$50 2nd Checked Bag Fee on Intl Flights Effective 1 July
Apr 21, 2009, 2:30 pm
#106
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: ORD
Programs: DL FO...ex-PM, GM...does it really even matter these days? LOL...
Posts: 1,248
Even if I was not a PM, I'd be fine with this new fee. If I want to check a 2nd bag, then I'll pay. If I don't want to pay, then I wont bring a 2nd bag. Easy.
This move is about three things: 1) generating revenue, 2) cutting costs (less checked bags=less counter agents needed + less baggage handling resources needed + less fuel burned), and 3) the re-education of the American consumer as we move towards un-bundling fares. After the base fare and taxes, you pay for what you want/use/need, nothing else.
This move is about three things: 1) generating revenue, 2) cutting costs (less checked bags=less counter agents needed + less baggage handling resources needed + less fuel burned), and 3) the re-education of the American consumer as we move towards un-bundling fares. After the base fare and taxes, you pay for what you want/use/need, nothing else.
Apr 21, 2009, 2:33 pm
#107
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Due to DL's own self-commoditizing approach to its own business offerings, DL is generally lacking extra pricing power and even undermining its residual ability to differentiate. DL hopes to make up for its own failings to acquire extra pricing power on its own by making up for it in sorts through government-approved scaling up and cartelization of the industry. What DL doesn't get is that size alone cannot save DL -- it might even bring about its end faster -- and that a cartel is subject to cartel members cheating and invites new competition, perhaps even competition with a lower cost basis that DL cannot but dream of emulating.
Apr 21, 2009, 2:41 pm
#108
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Even if I was not a PM, I'd be fine with this new fee. If I want to check a 2nd bag, then I'll pay. If I don't want to pay, then I wont bring a 2nd bag. Easy.
This move is about three things: 1) generating revenue, 2) cutting costs (less checked bags=less counter agents needed + less baggage handling resources needed + less fuel burned), and 3) the re-education of the American consumer as we move towards un-bundling fares. After the base fare and taxes, you pay for what you want/use/need, nothing else.
This move is about three things: 1) generating revenue, 2) cutting costs (less checked bags=less counter agents needed + less baggage handling resources needed + less fuel burned), and 3) the re-education of the American consumer as we move towards un-bundling fares. After the base fare and taxes, you pay for what you want/use/need, nothing else.
Apr 21, 2009, 2:45 pm
#109
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 196
it's just a matter of time until the likes of DL charges for the use of the bathroom on the flight too.
Welcome to Delta Airlines where the airline management team would consider pay-per-use in-flight toilets if they thought enough of their competition would follow it like lemmings.
Welcome to Delta Airlines where the airline management team would consider pay-per-use in-flight toilets if they thought enough of their competition would follow it like lemmings.
The unbundling concept is breathtakingly cynical. The whole point about this is that they think people will be too stupid or careless to notice that the $5 air fare which they think is so cheap suddenly multiplies into $200 because of all the add-ons (charges at booking like YQ, then charges at and after check-in for bags, meals, drink, the bathroom, etc). Where you go to checkout at Safeway, they don't suddenly say, "Oh, we now have to add on the charge for the gas to get your groceries to the store, and ah yes, you have to pay for lighting the store, because after all the price we showed by the bananas is just the cost of the fruit." Just think if every business in the country operated like this....
Apr 21, 2009, 3:05 pm
#110
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Denver, CO, USA
Programs: Sometimes known as [ARG:6 UNDEFINED]
Posts: 26,830
Ryanair got there first: http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009...-toilet-charge
The unbundling concept is breathtakingly cynical. The whole point about this is that they think people will be too stupid or careless to notice that the $5 air fare which they think is so cheap suddenly multiplies into $200 because of all the add-ons (charges at booking like YQ, then charges at and after check-in for bags, meals, drink, the bathroom, etc). Where you go to checkout at Safeway, they don't suddenly say, "Oh, we now have to add on the charge for the gas to get your groceries to the store, and ah yes, you have to pay for lighting the store, because after all the price we showed by the bananas is just the cost of the fruit." Just think if every business in the country operated like this....
The unbundling concept is breathtakingly cynical. The whole point about this is that they think people will be too stupid or careless to notice that the $5 air fare which they think is so cheap suddenly multiplies into $200 because of all the add-ons (charges at booking like YQ, then charges at and after check-in for bags, meals, drink, the bathroom, etc). Where you go to checkout at Safeway, they don't suddenly say, "Oh, we now have to add on the charge for the gas to get your groceries to the store, and ah yes, you have to pay for lighting the store, because after all the price we showed by the bananas is just the cost of the fruit." Just think if every business in the country operated like this....
The truly frightening part about the whole unbundling thing with the airlines (and I don't know why we'd single out DL, they're neither better nor worse than most any domestic airline at unbundling)...people seem to be accepting it.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:05 pm
#111
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 196
But this is not what is happening. Okay, you could say that a second checked bag is a luxury (50 pounds of clothes can keep you going for a while) but how on earth is charging a fuel surcharge "paying for what you need"? The plane needs fuel to go in the sky. It's part of the basic service you are buying. The whole unbundling concept is not about simply charging people who can then exercise genuine choice about whether or not to buy the product.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:09 pm
#112
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 196
Well, one way to think about it is that Safeway already operates like this. You're free to enter the store and walk around to your heart's content. Look at stuff, compare store brands to name brands, even sneak a peek at a magazine or two. You only pay for the items you choose/need/want at checkout.]
