfectly good bottle of wine just because you don't like it ?
For information, I never bother tasting the wine and usually ask them to just pour it (and yes I'm occasionally disappointed, but I can count on one hand the number of corked/bad bottles I've had - and I probably eat out around 75 - 100 times a year). I seem to be in the monority though, looking around me in a restaurant, most people seem to taste first then ask for it to be poured.
If I'm in a restaurant or eating on a flight and order some wine, most of the time the waiter/waitress will pour a little bit in the glass for me to taste first. Why ?
If it's to check that the wine doesn't have anything wrong with it, then surely it doesn't matter how much has been poured into the glass - it has to go back.
If it's to check whether you like the wine or not, then are they implying that it's ok to request a different bottle of wine just because you don't like the first bottle ?, even though it was wine that you chose from the menu and there's nothing wrong with it (other than you don't like it) ?
I could understand if you had asked for a recommendation and it was not what you expected. For example, you'd asked for a dry white and it tasted like dessert wine.
So my question is; is the tasting to decide:
a) if there's something wrong with the wine , or
b) whether you like it or not.
If it's b, then is it acceptable to return a perfectly good bottle of wine just because you don't like it ?
For information, I never bother tasting the wine and usually ask them to just pour it (and yes I'm occasionally disappointed, but I can count on one hand the number of corked/bad bottles I've had - and I probably eat out around 75 - 100 times a year). I seem to be in the monority though, looking around me in a restaurant, most people seem to taste first then ask for it to be poured.
Feb 21, 2010, 1:01 pm
#2
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It has been done to avoid someone drinking wine with "cork". The taste of the cork used to close the bottle can be transmitted and makes the wine taste quite bad.
Modern cork is no longer cork, but rather plastic. Then its show, in my opinion.
If you order an expensive bottle, lets say some Margaux usually no one expects you to accept and pay for a wine that doesnīt taste as it should. Most wine stores /whole sales have return policies for bad bottles, so that it doesnīt cost the restaurant anything. If its really expensive, it on your own risk!
Otherwise, if itīs a rather normal wine and you choose from a menu, it might be done to let you try the wine first before ordering a whole bottle or more.
And no, once a cork ends up inside a bottle of MR due to inexperience of the waiter, you donīt have to accept to drink and pay for some filtered, then poured into a decanter 1982 MR wine!
Generally, I think it has been the spiel so long, it will stay that way for ever.
Modern cork is no longer cork, but rather plastic. Then its show, in my opinion.
If you order an expensive bottle, lets say some Margaux usually no one expects you to accept and pay for a wine that doesnīt taste as it should. Most wine stores /whole sales have return policies for bad bottles, so that it doesnīt cost the restaurant anything. If its really expensive, it on your own risk!
Otherwise, if itīs a rather normal wine and you choose from a menu, it might be done to let you try the wine first before ordering a whole bottle or more.
And no, once a cork ends up inside a bottle of MR due to inexperience of the waiter, you donīt have to accept to drink and pay for some filtered, then poured into a decanter 1982 MR wine!
Generally, I think it has been the spiel so long, it will stay that way for ever.
Last edited by SwissCircle; Feb 21, 2010 at 1:06 pm Reason: content
Feb 21, 2010, 1:03 pm
#3
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I actually prefer to try a sip before I buy it. About 20% of the time I decline more and ask for a different wine to sip before ordering. There are zillions of wines out there, quality varies by lot and year and it is rare to find familiar wines at many restaurants.........especially the ones I prefer.
MisterNice
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Feb 21, 2010, 1:10 pm
#4
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The entire process is to make sure the wine is not bad, it's not to let you decide if you like it or not.
They should present you the bottle, you would check to make sure it's what you ordered, say for example they did not grab a different year then what you wanted.
They should then remove the cork, and if it's a red wine give that to you for inspection. You look to see if the cork is labeled with the wineries name (if you know it should be) if it's not then you probably have a refilled bottle. Some people smell the cork to see if it's bad, others look for the amount of sediment on the cork, and if the cork is dry, that means the wine was not stored on it's side, and it may not be what you were thinking it was.
