exwannabe

I am 100% certain that the US is not using the data from this, nor the fingerprint scan pilot program, nor GE nor the Pre program to track US citizens.

It is all for our good. They are only tracking the evil do-ers.

Relax GU, all will work out for the best.

But you might want to cover your head in case any of those pigs flying drop on you :-)

indufan

Dream on.

MSPeconomist

I see the priority bags being messed up on international flights arriving in the USA all the time. Most of the rest of the time, when I check a bag, it's delivered very promptly.

GUWonder

The priority tags are usesful for when there are some kinds of baggage irregularity, but priority markers can be placed on the printed baggage tags without affixing a tag to the baggage routing tag.

The fact is that the tracking done is not limited to only tracking the mythical "evil do-ers". And the biometrics are increasingly used to monitor and even control US citizens' movements.

As I am pretty much immune to flying pigs and keep my eyes wide open, your recommendation for me is going to remain inapplicable to me.

flyerCO

MSP is also getting automated bag drops. You'll apply the tag, and send it down the belt at one kiosk.

runninaway

Mercy. First off, there are actually people that do evil things, ipso facto they are not mythical. They don't really need biometrics to track our movements since they have our photo ID, passport, DOB, gender, address etc. associated with our travels documents which are all exponentially easier to index than biometric data. Also, there's nothing about this program that change anything one iota since our photos (and facial recognition data) are already in their database with our drivers licenses or passport.

Aside from the do-not-fly list, how exactly do you assert that our movements are being controlled?

Travel safe and don't let the tinfoil hat get crushed if you stow it in the overhead bin.

GUWonder

I've flown millions of miles and it's apparently been safe enough even without this monitoring and controlling technology.

"Evil" is myth-based, as the concept of "evil" is fundamentally religious and devoid of scientific proof of existence; and to seek protection from "evil" or mythical "evil-do'ers" still involves the ancient version of the tinfoil hat even if that "protection" has "modern" believers with some of their own "advanced" adaptions of what "protects"

While there are actual and potential criminal and other actors which may be engaged in legal violations of various sorts when flying or trying to fly, the use of biometrics to monitor and control passengers is not limited to just that segment of the population wanting to fly; nor is the development, implementation and operation of such necessarily a great return on use of money that almost certainly results in increased costs in the aggregate, especially given the opportunity cost of such "protection" and the other negative outcomes that may come with the implementation.

FRT use at airports is no panacea -- rather look at the mess it helped make more extreme at places that went to automated passport control relying upon FRT.

AllieKat

What do you mean? Automated passport control is one of the best travel inventions ever. Seconds, no queue - easy peasy. I love it.

GUWonder

No queue? If only. The fact is that I see some lines at automated passport control kiosks more days than not -- whether at US airports or EU airports. And there are plenty of photos even on that thing called the internet to show that there are lines to use them that even grab some attention..

MPC is even better than APC and even GE when it comes to border crossings where all three choices are applicable to me -- if wanting a lower chance of having a queue/wait.

Where FRT has gone into place at airports for border control purposes, the variance in lines/wait times has ballooned big time after that goes live.

When US airlines put in place self-service check-in kiosks, the claim was that passenger check-in lines would be a relic of the past. No more check-in lines even when I'm flying DL domestically? If only. The fact is that there are still lines and the variance in time to get passenger and/or bags checked is more extreme now than before the kiosks, the people and processes around automated kiosks were fully changed so as to give us the current state process.

When self-use kiosk works well, it works for me; and when it doesn't work well, it's worse than ever before for me.

AllieKat

I don't know half those acronyms, but note that when I said what I said, I'm NOT referring to the sorry excuse for a system the US implemented where you have to answer a bunch of questions and then present a receipt to two officers. That's not automated, it's having people answer questions on a darn touchscreen.

I'm referring to the British system, which generally has no queue, and at most is only a couple minutes when VERY busy at the airport. No questions, no people. Scan passport, look at camera, walk through. Done. That is automated.

The US system is not automated. It's electronic, but not automated.

MSPeconomist

I always see lines for the automated electronic passport gates (for some EU passports) at CDG when I'm flying back to the USA. I also see people trying to use them and then being forced to go back and join the regular line.

rucksack

+1

I've used the UK ePassport gates via the Registered Traveller program and it's great. You literally just scan you passport, step into a glass enclosure, and once your identify is verified via biometrics, the gates swing open and you're on your way.

GUWonder

GE = Global Entry
MPC = mobile passport control
APC = automated passport control

So you admit that the British border control's automated passport control kiosks do have lines/wait times? I'm at LHR a few times a week, and more often than not, I get into the UK faster by avoiding the automated passport control kiosks and instead choosing to use the staffed counters.

You've never heard about the 30+ minute wait times for EU citizens using the APC kiosks at LHR?

rucksack

Every time I've flown into Heathrow and used the "All Passports" line, I've had to wait at least 15 minutes, if not up to an hour. I never waited more than a few minutes for the ePassport gates.

That's not to say there's couldn't be a wait for ePassport gates, but that wouldn't be a flaw in the efficiency of the system; it would be a flaw in the capacity of the system.

AllieKat

I've never had to wait more than maybe two-three minutes, certainly nothing like 30+. Even if the queue appears far, far longer, remember it moves very fast - typically at a slow walking pace, as each scan only takes maybe 30 seconds, and there are enough lanes the whole queue backed up all the way would clear in just a couple minutes.

I've only ever even seen that once, usually the longest part of the process is walking through the empty queue barriers

Now, the US system, it's pointless. It's the same as before, two officers (one immigration and one customs) check and question you, nothing is automated really. The only new thing is you fill in the customs form on a touchscreen. Useless.