Apr 21, 2009, 3:11 pm
#113
Join Date: Mar 2008
Programs: Hilton HHonors Gold
Posts: 12
Really? I already can see by the responses so far that most (not all) are not going to take to kindly to this new fee. All i can say is Really? I mean how many Medallions/Elites out there actually check two bags when going overseas? If traveling international, everything one needs for a week can be fit into one bag. I also must ask you to watch the folks in front or behind you the next time your checking in at a hub where there is a designated Biz/First class line. Most of the folks in line are Medallions/Elites going overseas for w/e reason. Ninety-eight percent will have one bag or even just a carry on. Than look over at the other lines (coach check in) you will find a few people standing in line with about 10-15 bags around them. Those are the folks in which as far as i can see DL is trying to gain the revenue from. These people traveling to nigeria, manilla, etc. carrying back goods and they may put up a fight about it but they will pay. Why you ask? Becuase they will gladly make the money back when they resell the goods in w/e country they are going to. No need to get upset about this, its a money maker in a down time.
Yes and im now ready to burn.....
Apr 21, 2009, 3:12 pm
#114
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,093
What the airlines really need to do is to introduce some sort of premium economy (or "premium service package") which includes meals and baggage. Charge a bit higher (i.e. for domestic trips, maybe charge an extra $50-$70) and include what you used to get (2 bags each way and a meal/snack as appropriate). If they didn't charge some huge premium, people might actually buy this. Or at least people wouldn't be angry b/c they would feel like they were getting a decent value. This is basically what Air Canada does, although I think that they charge too much of a premium (but I think they link it with changes in fare rules).
Apr 21, 2009, 3:12 pm
#115
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: MSP
Programs: Fallen Plats, ex-WN CP, DYKWIW; still PAL Premier Elite & Hilton Diamond
Posts: 25,419
Ryanair got there first: http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2009...-toilet-charge
The unbundling concept is breathtakingly cynical. The whole point about this is that they think people will be too stupid or careless to notice that the $5 air fare which they think is so cheap suddenly multiplies into $200 because of all the add-ons (charges at booking like YQ, then charges at and after check-in for bags, meals, drink, the bathroom, etc). Where you go to checkout at Safeway, they don't suddenly say, "Oh, we now have to add on the charge for the gas to get your groceries to the store, and ah yes, you have to pay for lighting the store, because after all the price we showed by the bananas is just the cost of the fruit." Just think if every business in the country operated like this....
The unbundling concept is breathtakingly cynical. The whole point about this is that they think people will be too stupid or careless to notice that the $5 air fare which they think is so cheap suddenly multiplies into $200 because of all the add-ons (charges at booking like YQ, then charges at and after check-in for bags, meals, drink, the bathroom, etc). Where you go to checkout at Safeway, they don't suddenly say, "Oh, we now have to add on the charge for the gas to get your groceries to the store, and ah yes, you have to pay for lighting the store, because after all the price we showed by the bananas is just the cost of the fruit." Just think if every business in the country operated like this....
Lavs are still free on Ryan Air.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:14 pm
#116
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: SEA
Posts: 12,485
I'm not sure what credit card company you disputed a baggage charge with, but in my experience (on both ends of the merchant processing relationship) a charge will only be reversed for a consumer if the service was not provided. Flight times and schedules are not guaranteed for passengers or baggage and claims for delays in delivery of baggage would be difficult for the claimant or processor to defend.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:14 pm
#117
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 2,093
Really? I already can see by the responses so far that most (not all) are not going to take to kindly to this new fee. All i can say is Really? I mean how many Medallions/Elites out there actually check two bags when going overseas? If traveling international, everything one needs for a week can be fit into one bag. I also must ask you to watch the folks in front or behind you the next time your checking in at a hub where there is a designated Biz/First class line. Most of the folks in line are Medallions/Elites going overseas for w/e reason. Ninety-eight percent will have one bag or even just a carry on. Than look over at the other lines (coach check in) you will find a few people standing in line with about 10-15 bags around them. Those are the folks in which as far as i can see DL is trying to gain the revenue from. These people traveling to nigeria, manilla, etc. carrying back goods and they may put up a fight about it but they will pay. Why you ask? Becuase they will gladly make the money back when they resell the goods in w/e country they are going to. No need to get upset about this, its a money maker in a down time.
Yes and im now ready to burn.....
Yes and im now ready to burn.....
Apr 21, 2009, 3:16 pm
#118
Join Date: Mar 2008
Programs: Hilton HHonors Gold
Posts: 12
Its probably cheaper to pay for the bag than to do laundry and/or send it out with a service.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:17 pm
#119
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: SEA
Posts: 12,485
Due to DL's own self-commoditizing approach to its own business offerings, DL is generally lacking extra pricing power and even undermining its residual ability to differentiate. DL hopes to make up for its own failings to acquire extra pricing power on its own by making up for it in sorts through government-approved scaling up and cartelization of the industry. What DL doesn't get is that size alone cannot save DL -- it might even bring about its end faster -- and that a cartel is subject to cartel members cheating and invites new competition, perhaps even competition with a lower cost basis that DL cannot but dream of emulating.
Apr 21, 2009, 3:17 pm
#120
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: LIS/ATL/other
Programs: UA 1K, Avis PC, Hertz PC, Sixt Plat, Marriott Gold, HH Silver
Posts: 1,983
Can't be that hard. The passenger would have a receipt and a bag tag. The bag tag would say something like DL123 ATL-XYZ on 02JUL. It seems pretty clear cut that if the bag does not make that specific flight then the service as paid for was no delivered.