They will then pour you a bit of wine. You want to smell to make sure it has not become vinegar, you won't want any musty cork odor, and unless it's a very old wine, it should not be cloudy but clear.
You then take a sip and make sure it doesn't have that musty corked taste, and then let them know it's a keeper.
But the only reason to refuse it would be if the wine is bad, if you don't like it, but it's not defective, you are pretty much stuck with it.
If the restaurant serves the same wine by the glass, there's a good chance they will let you sample it first before you end up with an entire bottle you are not happy with.
They should present you the bottle, you would check to make sure it's what you ordered, say for example they did not grab a different year then what you wanted.
They should then remove the cork, and if it's a red wine give that to you for inspection. You look to see if the cork is labeled with the wineries name (if you know it should be) if it's not then you probably have a refilled bottle. Some people smell the cork to see if it's bad, others look for the amount of sediment on the cork, and if the cork is dry, that means the wine was not stored on it's side, and it may not be what you were thinking it was.
They will then pour you a bit of wine. You want to smell to make sure it has not become vinegar, you won't want any musty cork odor, and unless it's a very old wine, it should not be cloudy but clear.
You then take a sip and make sure it doesn't have that musty corked taste, and then let them know it's a keeper.
But the only reason to refuse it would be if the wine is bad, if you don't like it, but it's not defective, you are pretty much stuck with it.
If the restaurant serves the same wine by the glass, there's a good chance they will let you sample it first before you end up with an entire bottle you are not happy with.
Feb 21, 2010, 1:20 pm
#5
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Wine is the ultimate bollocks.
You've only got to read some of the cobblers on here to understand that it's a gigantic con trick to suck in the emotionally retarded.
A bottle of wine is just six glasses of crushed grapes fermented.
Some are better than others but rather like one car is more comfortable than another ultimately they're just a means of getting you to a certain place.
The rest is just hype, marketing and BS.
You've only got to read some of the cobblers on here to understand that it's a gigantic con trick to suck in the emotionally retarded.
A bottle of wine is just six glasses of crushed grapes fermented.
Some are better than others but rather like one car is more comfortable than another ultimately they're just a means of getting you to a certain place.
The rest is just hype, marketing and BS.
Feb 21, 2010, 1:29 pm
#6
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Wine is the ultimate bollocks.
You've only got to read some of the cobblers on here to understand that it's a gigantic con trick to suck in the emotionally retarded.
A bottle of wine is just six glasses of crushed grapes fermented.
Some are better than others but rather like one car is more comfortable than another ultimately they're just a means of getting you to a certain place.
The rest is just hype, marketing and BS.
You've only got to read some of the cobblers on here to understand that it's a gigantic con trick to suck in the emotionally retarded.
A bottle of wine is just six glasses of crushed grapes fermented.
Some are better than others but rather like one car is more comfortable than another ultimately they're just a means of getting you to a certain place.
The rest is just hype, marketing and BS.
And you donīt have to be emotionally retarded as you implement here and accuse other of being so, just because they appear to enjoy a nice wine! Thatīs totally uncalled for! Manners?
Have you ever had a rare and really looked after wine? If you did so, you could / would understand that it might just be six glasses, but those six glasses taste like "heaven".
Feb 21, 2010, 1:52 pm
#7
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There's more to wine than the showbiz person imagines (his/her vehemence
bespeaks someone who hasn't got a palate but is jealous of those who might), but
most of the people who make a show out of the stuff are in fact just pretending.
As far as "corked" wine goes, it doesn't mean that there's cork or the taste
of cork: the term refers to a particular flavor that is "once tasted, never
forgotten." It was at one time ascribed to defective closures, but I've had
wines bottled with plastic closures that have this particular quality, which
has been likened to wet dog, cardboard, and other savory things.
There are a couple other defects that I think allow a wine to be sent back:
oxidized (pretty common among older and badly stored wines); vinegary
(rare, despite the etymology).
bespeaks someone who hasn't got a palate but is jealous of those who might), but
most of the people who make a show out of the stuff are in fact just pretending.
