China Southern or China Eastern
Sep 10, 2015, 2:26 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lake Villa, IL
Posts: 79
China Southern or China Eastern
Hello,
We are looking to book some awards seats business class, last time we were able to book V Australia but this time I am only coming up with China Southern via CAN or DL connections to China Eastern in PVG, and I have been checking out even as far as 9 months and still come up with the same results. I was getting options for Korean Air but I havent seen those flight options for a while now, this was before we were ready to book.
My wife is nervous about flying a China carrier, your thoughts?
We are looking to book some awards seats business class, last time we were able to book V Australia but this time I am only coming up with China Southern via CAN or DL connections to China Eastern in PVG, and I have been checking out even as far as 9 months and still come up with the same results. I was getting options for Korean Air but I havent seen those flight options for a while now, this was before we were ready to book.
My wife is nervous about flying a China carrier, your thoughts?
Sep 10, 2015, 2:57 pm
#2
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CZ has better customer service than MU and is considered to be the best of the mainland Chinese airlines. They have lots of nice new planes, but the airport facilities and lounges can be disappointing.
On their domestic flights, FC or business class seats seem like nice new versions of USA legacy carriers' domestic FC seats, but they also give you a nice pair of slippers. Don't expect much from F&B: two hot main course choices, both Asian, Chinese beer, and indifferent red/white wine served in very small amounts.
It's perhaps irrational, but I don't fly Air China (*A).
On their domestic flights, FC or business class seats seem like nice new versions of USA legacy carriers' domestic FC seats, but they also give you a nice pair of slippers. Don't expect much from F&B: two hot main course choices, both Asian, Chinese beer, and indifferent red/white wine served in very small amounts.
It's perhaps irrational, but I don't fly Air China (*A).
Sep 10, 2015, 5:34 pm
#4
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Why is she nervous? Safety? Unfamiliar experience?
Korean Air availability seems to be down to at most one seat per flight. This changed in the last few months - availability, especially for 2 or more passengers, really disappeared.
Korean Air availability seems to be down to at most one seat per flight. This changed in the last few months - availability, especially for 2 or more passengers, really disappeared.
Sep 10, 2015, 6:23 pm
#5
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: It's hot here
Posts: 4,285
I'm booked on both for next April to and from Australia. I had the same experience.. I saw VA and KE while browsing, but never again when I was actually ready to book. I think I was just looking at one ticket and not at two. I can find their awards here and there, but rarely for two people together it seems.
I did a lot of reading around the net and on here and am at ease about the choice. A fellow FT'er just did the SYD>PVG>LAX flight last week and enjoyed it.
I did a lot of reading around the net and on here and am at ease about the choice. A fellow FT'er just did the SYD>PVG>LAX flight last week and enjoyed it.
Sep 10, 2015, 8:08 pm
#6
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lake Villa, IL
Posts: 79
I'm booked on both for next April to and from Australia. I had the same experience.. I saw VA and KE while browsing, but never again when I was actually ready to book. I think I was just looking at one ticket and not at two. I can find their awards here and there, but rarely for two people together it seems.
I did a lot of reading around the net and on here and am at ease about the choice. A fellow FT'er just did the SYD>PVG>LAX flight last week and enjoyed it.
I did a lot of reading around the net and on here and am at ease about the choice. A fellow FT'er just did the SYD>PVG>LAX flight last week and enjoyed it.
Sep 10, 2015, 8:11 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lake Villa, IL
Posts: 79
But every ones post have helped... Thank you
Sep 10, 2015, 8:48 pm
#8
Join Date: Sep 2009
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Posts: 7,205
If all goes well the experience should be a pleasant one: good in flight service, new aircraft, etc. with both CZ and MU.
However, transit at PVG can be a pain, as most likely (but not always) you have to exit and "enter" China and get a TWOV stamp, only to go upstairs and "exit" it right after. (Waste of time and hassle.) I've seen a direct transit line there, but it's been never open when I've been there at least.
In case of irrops, both CZ and MU are pretty bad. If you miss a connection, then it can get ugly quick: no help from CZ or MU, immigration won't let you into China without a printed out hotel booking and onward flights printed out ticket, but CZ/MU will say you must go out to ticketing to get that done - a catch 22.
