Sorry if this is old news, but I can't find a thread on it.

Have the upgrade windows changed? It used to be 2/4/6 days beforehand at 5 ET, but lately I've been seeing more adherence to the actual 24/72/144 hour windows.

Is this the case?

Nope, still 6/4/2. DL is holding back more upgrades than in the past with the goal of selling the seats, and inventory gets released within the windows, but when they open hasn't changed.

What, you are still seeing UG's?

AFAIK, nothing has changed except that they are fewer and fewer. This has been building for the past few years and it is now the exception that I see UG's at the early window. Much more often at the gate, especially when flying out of/to hubs.

Looks like our weekly "has the upgrade window changed" post.
If first class is very close to being sold out or if Delta has history of being able to sell last minute first class seats Or because of FCM, upgrades will go to the gate. I would get used to it.

My post was not to indicate a lack of upgrades, but when upgrades are available.

For example. As a GM, I have upgrades at T-72, if available. That has actually been explained here as 4 days prior, 5pm ET. If I log in and try to book a ticket within this window, I see "upgrade eligible." If I choose Y booking class, then I see "upgrade available."

My questions is why does this difference exist, when within the upgrade window?

It's FCM. Part of FCM is that they hold back upgrades on routes where they think they will sell a lot of last minute F seats. Sometimes that works for them and sometimes it doesn't. So, what they have been doing in some cases is upgrading people after their window opens. In fact, I was upgraded for yesterday's MSP-SEA flight Sunday afternoon just before it would have opened for Silvers. Another person on my flight had the same thing happen (fellow FTer on the same MR).

I've also had this happen within 24 hours of departure on flights where F was wide open and Y was full. I think what they try to do in this case is free up Y inventory to sell more Y seats. I've had this happen probably a little less than a dozen times and at least twice while on my way to the airport.

If it's FCM (and it very well might be) then DL IT has figured out a way to have upgrades available for full Y tickets, and restrict them for Medallions. This is certainly something I have not seen in the past -- and it might just be a new practice.

The thing is that in the past one was able to see if there was upgrade availability for Medallions by choosing a full Y ticket and doing a dummy booking. If this has changed, there really is no way to determine when upgrades might be available outside of the booking window (with the hope of booking something at T-4 and getting the upgrade the next day).

Thanks

I can't comment on the full Y ticket upgrade availability but I assume that a full Y fare will nearly always be cheaper than the discounted F fares that Delta offers within the "FCM window".

The website upgrade text does not actually align with the upgrade windows. The upgrade windows still open at 5PM Eastern Time 6/4/2 days before the flight. The website language does not change from Upgrade Eligible to Upgrade Available until some time the next day, closer to the published windows. Regardless of the language displayed, the window is indeed open.

I can see a reason for this - you wouldn't want to start showing Upgrade Available until all the upgrades have been processed at the window opening. The process takes time - often 15-30 minutes but sometimes hours. You wouldn't want to show Upgrade Available, have a PM buy a ticket on that belief, only to have all the available upgrades go to DMs when the computer gets around to processing them 20 minutes later.

No such thing as an "FCM Window"... First Class Monetization is the process of squeezing as much revenue as possible out of the FC cabin utilizing revenue management techniques that match supply and demand as closely as possible. FCM exists from the moment a flight opens for sale right up until the time the doors close.

Thanks javabytes -- this makes perfect sense, and shows why there is the discrepancy of availability when checking online during the window.

as a DM i very rarely get an upgrade 5 days out. when i do, it's usually on shorthaul routes that aren't so exciting anyway.

it's always been my assumption that UGs are gifted based on not just how many seats are available but on the projected sales up to the last possible second. why give away what you might still sell?

sad for me, sad for you, smart for them. :: sigh ::

It's in quotes for a reason. In the past, Delta held about 50% of it's FC cabin for Medallion upgrades. They don't do that any more on many flights so I think I'm being accurate when I say "FCM Window" as it relates to Medallion upgrades and FCM. Typically the discount F fares drop near the DM/PM window from what I've noticed.

I wonder though...Upgrades are basically the best & most valuable benefit of the loyalty programs. (Maybe it used to be "free tickets" but free ticket benefits have been diluted so much they barely exist now.)

It seems the airlines' goal is to gradually price First Class slightly and slightly lower until the magic threshold where the cabin is purchased to full occupancy, meaning eventually nobody gets upgraded. But then, if I can't get upgraded, why bother being a DM? How will this end?

Deep thoughts.

I noticed this as well and posted in either the FCM or Upgrade Success thread a few weeks ago. It does seems that javabytes's explanation is correct, as when I do get window UGs, they still seem to happen around 5pm ATL time 6 days out, or around 2-3am ATL time after that (it seems that is the time that additional RU inventory is released?)

I may be misunderstanding what you're saying, but I book many tickets 21+ days in advance, and many other tickets <5 days in advance. The last-minute tickets are of course more expensive in general, but the difference between a coach and first class ticket always seems to be anywhere from $100 to $300 depending on route, and this difference does not seem to change the closer in I book. And, even when only P fares are available in FC, they are still substantially cheaper than a full Y fare (and even a BM fare most of the time).

Could be route and schedule dependent, but IME, YBM fares are still a bit higher than discount first fares.

If DL is able to keep its planes full and sell out the F cabin to paying passengers, I can't exactly blame them. However, I also do not see UGs as the "best & most valuable benefit of the loyalty programs" - at least, not DL's.