As far as "corked" wine goes, it doesn't mean that there's cork or the taste
of cork: the term refers to a particular flavor that is "once tasted, never
forgotten." It was at one time ascribed to defective closures, but I've had
wines bottled with plastic closures that have this particular quality, which
has been likened to wet dog, cardboard, and other savory things.
There are a couple other defects that I think allow a wine to be sent back:
oxidized (pretty common among older and badly stored wines); vinegary
(rare, despite the etymology).
Feb 21, 2010, 2:34 pm
#8
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I think if you've ever tasted a wine that has gone off, you'd appreciate the exercise... 
As said though, it's to test whether the wine has gone bad, not to see if you like it.
On a related note... Some red wines taste better a few minutes after it's been opened - I believe the 'technical' term is to let it breathe a bit (presumably let it react with the oxygen in the air). If you taste it straight out of a new bottle, wouldn't it adversely affect the taste?
As said though, it's to test whether the wine has gone bad, not to see if you like it.On a related note... Some red wines taste better a few minutes after it's been opened - I believe the 'technical' term is to let it breathe a bit (presumably let it react with the oxygen in the air). If you taste it straight out of a new bottle, wouldn't it adversely affect the taste?
Feb 21, 2010, 3:31 pm
#9
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No one has mentioned temperature so far. I will only send back a wine I chose if it has a genuine defect--cork, oxidization, heat damage. I often ask to have the temperature adjusted, though. If I'm having a good red at any point in the meal, I'll order it along with the first wine, so that it can have time to come up to temp if necessary. Occasionally in the summer I encounter a red that has no heat damage but is too warm. I'll have it chilled briefly to correct that.
Feb 21, 2010, 5:48 pm
#10
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There's more to wine than the showbiz person imagines (his/her vehemence
bespeaks someone who hasn't got a palate but is jealous of those who might), but
most of the people who make a show out of the stuff are in fact just pretending.
As far as "corked" wine goes, it doesn't mean that there's cork or the taste
of cork: the term refers to a particular flavor that is "once tasted, never
forgotten." It was at one time ascribed to defective closures, but I've had
wines bottled with plastic closures that have this particular quality, which
has been likened to wet dog, cardboard, and other savory things.
There are a couple other defects that I think allow a wine to be sent back:
oxidized (pretty common among older and badly stored wines); vinegary
(rare, despite the etymology).
bespeaks someone who hasn't got a palate but is jealous of those who might), but
most of the people who make a show out of the stuff are in fact just pretending.
As far as "corked" wine goes, it doesn't mean that there's cork or the taste
of cork: the term refers to a particular flavor that is "once tasted, never
forgotten." It was at one time ascribed to defective closures, but I've had
wines bottled with plastic closures that have this particular quality, which
has been likened to wet dog, cardboard, and other savory things.
There are a couple other defects that I think allow a wine to be sent back:
oxidized (pretty common among older and badly stored wines); vinegary
(rare, despite the etymology).
That's just the sort of half-baked winey nonsense I was on about.
I've had wine costing a few euros out of an industrial-sized vat in a dusty roadside bodegas in Spain that's gone into an empty half-gallon milk container that has been far superior to any hundred dollar piece of Napa Valley hype.
American wine buffs actually believe their own nonsense whereas the French know they're just continuing a centuries-old con trick.
But the best example of all is Australia. They steam-rollered the traditional French dominance of the market by producing cheap,fruity drinkable plonk that everyone loved.
And then they got ideas above their station, put up the price and produced bespoke this and boutique that.
Result ? The Chileans sneaked in unnoticed. And that's why they produce the best good,cheap,fruity plonk loved the world over.
Snobby wine is a con originated by wine makers and promoted by restauranters to artificially hike up the value of average plonk and thus their profits.
Feb 21, 2010, 5:54 pm
#11
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Noticing the OP is based in the UK, I'd be interested to know if your experience in these 'taste check' servings is primarily of wines of a certain country and if they are mainly red wines with corks - and the age of the vintages that you buy.