Don't mean to scare you. Transit via China is fine, and hopefully better now than last time I did that. Barring delays or other issues (and you are not going through PEK, so that's at least good), it'll be perfectly fine, just a bit of a hassle at PVG transit. However, in case of irrops, then it can be stressful and a difficult situation as it's all on you to resolve the situation and meet the often irrational demands of the airlines and China immigration.
However, transit at PVG can be a pain, as most likely (but not always) you have to exit and "enter" China and get a TWOV stamp, only to go upstairs and "exit" it right after. (Waste of time and hassle.) I've seen a direct transit line there, but it's been never open when I've been there at least.
In case of irrops, both CZ and MU are pretty bad. If you miss a connection, then it can get ugly quick: no help from CZ or MU, immigration won't let you into China without a printed out hotel booking and onward flights printed out ticket, but CZ/MU will say you must go out to ticketing to get that done - a catch 22.
Don't mean to scare you. Transit via China is fine, and hopefully better now than last time I did that. Barring delays or other issues (and you are not going through PEK, so that's at least good), it'll be perfectly fine, just a bit of a hassle at PVG transit. However, in case of irrops, then it can be stressful and a difficult situation as it's all on you to resolve the situation and meet the often irrational demands of the airlines and China immigration.
Sep 11, 2015, 1:11 am
#9
FlyerTalk Evangelist & Ambassador: China
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She is worried about safety, the unfamiliarity and worries of connecting through China, like I told her we arent leaving the airport we dont need visas for China just Australia, and the biggest worry she says is the language barrier. I said which I could be wrong is there will be a little bit of a barrier but not much.
But every ones post have helped... Thank you
But every ones post have helped... Thank you
Sep 11, 2015, 9:51 am
#10
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Here
Posts: 224
I have flown both CZ and MU extensively throughout China. I prefer CZ to MU, but that is just me.
If you have SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus, you can use the VIP Check in lanes/area. Very nice and very accommodating. I have even brought colleagues with me who did not have the status, and they were treated with the same respect and courtesy.
In my experience, the FAs for both airlines speak some basic English and are attentive.
Seats in economy are tighter than in the US, with typically 6 across. Face it, the Chinese are generally smaller. BC seats are generally like domestic BC seats (2x2), although once on a CZ flight from PEK to CAN there were lie-flats. There are NO automatic upgrades in China.
Meals in BC are served on real plates and are quite good; in economy the selections are generally OK, but may be strange to the uninitiated.
If you are originating within China, arrive at the airport early. Seats are assigned during check in and it is early arrivals at the front (by class) - later gets the back of the plane. Do not be worried if you get a row in the upper 30s or low 40s - Economy starts at row 30.
In general, get to your gate early. If there is a jetway, boarding is a mob scene. If it is a bus gate, there may be a smaller bus with seats for BC and people with status. However, a recent flight to/from PEK on MU had everyone in a large standing bus.
Connecting in China is sometimes a pain, but one time last year as a DM connecting through CAN on CZ, I was met at the plane by 2 CSAs and escorted to the lounge - which was not bad given the food and drinks available. If you don't have status, you are on your own - but ask for assistance on the plane as that is where the greatest number of English speakers are.
If you have SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus, you can use the VIP Check in lanes/area. Very nice and very accommodating. I have even brought colleagues with me who did not have the status, and they were treated with the same respect and courtesy.
In my experience, the FAs for both airlines speak some basic English and are attentive.
Seats in economy are tighter than in the US, with typically 6 across. Face it, the Chinese are generally smaller. BC seats are generally like domestic BC seats (2x2), although once on a CZ flight from PEK to CAN there were lie-flats. There are NO automatic upgrades in China.
Meals in BC are served on real plates and are quite good; in economy the selections are generally OK, but may be strange to the uninitiated.
If you are originating within China, arrive at the airport early. Seats are assigned during check in and it is early arrivals at the front (by class) - later gets the back of the plane. Do not be worried if you get a row in the upper 30s or low 40s - Economy starts at row 30.
In general, get to your gate early. If there is a jetway, boarding is a mob scene. If it is a bus gate, there may be a smaller bus with seats for BC and people with status. However, a recent flight to/from PEK on MU had everyone in a large standing bus.
Connecting in China is sometimes a pain, but one time last year as a DM connecting through CAN on CZ, I was met at the plane by 2 CSAs and escorted to the lounge - which was not bad given the food and drinks available. If you don't have status, you are on your own - but ask for assistance on the plane as that is where the greatest number of English speakers are.
Sep 11, 2015, 10:38 am
#11
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Lake Villa, IL
Posts: 79
I have flown both CZ and MU extensively throughout China. I prefer CZ to MU, but that is just me.
If you have SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus, you can use the VIP Check in lanes/area. Very nice and very accommodating. I have even brought colleagues with me who did not have the status, and they were treated with the same respect and courtesy.
In my experience, the FAs for both airlines speak some basic English and are attentive.
Seats in economy are tighter than in the US, with typically 6 across. Face it, the Chinese are generally smaller. BC seats are generally like domestic BC seats (2x2), although once on a CZ flight from PEK to CAN there were lie-flats. There are NO automatic upgrades in China.
Meals in BC are served on real plates and are quite good; in economy the selections are generally OK, but may be strange to the uninitiated.
If you are originating within China, arrive at the airport early. Seats are assigned during check in and it is early arrivals at the front (by class) - later gets the back of the plane. Do not be worried if you get a row in the upper 30s or low 40s - Economy starts at row 30.
In general, get to your gate early. If there is a jetway, boarding is a mob scene. If it is a bus gate, there may be a smaller bus with seats for BC and people with status. However, a recent flight to/from PEK on MU had everyone in a large standing bus.
Connecting in China is sometimes a pain, but one time last year as a DM connecting through CAN on CZ, I was met at the plane by 2 CSAs and escorted to the lounge - which was not bad given the food and drinks available. If you don't have status, you are on your own - but ask for assistance on the plane as that is where the greatest number of English speakers are.
If you have SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus, you can use the VIP Check in lanes/area. Very nice and very accommodating. I have even brought colleagues with me who did not have the status, and they were treated with the same respect and courtesy.
In my experience, the FAs for both airlines speak some basic English and are attentive.
Seats in economy are tighter than in the US, with typically 6 across. Face it, the Chinese are generally smaller. BC seats are generally like domestic BC seats (2x2), although once on a CZ flight from PEK to CAN there were lie-flats. There are NO automatic upgrades in China.
Meals in BC are served on real plates and are quite good; in economy the selections are generally OK, but may be strange to the uninitiated.
If you are originating within China, arrive at the airport early. Seats are assigned during check in and it is early arrivals at the front (by class) - later gets the back of the plane. Do not be worried if you get a row in the upper 30s or low 40s - Economy starts at row 30.
In general, get to your gate early. If there is a jetway, boarding is a mob scene. If it is a bus gate, there may be a smaller bus with seats for BC and people with status. However, a recent flight to/from PEK on MU had everyone in a large standing bus.
Connecting in China is sometimes a pain, but one time last year as a DM connecting through CAN on CZ, I was met at the plane by 2 CSAs and escorted to the lounge - which was not bad given the food and drinks available. If you don't have status, you are on your own - but ask for assistance on the plane as that is where the greatest number of English speakers are.
Thanks again to every one for their helpful insight.
Sep 11, 2015, 10:53 am
#12
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Parts Unknown
Posts: 10,053
We went ahead a pulled the trigger and booked the 2 BC tickets on China Southern, I am excited to be on the A380, and after reading the posts my wife has calmed her nerves lol... From what I can tell from the seat map we will be in F/C suites from LAX-CAN. We decided though to give us an extra day to get to Australia since we are catching a cruise, just in case there is any IROPS in CAN.
Thanks again to every one for their helpful insight.
Thanks again to every one for their helpful insight.
Feb 4, 2017, 4:30 pm
#14
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Feb 6, 2017, 10:42 pm
#15
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: Delta Skymiles - Platinum
Posts: 28
Ive flown both, CZ in economy is pretty nice if on the A380 or 773. Blankets are very thick and comfortable, meals are actually very good, its only beef or seafood for every meal on every flight but the variety of beef changes, like we had noodles one meal, beef tips another. Entertainment is decent with a lot of options. Crew tried their best to speak english and did a fairly good job and were friendly. Im flying them again in a few weeks! Flew MU in Business a couple months ago and i wouldn't do it again. The lounges in Shanghai look like a third world airport with minimal amenities. Food was not very good, and basic. Comforters and pillows were the only thing I liked. Crews did not speak english at all. Entertainment was average, seats were comfy though. If I had to choose between the two, I would fly China Southern. Guangzhou is a really nice airport too with and CZ has an amazing lounge there!