I ask because an interesting cultural difference is the tradition and prevalence of cork these days. In Australia/New Zealand, the Stelvin alumin(i)um closure has been tested, provben and used for at least five years, initially on whites and now almost always on all but the top reds, too, in order to eliminate almost all the spoilage previously attributed to corks.
Many red wines exported from down under are sold under cork (to US/UK/Ireland etc) even though they are much more popular now in their home markets under a twist cap!
My other point is that now that the cork is history (for us anyway, 80% of the time), we still have the taste test tradition, to ensure that the buyer/tryer is happy with the condition of the bottle of wine (as opposed to just liking the taste).
We're still enjoying some Hunter shiraz from 2002, still under cork.
So far, bottles from this case of wine has been OK, but one other red also from 2002 had a tainted cork on one we opened on NY Day.
I ask because an interesting cultural difference is the tradition and prevalence of cork these days. In Australia/New Zealand, the Stelvin alumin(i)um closure has been tested, provben and used for at least five years, initially on whites and now almost always on all but the top reds, too, in order to eliminate almost all the spoilage previously attributed to corks.
Many red wines exported from down under are sold under cork (to US/UK/Ireland etc) even though they are much more popular now in their home markets under a twist cap!
My other point is that now that the cork is history (for us anyway, 80% of the time), we still have the taste test tradition, to ensure that the buyer/tryer is happy with the condition of the bottle of wine (as opposed to just liking the taste).
We're still enjoying some Hunter shiraz from 2002, still under cork.
So far, bottles from this case of wine has been OK, but one other red also from 2002 had a tainted cork on one we opened on NY Day.
Feb 21, 2010, 6:09 pm
#12
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Feb 21, 2010, 6:12 pm
#13
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Feb 21, 2010, 7:27 pm
#14
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Wirelessly posted (Nokia N97 / Palm TX: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows 98; PalmSource/Palm-D050; Blazer/4.3) 16;320x448)
I love this thread.....
I love this thread.....
Feb 21, 2010, 8:59 pm
#15
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 3
It has been done to avoid someone drinking wine with "cork". The taste of the cork used to close the bottle can be transmitted and makes the wine taste quite bad.
Modern cork is no longer cork, but rather plastic. Then its show, in my opinion.
If you order an expensive bottle, lets say some Margaux usually no one expects you to accept and pay for a wine that doesnīt taste as it should. Most wine stores /whole sales have return policies for bad bottles, so that it doesnīt cost the restaurant anything. If its really expensive, it on your own risk!
Otherwise, if itīs a rather normal wine and you choose from a menu, it might be done to let you try the wine first before ordering a whole bottle or more.
And no, once a cork ends up inside a bottle of MR due to inexperience of the waiter, you donīt have to accept to drink and pay for some filtered, then poured into a decanter 1982 MR wine!
Generally, I think it has been the spiel so long, it will stay that way for ever.
Modern cork is no longer cork, but rather plastic. Then its show, in my opinion.
If you order an expensive bottle, lets say some Margaux usually no one expects you to accept and pay for a wine that doesnīt taste as it should. Most wine stores /whole sales have return policies for bad bottles, so that it doesnīt cost the restaurant anything. If its really expensive, it on your own risk!
Otherwise, if itīs a rather normal wine and you choose from a menu, it might be done to let you try the wine first before ordering a whole bottle or more.
And no, once a cork ends up inside a bottle of MR due to inexperience of the waiter, you donīt have to accept to drink and pay for some filtered, then poured into a decanter 1982 MR wine!
Generally, I think it has been the spiel so long, it will stay that way for ever.
Wine faults are numerous, from improper storage, heat damage, improper sealing mechanism (corks, real and synthetic, screw caps...). As a wine collector, the most common defect I encounter is cork "taint" known as TCA.
2,4,6-trichloroanisole (TCA) imparts a moldy, wet cardboard sort of taste/smell. There are varying degrees of taint that affect people differently. I've been to tastings with people who know a lot about wine and find that for the same bottle, some find it undrinkable while others find it, at worst, mildly less than ideal.
When served wine in a rest. it typically takes me more than just the initial taste to be absolutely certain that the wine is okay.